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Oliver Stone: Jewish control of the media is preventing free Holocaust debate

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posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 01:27 AM
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Excuse me, I have to leave now, Slayer. I'm being called a liberal with an agenda in another thread again. I guess you win.


[edit on 7/27/2010 by ~Lucidity]




posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 01:30 AM
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I guess then - in that case - that in places where the 'Jewish Lobby' does not have such influence on the media - for instance Europe - the Holocaust debate should be much 'freer' over there.

It's just a logical assumption drawn from the statement.

I'm not an expert on the subject myself, but my colleague over at the Department of Social Studies (I work at a University) informs me that he can in no way say how or why the Holocaust debate should be any more unrestrained here (in Europe) than in the US.

By the way anti-semitic rant gets filtered out in the mainstream media here as well,



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 01:40 AM
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reply to post by Gorman91
 


Red cross confirmed 300 000 death. Most of them not by gas or bullets, but due to crowded quarters.

In russia 22 000 000 confirmed death under a leadership majorily jewish.

That is Where hypocrisy is. Bending history for pr purpose.

Good read on the subject: Israel lobby and the foreign policy of United states.



[edit on 27-7-2010 by gagol]



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 01:42 AM
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i can understand why the jewish lobby as you put it, is freaking out. it's a self-perservation thing. history has proven that with enough propaganda, anyone can be deprived of their lives with the approval of the rest of society. we here at ATS are all very aware of this. and the jewish lobby is just being hyper vigilant, cause that's how the holocaust in germany started.

first they were blamed for the financial situation (imagine blaming a farmer in the hills of north dakota, for the financial disaster on wall street). then they were blamed for the decline in moral sensibilities. imagine blaming a little old poverty stricken widow lady, who lives in an one bedroom apartment that she's responsible for the moral decline of the german population. you get the idea. generalizations and non-specifics, targetting entire groups of people based on race, religion, gender or bank account size, is super dangerous and easily abused.



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 01:43 AM
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reply to post by gagol
 


That's nice about the red cross, but as shown in so many films about it, the Germans notoriously lied to the red cross.

reply to post by undo
 


Funny. Last I checked the Jews are being blamed for the financial crisis and moral breakdown of society. Oh how fun it is to watch history repeat itself.

FYI, we are right around after the Panic of 1907 right now. If we continue to accelerate along down this path, in a few years will be another great depression, and a third world war. Oh lovely.

[edit on 27-7-2010 by Gorman91]



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 01:52 AM
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reply to post by Gorman91
 


I trust books over movies, they are notoriously historically innacurate and under the influence of pentagon (see Operation Hollywood).



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 01:53 AM
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reply to post by Gorman91
 


honestly, i'm surprised the people here at ATS don't recognize it for what it is. cause they've seen it in use against the iraqis. i'm not saying there aren't bad jewish people nor am i saying there aren't people in power in the jewish community who are corrupt, but the people in the jewish lobby are just living up to the statement, NEVER AGAIN. i don't blame them, and i feel the same way about the 15 million dead christians and whoever else died under stalin, hitler, pol pot, mao and etc, including jewish people, gypsies and gay people. none of these people needed to die. it's just plain evil.

[edit on 27-7-2010 by undo]



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:01 AM
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reply to post by gagol
 


Because books can't be controlled....

It's pretty simple. Germany lied. That's also how they managed to get away with so much.



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:04 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


I've made my amends with God. I've done my part to try and prevent history from repeating. It's out of my hands now. Let history repeat itself. It will just let us be able to say "see, told ya so 30 years ago".

I've longed since stopped caring. I put in my 2 cents every here and there, like this thread. But as far as I can see, it's the 20th century all over again. I can see the patterns and I'll use them to get places and money so that maybe later in life I can stop it from starting all over again. At this point though, it's locked in. Humanity has chosen to repeat the last 100 years rather than better them.

Grab some popcorn and a drink. It's going to be a fun show.



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:05 AM
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reply to post by Gorman91
 


saddam and hitler are probably on a tropical island somewhere, sipping little frozen daiquiris with pink umbrellas.

[edit on 27-7-2010 by undo]



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:10 AM
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reply to post by Gorman91
 


sadly, it won't matter if you're right in 30 years. saying "i told ya so" won't help. it won 't bring back the dead. it won't ease the suffering. in fact, i could sit here for the next 2 hours, citing example after example in which an issue was brought up for vote, was argued that it'd be slippery slope, was told in no uncertain terms that it wasn't a slippery slope and people were just over reacting, only to have these things not just be slippery slopes, but landslides

wouldn't help a bit. the deeds are done. and we live with the consequences.



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:12 AM
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Holy crap. Sounds to me like Mr Stone is going to blow the whistle big time.


I can't wait for the next movie of his to come out.



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:14 AM
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I have no doubt that the holocaust and its many atrocities happened. Why is this? It is because of a group of people known as Jehovah's Witnesses.

While Hitler manuvered himself into power he understood the need to get religion to back him. And he did get the Catholic Church, and the Protestant Churches behind him. In Hitler and the Pope signed a concordat and the Pope cliamed that Hitler was the one God would use to usher in the thousand year reign of Christ. The Churches were eagerly chiding their followers to join the Nazi regime for God and country. Jehovah's Witnesses stood out as very different from the other so-called Christian groups for they united opposed the moves of Hitler. Not because they were revolutionaries, simply because they could not agree that Hitler was the Furher, they believed that Jesus was their leader, and that their worship went to God not to the state.

Because of their neutral stance Hitler declared he would extermiate Jehovah's Witnesses in Germany and his SS declared war on them very earlier in the 1930's. In fact pre-war the Jehovah's Witnesses were the largest population of people in the concentration camps behind the Jews.

And while the world remained silent as well as the Churches as to what was happening in Germnay, Jehovah's Witnesses through their printing presses were spreading millions of books and magazines and tracts around the world in many languages about the atrocities happening in the Nazi regime. They spoke out against the atrocities against the Jews and other groups and pointed out Hitler as an evil spokesman for Satan the Devil.

They smuggled out very detailed information about the camps and published them, as well as details of names of leaders of the camps, and names of people being persecuted as well as the methods of the torture. The Gestapo could not understand how a small group of people could put up such harsh resistance.



And what was unique about the Jehovah's Witnesses is that they were the only group of people in the camps that were given a "get out of jail free" card as it were. All they needed to do was sign a piece of paper rejected Jehovah as God and declaring that Hitler was their Furher. The majority kept their integrity. And many died rather than reject their faith in Jesus.

The Holocaust was very real. Many thousands of Jehovah's Witnesses died at the hands of the Nazi regime in many European nations where Hitler invaded. But unlike the Churches who remained silent, they spoke out in unison, they stood firm in the midst of great persecution.

Very few people like to talk about the role that the Jehovah's Witnesses had to play in that drama, but if you ever go to the Holocaust Memorial Mueum you would do well to visit the section on them.

They have information printed before WWII started and all throughout the war to verify the holocaust was very real. Their documents will always prove that it did indeed happen.

Why did the Churches remain silent while the Jehovah's Witnesses spoke out? Because baptized Roman Catholics, Protestants and Eastern Orthodox members were implicitly involved in the murder of the millions of Jews, and that bloodshed occurred in the heart of their members.

An interesting quote from a Protestant minister named T. Broppacher: “While men who call themselves Christians have failed in the decisive tests, these unknown witnesses of Jehovah, as Christian martyrs, are maintaining unshakable opposition against coercion of conscience and heathen idolatry. The future historian must some day acknowledge that not the great churches, but these slandered and scoffed-at people, were the ones who stood up first against the rage of the Nazi demon . . . They refuse the worship of Hitler and the Swastika.” - Consolation 1939.

I will add another post adding some very in detail information if anyone would like to verify the above.



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:17 AM
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reply to post by David_Reale
 


that should scare you. seeing as how he's jewish himself. what would provoke a man to do something like that, knowing how sensitive the issue is, and realizing the negative consequences it could have on other jews?

the big guys like that, think they are invincible. he'll just go somewhere safe while the rest of the planet implodes



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:22 AM
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reply to post by Calender
 


oh no you don't. as a christian, i would not deny christ. i've already went to my death bed and refused to deny christ, even while basically insane with infection in my brain. so don't give me that, OTHER CHRISTIANS were hitler's buddies. oh no no no. not on my watch.

[edit on 27-7-2010 by undo]



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:26 AM
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Many dont understand why so many Leftists (like Oliver Stone) have been lashing out at Jews in the last decade. Its because Leftists cant stand people who are more successful than them. The motivation here is similar to Hitlers. German inferiority complex of Pre-WWII is no different than the current inferiority complex of the American "Liberal".

By the way: If this is being "suppressed" as so many here say why are there thousands of Holocaust-Denial threads on ATS?



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:38 AM
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reply to post by lucid eyes
 


yep, nothing is ever simple. it's a very complex world we live in. clearly mr. stone is not thinking it all the way threw. it won't have immediate consequences, but this is how propaganda works. one convert at a time.



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:47 AM
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Information exposing the Holocaust as it occurred, and not only afterward, when the majority of mankind really even became aware of what was going on.

In the 1929 German edition of the Golden Age the statement was made: “National Socialism is . . . a movement that is acting . . . directly in the service of man’s enemy, the Devil.”

The Golden Age January 4, 1933 on the eve of Hitler's taking power published the following:

“There looms forth the menacing promontory of the National Socialist movement. It seems incredulous that a political party so insignificant in its origin, so heterodox in its policies, can, in the space of a few years, develop into proportions that overshadow the structure of a national government. Yet Adolf Hitler and his national socialist party (the Nazis) have accomplished this rare feat.”

Hitler immediately raids the branch offices of Jehovah's Witnesses in Germany after taking power. They broke of Jehovah's Witness meetings, started dismissing them from their jobs of employment and arresting them.

On November 1, 1933 The Watchtower stood its ground against the Nazi assault and published the article entitled "Fear Them Not" exhorting the Christian brothers in Germany to maintain their integrity.

On February 9, 1934 J. F. Rutherford President of the Watch Tower Society the legal entity that represents Jehovah's Witnesses in the United States wrote a letter to Hitler as follows:

“You may successfully resist any and all men, but you cannot successfully resist Jehovah God. . . . In the name of Jehovah God and His anointed King, Christ Jesus, I demand that you give order to all officials and servants of your government that Jehovah’s witnesses in Germany be permitted to peaceably assemble and without hindrance worship God."

The Nazi responded to this letter by stepped up abuses sending many Jehovah's Witnesses to concentration camps recently set up.

On October 7, 1934 all congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses in Germany gathered and ratified a letter sent to the officials of Hitler's government as follows:

“There is a direct conflict between your law and God’s law . . . Therefore this is to advise you that at any cost we will obey God’s commandments, will meet together for the study of His Word, and will worship and serve Him as He has commanded.”

Jehovah's Witnesses in 49 other countries of the world on the same date of October 7, 1934 gathered in special assembly and sent the following telegram to Hitler:

“Your ill-treatment of Jehovah’s witnesses shocks all good people of earth and dishonors God’s name. Refrain from further persecuting Jehovah’s witnesses; otherwise God will destroy you and your national party.”

After receiving these letters Hitler screamed: “This brood will be exterminated in Germany!”

In 1935, the Golden Age revealed the inquistionlike torture methods of of the Nazi and their spies. It also revealed to the world that it was the aim of the Hitler Youth program to purge Germany's belief in God. The Gestapo nationwide arrested thousands of Jehovah's Witnesses as a response.

On December 12, 1936 Jehovah's Witnesses responded with a campaign that blanketed the country of Germany with tens of thousands of copies of a resolution that protested Hitler's persecution.

Those Jehovah's Witnesses still free distributed another message on June 20, 1937 that was unsparing in naming officials, citing dates and places and methods of persecution. The Gestapo was appalled at the organization of this "brood."

The booklet Face The Facts was published in 1938 to warn the people of Germany of Hitler and stated:

“We recognize the totalitarian government . . . as the product of Satan brought forth as the substitute for God’s kingdom.” Jehovah’s Witnesses were among the first targets of Nazi abuse, but they also loudly decried atrocities against Jews, Poles, the handicapped, and others.

cont...



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:47 AM
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The resolution Warning! adopted in 1938 at a convention of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Seattle, Washington said:
“The Fascists and Nazis, radical political organizations, have wrongfully seized control of many countries of Europe . . . All the people will be regimented, all their liberties taken away, and all will be compelled to yield to the rule of an arbitrary dictator and then the ancient Inquisition will be fully revived.”

Rutherford regularly took to the radio waves to deliver powerful lectures on the satanic nature of Nazism. Those lectures were rebroadcast globally and were printed for distribution by the millions.

On October 2, 1938 Rutherford delivered a discourse entitled “Fascism or Freedom” and strongly denounced Hitler.

“In Germany the common people are peace-loving,” Rutherford proclaimed. “The Devil has put his representative Hitler in control, a man who is of unsound mind, cruel, malicious and ruthless . . . He cruelly persecutes the Jews because they were once Jehovah’s covenant people and bore the name of Jehovah, and because Christ Jesus was a Jew.”

On May 15, 1940 Consolation stated: “Hitler is such a perfect child of the Devil that these speeches and decisions flow through him like water through a well-built sewer.”

Although most people were largely unaware of the existence of the concentration camps until after the war descriptions were written Jehovah’s Witness publications in the 1930’s.

In 1937 Consolation talked of experiments with poison gas at Dachau. By 1940 the Jehovah’s Witnesses had published the names of over 20 different camps and exposed their unspeakable conditions.

Jehovah’s Witnesses were familiar with them because they were among the first in the camps. A German historian Detlef Garbe estimated that the witnesses made up 5 to 10 percent of camp population. Garbe stated: : “Of the 25,000 persons who admitted to being Jehovah’s Witnesses at the beginning of the Third Reich, about 10,000 were imprisoned for any length of time. Of these, over 2,000 were admitted to concentration camps. This means that the Jehovah’s Witnesses were, with the exception of the Jews, the worst persecuted by the SS of all the religious based groups.”

In 1940 Consolation stated: “There were 3,500,000 Jews in Poland when Germany began its Blitzkrieg . . . , and if reports which reach the Western world are correct their destruction seems well under way.”

In 1943, Consolation noted: “Whole nations like the Greeks, Poles and Serbs are being exterminated systematically.” By 1946, The Golden Age and Consolation[i/] had identified 60 different prison and concentration camps.
The names Auschwitz, Buchenwald, Dachau, and Sachsenhausen were familiar names with the readers of publications of the Jehovah’s Witnesses before the War ended. The reports smuggeled out of the camps at great peril exposed the murderous intent of the Third Reich.

In 1933 the Golden Age carried the first of the many reports of the reality of these concentration camps. And in 1938 the book Crusade Against Christianity was published in French, German, and Polish. Within it was carefully documented the cruel and vicious assult on the Witnesses by the Nazi and included diagrams of Sachsenhausen and Esterwegen concentration camps.

The nobel prize winning Dr. Thomas Man wrote: : “I have read your book and its terrible documentation with deepest emotion. I cannot describe the mixed feeling of abhorrence and loathing which has filled my heart while perusing these records of human degradation and abominable cruelty. . . . To keep quiet would serve only the moral indifference of the world . . . You have done your duty in publishing this book and bringing these facts to light.”



posted on Jul, 27 2010 @ 02:50 AM
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The niece of former president France Charles de Gaulle, Geneviève de Gaulle was captured and put in Ravensbruk concentration camp and met Jehovah’s Witnesses there. As she lectured throughout Switzerland she often spoke of them. In an interview on May 20, 1994 she said:

“They were among the first deportees in the camp. Many had already died . . . We recognized them by their distinctive badge. . . . It was absolutely forbidden for them to talk about their beliefs or to have any religious books, and especially the Bible, which was considered the supreme book of sedition. . . . I know of [one of Jehovah’s Witnesses], and there were others I was told, who was executed for having a few pages of Bible texts. . . .
“What I admired a lot in them was that they could have left at any time just by signing a renunciation of their faith. Ultimately, these women, who appeared to be so weak and worn out, were stronger than the SS, who had power and all the means at their disposal. [Jehovah’s Witnesses] had their strength, and it was their willpower that no one could beat.”




And finally Jehovah's Witnesses right after the war wrote their prediction that their would come people that would try to deny the existence of the Holocaust. In September 26, 1945 the Consolation noted that people would try to revise history and deny what had happened. In the article "Has Nazism Been Destroyed" it said:

“Propagandists think the people have short memories. It is their intention to erase past history, presenting themselves in the modern disguise of benefactors, their incriminating record being covered up...Until Jehovah does fight Armageddon, Nazism will continue to raise its ugly head.”



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