You Are Too Dumb To Decide What To Eat

Originally posted by mnemeth1

The sale of raw milk in CA is verboten.

NEIN

You are too dumb to drink raw milk.

Huh?

That's not true.
Raw milk is sold legally in California.

California

Sales of raw milk and raw milk products are legal both in stores and on the farm.

In order for raw milk to be sold legally, it must be 'market milk. 'This is milk that meets the standards provided in the Milk and Milk Products Act of 1947.

realmilk.com

These guys just didn't have a valid permit.
That was a pretty "dumb" thing to ignore.

Originally posted by Stillalive
axaxaxax o my isnt that nice.
i just dont know what to say thanks obama

Yes thanks Obama for shutting down a food facility operating without a valid public health permit.

Not that he even has anything to do with this, and the whole raw-milk controversy involving possible dairy price fixing was going on during the George W.Bush administration.

Stop blaming Obama for everything, or at least know what you're talking about when you do.

Sometimes I wonder if we are too dumb to decide what really makes sense.

Originally posted by endisnighe
Got milk? Is the newest question to be asked by the police of the US.

Good one.

Raw Milk isn't technically illegal, though.

It is regulated differently State to State.

- Lee

Raw milk might be bad for you if you eat it from the cows (herbivores) who are fed animal byproducts as the majority of cattle and other livestock are today. E.coli is a prion disease (mutated protiens) and prion diseases are mostly caused by ingesting brain and spinal tissue but can be found in all parts of the body. Is it any wonder an herbivore might not be able to process a carnivorous diet well? Those poor animals are eating Soylent Green.

I use to drink raw milk every day when my best friend lived at her parents on a dairy farm in Nevada. It was amazing. Guess what!! I'm still alive and healthy!

reply to post by lee anoma


I will post this over and over again until it sinks in:

Here's the freaking law:
info.sen.ca.gov...

Specifies that raw milk and half-and-half can not have more than
10 coliform bacteria per milliliter.

Such stringent requirements are IMPOSSIBLE TO MEET

YOU CAN NOT GET A LEGAL LICENSE TO SELL RAW MILK IN CA

THAT IS THE LAW

Here's what an organic dairy farm had to say about it:
www.organicpastures.com...

The statement says that OPDC and Claravale have operated successfully in 2008 with AB 1735 in place. This is untrue. We have been degraded more than once and face degrades at this time, even though we are pathogen-free with very low SPC counts.

Contrary to the “clear” conclusion, AB 1735 has not kept harmful products off the shelves. In fact, Campylobacter was found for the first time this year in CA raw cream with “less than 10 coliforms” – under the new AB 1735 standard. SB 201 standards would have provided better protection. Low coliforms do not mean low pathogens.

Pathogen free means no pathogens, and SB 201 would have required this standard.

What you are referencing is OLD LAW.




[edit on 27-7-2010 by mnemeth1]

Originally posted by mnemeth1
I will post this over and over again until it sinks in:

Here's the freaking law:
info.sen.ca.gov...

Specifies that raw milk and half-and-half can not have more than
10 coliform bacteria per milliliter.

Such stringent requirements are IMPOSSIBLE TO MEET

YOU CAN NOT GET A LEGAL LICENSE TO SELL RAW MILK IN CA

THAT IS THE LAW

I see you found your Caps Lock Button, good for you!

So let me get this straight, no one is allowed to sell Raw Milk in California because the requirements are impossible to meet or it is illegal?

I know for a fact that it is NOT illegal so you can put that one to bed right there, and while the requirements have been difficult for many to meet there are plenty that still do. I am talking about 2010, by the way. Show me a law that says Raw Milk is "verboten" in California, please.

You still haven't shown me anything stating it is illegal in CA.

If you know otherwise you may want to call these folks up and tell them to take the Raw Milk off their shelves. I left their numbers but the link will give you the addresses too.

CALIFRONIA: RAW MILK IN STORES:

- Organic Pastures, www.organicpastures.com. Raw milk from pasture-fed cows is now available in health food stores throughout California. (559) 846-9732

- Claravale Dairy: www.claravaledairy.com or (831) 628-3219 for more information. Jersey milk, available raw and pasteurized.

• CREMA is an at-large chapter of Weston A. Price Foundation in California, and a membership organization of raw milk consumers, united to seek parity for raw milk in the milk market, through activism, legislation, and education.

• Apple Valley Ca Bountiful Harvest (760) 961-2558
• Apple Valley: Marys Raw Goats Milk, Mary Erstad, (760) 961-1290
• Atascadero: Rainbow Hill Farm - (805) 462-2932
• Bakersfield: Lassen's Natural Foods, 4308 California Ave, Bakersfield CA, 93309. Phone661) 324-6990.
• Bay Area: Real Food Bay Area 408 835 9353.
• Concord: Harvest House Harvest House Natural Food Store 888.655.0728
• Costa Mesa: Raw milk is available at Henry's Market on Harbor Blvd.
• Encinitas: Cindy Lu's Zoo, Cindy Brandenburg, (858) 395-7587
• Fairfax: Good Earth carries 415-454-0123, 415-456-3418, or fax 415-454-0482.
• Grenada: Copeland Family Farms, LLC
• Hanford: HHH Farms Kings HHH Dairy Goats, 6779 16th Ave, Hanford Ca 93230. Phone: (559) 273-7642.
• La Habra Heights: Heavenly Acre is located at 471 e Avocado Crest Rd, La Habra Heights, CA 90631. (714) 420-0291
• Lakeport: Yerba Santa Goat Dairy raw cheese from grass-fed goats (707) 263-8131.
• Lindsay: Three Sisters Farmstead Cheese, 24163 Road 188, Lindsay, CA 93247, (559)562-2132, fax (559)562-0911
• Paso Robles: Davis Organic Farm (805) 423-1153
• Philo: Organic Jersey cow shares available from Audarya's Micro-organic Creamery in Philo, California. They are a Hindu monastery at 22001 Panorama Way, Philo, CA 95466. (707) 272-0441
• Pinon Hills: Rainbow Ranch Farms, Xenia, (760) 868-6206
• Pleasanton: Valley Health Mill, 3037 Hopyard Rd, Ste J, Pleasanton CA 94588
• Point Reyes: Giacomini Family's Farmstead Cheese
• Poway (San Diego county): Urban Acres Farm, 12957
• Ramona: Lindy Haven Goats, 375 Sawday Rd., Ramona, CA 92065. Contact Linda J.Pannill-Smith, (760)788-1172
• Ramona: Organic Pastures Products (800)778-3515.
• Ramona: Ramona Family Naturals Now have a store in town.
• San Bernardino/Riverside County: Co-op (760) 868-5834.
• San Diego: Lindy Haven Goat Farm (760) 788-1172
• San Diego: Old Wagon Dairy (760) 749-3538
• San Jose: Evergreen Acres Petting Farm (408) 677-9557,
• Santa Barbara: Lazy Acres (805) 564-4410 (805) 564-3061
• Sonora Nature's Whole Food Depot 19073 Standard Rd Sonora, CA 95370 (209) 532-8878 Phone (209) 532-8874
• Southern California: Farmers Markets from a mobile truck
• Stockton: S-Mart Supermarket 951-7285.
• Tahoe/North Lake/Truckee and Eastern Nevada County Organic Pastures and McAfee farms (530) 582-5639
• Torrance: Arranging a buyer group for raw milk.
• Temecula: 41955 5th Street, Suite 101, Old Town 760-277-8575.
• Tustin: Claravale Farm pure Jersey milk - available raw and pasteurized.
• Watsonville: Claravale Dairy (831)-722-7779
• Winchester: Winchester Cheese Company (951) 926-4239, Fax: (951) 926-3349

Realmilk.com - Where to buy Raw Milk/California

Let me know what they tell you!



- Lee

reply to post by lee anoma


Do I really have to go through this again?

Didn't I just address this over the past 10 pages?

Did you not read the posts?

Must I repeat myself a thousand times?

Originally posted by MrSpad

Originally posted by Throwback
I think the point hes making is to stop overreacting to stories like these. Stop being so damned paranoid. Be rational. The government is not going to be deciding what you eat anytime in the near future. Also, our economy is based on consumer demand; therefore, if you want to see bad things disappear from store shelves, stop buying them! Simple as that.

If you want intelligent and rational you are in the wrong place.

Yes, Clearly all of the intelligent people are mingling on the anti raw milk forum.

Nothing just happens and its all a part of Obama, Bush, NWO or some other all powerful group that is slowing taking over the world with eathquake machines and by making unsafe milk illegal.

Yes. How silly. Clearly the FDA is not a powerful group that has taken over dictating what is legal or not legal to eat. Oh, uh well, I am CERTAIN that those behind Codex Alimintaius are not powerful and have no interest in telling THE ENTIRE WORLD that we must only eat their approved foods. Oh, uh. hmmm...Well at least that NWO crap is all bunk. LOL. Hey, maybe someone should tell this guy that the NWO order stuff is just made up online by a bunch of sillies... www.youtube.com...

Its all one big plot and they let us have the internet so we can all say whatever we want about it so they can get our names and put us in UN FEMA camps.

Yes! LOL. How preposterous to think that a government might keep tabs on anyone that has differing views! Like that would happen. LOL! FEMA Shmeema! Show me one time in history that a government has ever imprissoned or abused or taken advantage of the citizens. That could never happen. The government cares about us.

In this place no one thinks about anything they just rage about things and tie it all to Obama and the NWO. Its amazing really how some people selling milk that could harm a kid and get in trouble for it is quickly spun into Obama bashing, NWO plots and the revelation we are slaves

Yes. It is amazing how some people spin information. LOL.

Forget logic or facts just jump on and enjoy the ride. I comfort myself by telling myself most of these people are just having some fun posting crazy stuff and egging people on.

Yes, I also am comforted by the thought that some are just having fun posting crazy stuff. I sure hope that the people who are posting this crazy stuff, don't really think that they can decide for themselves what is safe to eat!!! I guess Some people just don't understand that they are not capable of deciding for themselves what is safe. I hope they wake up soon and realize that they need to be told by much smarter people what they can eat. Sheesh!

Originally posted by mnemeth1

What you are referencing is OLD LAW.

Your article is from July 25, 2010, correct?
Did you read the whole thing?

It is legal for licensed dairies to sell raw milk at retail outlets in California and 10 other states, according to research by the National Conference of State Legislatures. Twenty states allow people to buy unpasteurized milk directly from farms, or take part in a "cow sharing" program (in which a person buys part ownership of an animal and gets some of its milk).

But in the case of Rawesome, regulators allege that the group broke the law by failing to have the proper permits to sell food to the public. Latimes.com

*My edits

Again, it is not illegal.

It may be getting a lot of unfair scrutiny and hit with some tough standards that have forced some producers out of the market but that isn't the same as being illegal and it is on the shelves in the State of California.

These guys didn't have the proper permits and your own article proves my point.

- Lee

New cases of raw milk poisoning

There have now been at least seven outbreaks of illness, involving three different dangerous pathogens, tied to raw milk since January 2010. There have been outbreaks in Minnesota, Nevada, Utah (2), New York and Pennsylvania, as well as a single outbreak that included illnesses in Michigan, Indiana, and Illinois. Raw milk consumers have been sickened with E. coli O157:H7; Salmonella, and Campylobacter.
...
Another outbreak of Campylobacter was reported in February in Pennsylvania. State health officials there said approximately 10 people became ill after drinking raw milk from Pasture Maid Creamery. One of the ill developed Guillain - Barre Syndrome, and became paralyzed.

[edit on 27-7-2010 by buddhasystem]

reply to post by buddhasystem


Sure, do you want me to post a few of the tens of thousands of cases of pasteurized milk poisoning that occur every year?

How about sushi contamination?

How about breast milk contamination?

Of course, feeding a child raw breast milk is considered tantamount to negligent homicide by statists.

Originally posted by mnemeth1
How about breast milk contamination?

Of course, feeding a child raw breast milk is considered tantamount to negligent homicide by statists.

We fed raw breast milk to our kids, for many reasons -- it's more important that this product is raw, for the kids than it is for adults, and also it's not practical to pasteurize raw breast milk in the house -- if you ever had kids, you can easily imagine that.

Don't think in absolutes.

thank god for the us government there were some low life gang members pushing raw milk in my neighborhood too. it is sickening to me seeing them drive around in their flashy cars destroying my community by peddling their evil wares. let this be a warning to all of you milk dealers out there, prohibition works!!!!!

reply to post by mnemeth1


Look i'm all for people trading vegetables, fruits and honey but milk has a very rael and clear danger associated with it. I have drunk raw milk, still warm when i was visiting family in Ireland but i did this out of politeness. Pasteurisation was invented for a reason and it doesn't cause terrible harm to the milk. It's not like it's pumped with chemicals to pasteurise itm it's simply heated and cooled!Raw milk is a danger, the stuff you buy in stores labelled as raw has still been treated.


The same with meat. Now i eat a lot of wild caght meat, i even shoot a good portion myself. However meat is actually safer than raw milk because it is handled in a safe way even by small producers. Although of course some are sumbags and don't do this the majority do and are inspected.

Raw milk has no rael health benefits while offering some serious dangers.

Ok, whoa. First of all, E. Coli is NOT a prion disease! Whoever said that seriously has their wires crossed. E. Coli is a normal bacteria that everyone has in their intestinal tract. Prion disease=mad cow disease=death. We are all immune to our own E.coli, but when exposed to foreign e. coli will get sick, but we wont get Spongiform encephalopathic disease, which again, =death.

Next point....to the person attributing guillane barre syndrome to raw milk. Really? The only thing i have ever heard GBS linked to causatively, is vaccines. Sounds fishy to me. As an earlier poster pointed out, they often report that a lot of illness are due to consumption of raw milk, but in the end fail to find any conclusive evidence. Similar to that organic spinach scare two years ago, when all the organic spinach was being recalled, even though it turned out to be regular spinach which was the culprit, and that was never recalled.

There are so many factual and documented cases of the FDA abusing power, catering to big corporations, and pushing political agendas, their history is easy to see. Anyone who just wont take the time to look deserves to have their freedoms stipped away while they sleep. You only have freedom until you stop fighting for it. Codex has been attempting for a long time, to take away our rights to buy vitamins or supplements, has succeeded in several other countries (including germany), where now it cost $50 for 6 500mg vitamin C pills, and a bottle of echinacea cost 100. And all of a sudden we are seeing all these news stories of how vitamins cause cancer, are bad for you, reduce life expectancy. Get real.

This thread actually makes me glad I can't eat dairy products! I do have an interesting addition to this though, The Jungle, the book that started the FDA so to speak:

The Jungle On WikiSource

Read up, oh people of the world, and see why it is not that the government thinks you are too dumb to decide what to eat, but why the government thinks companies are too greedy not to cut corners on food safety!

Actually projectjimmy, i think its the FDA's greed that pushes most of its decisions. They have regularly been found to have many people on their board greatly invested in the drugs that they approve, often in opposition to their scientists recommendation. And they often take kickbacks and perks for their decisions on which products to ban. As i stated before, it seems you always see stories of them raiding small companies, or health food providers with guns drawn, destroying stock, forcing companies to reimburse all purchasers of the goods, just on basis of "rumors" that their product may be unhealthy, or not approved for the use stated. On the other hand, when a big pharma or agro producer is found guilty of causing damage, and even of covering up research that their product is dangerous, the FDA "requests" that they reconsider selling it. Why the double standards?? Im phrasing it as a question, but im pretty sure we already know the answer.

reply to post by lee anoma


You're wasting your time. Janky posted a phone number and the OP claimed it was lies. I posted a link to a raw milk suppliers certification and a list of stores in California where their product can be found and the OP ignored it completely. He's more interested in stars and flags than truth and can't admit he's wrong.

reply to post by CaptChaos


The Pottenger's experiment only shows the importance of taurine in feline diet. Those problems were not milk related.
Pasteurization of milk does not reduce it's nutritional value.


reply to post by buddhasystem


Raw human breast milk is different from any other raw milk. It contains all the needed nutrients and antibodies for a growing human baby. No diseases are transmitted through breast feeding. While the raw milk you got from someones farm and which hasn't been tested might contain something harmful and when your kid, whose immune system hasn't fully developed yet, drinks it might get very sick and/or die.


You people seem to think that the farmers are all good and will never ignore any health risks associated with raw milk. You think they only want you good and they don't really care about money.



Edit:
An interesting article:
news.bbc.co.uk...

[edit on 28/7/2010 by DGFenrir]

Ok, so you think the study just shows the need of cats for taurine. Taurine goes away when milk is pasteurized or meat is cooked? Hm.. Interesting. Honestly though, any farmer or vet can tell you this tidbit. Baby cows fed solely on pasteurized milk will die, whereas baby cows fed solely raw milk will thrive.

@mnemeth1,

I live in Socal organic pastures sells raw milk/butter/cream/cheese at the farmers market and other vendors have raw cheese. There are also many farms which have raw milk available, its definitely easily available if you want it.


@ImaginaryReality1984

Raw milk from healthy cows is a lot safer then pasteurized milk as it contains lactic bacteria which protect the milk from pathogens. Heating milk most definitely degrades quality, its kills all beneficial bacteria, deactivates enzymes, degrades heat sensitive vitamins, oxidizes cholesterol, possibly denatures proteins and creates AGEs.

I cant believe people ATS fear monger so hardcore about something they know so little about. I've bought tons of raw milk from Rawesome, Organic pastures etc. and have never had a problem, I have also educated myself with all the info and accessed all the risks(theirs none for the most part). Unless you have some personal experience where raw milk made you sick your opinions mean jack #

ok, I give up.

not one person here can read english.

none