Arizona Citizen Militia responds to Zetas commanders' death threats

reply to post by daskakik

Very good to find that. I will read the whole article in a minute.

This is not really like Race Baiting, it's more like MiLITIA BAITING.

If the Zetas purposely spread this false info then it's counterproductive to their cause - it would bring out every hungry patriot in AZ/USA against them.

Either this is bait or the Zetas are stupid as hell. I think the former.

ETA - Ah, just figured it out? The article was planted by the Militia? They need new members? It's possible.




[edit on 21-7-2010 by FearNoEvil]

Originally posted by The Sword
Here's what I don't get:

Some of you are blaming what you call a "do-nothing" president and yet you are refusing to acknowledge that there are U.S military units near the Mexican border?

Perhaps it's best to step back and let the military take care of these fools?

Wow. If the military could just saddle up and haul ass to the border without the approval of our "do-nothing" president-Commander in Chief, this problem would have already been solved. Iraq and Afganistan would be history too.
Who do you think lets the military loose?

Originally posted by martian1234
reply to post by DerekJR321

 

But isn't that what the US does to other countries? Vietnam, Iraq
It ok to do it it to other countries but no country should do it to us, sounds like a double standard sir

I'm only quoting you because you were last to mention it...

"But Americans invade other countries all the time..."

Honestly, that is a lame argument in MY opinion. Britain had provinces all over the world, and was the worst offender... or england? same to me, I'm gonna act like a European bigot... Americans are a product of invasion. Australia is also a product of invasion... Why did Rome fall? Where did Greece go? As a matter of fact, a majority of the modern Americas are a product of invasion. Can't call us hypocrites without being one yourself, historically speaking.

Please stop using that argument. It's not an argument, but rather pointing out a major flaw in every human civilization since the awareness of greed.

In every instance in history, the native populace has tried to fight off invaders. What's so different now? And about "being fair", what the F?!? You wanna go throw stones at them and yell to go home? You'd probably get a severe beating before getting drug off the road and getting an AK to the face. It's not a joke, or a movie. Suddenly we DO have a war zone on American soil, and it's been festering for a long time, unchecked. Now we have to do something about it, and unfortunately it has come past the point of just asking nicely to stay out, or even using threats. Jail is nothing but training grounds for gangs. It's brutal, but it's the truth. Zetas aren't thugs, or gang members. It's not as easy. They should be treated just as we treat (I hate to use the word) "terrorists".

I've heard LEGAL Mexicans (green cards, not born) griping about all this. For some of you who aren't grasping this situation well enough, just ask around. I actually know a couple Mexicans who are (and admit to being) flat out racist against other Mexicans. It's not just the "whites" who want this situation resolved, it's also blacks, asians, indians, basically alot of Americans that aren't white who are in the same boat. This is a war zone, and the fire needs put out. If the militias are having to step up because our own military won't, that tells us that the situation is probably a lot worse than we can imagine. These people in S. Arizona are terrified. Why SHOULDN'T they protect themselves, and take the offer of help from militia? If they could take care of it themselves, we wouldn't even be having this discussion, but this isn't something that can be taken care of in the court of law. Gotta take action, guns against guns and drugs.

Oh yeah... one last thing... WHO IN THE WORLD IS GONNA RUN INTO THE WAR ZONE TO GRAB A GUN OFF A CORPSE?!? I mean, besides an idiot who probably plays too much Halo and assumes that is what happens. I mean, REALLY... you pick off a cartel member at 450 yards at 3am with GenIII Night vision and you're gonna go run out there and loot his corpse?!? RS, you are either ignorant or insane in your thoughts.

Originally posted by RussianScientists
Americans hunting other people with high powered rifles from long distance with night vision scopes is a cowards way of life.

Yeah it's braver to gun down 17 men and women at a party in a surprise attack.

Or maybe just have people hold you while one man shoots you in the head and dumps your body down a deep cave.
25+ by last count.

Seriously...the drug cartel are not only cowards, but bloodthirsty savage animals.

- Lee

Let's think back about a year ago, when Arizona just had a border problem. The Geniuses in Arizona, had a scheme where they could create a controversy, throw out a bunch of Latin voters who more often vote for Democratic candidates, and get a lot of support from the reliable, threatened "American Patriot."

NOW, they've got death threats and "HammerDown" weekend warriors with makeshift armored vehicles.

You know what would be a LOT EASIER and less deadly? Pushing to throw in jail the executives of companies that HIRE illegal aliens.


But of course, you don't get to shoot people and have kewl code names. And fight all those Public Works projects while you are at it, so that more money can be spared for Corporations to hire people -- which they won't because you and the people crossing the border are fighting over jobs picking strawberries and washing toilets and THAT isn't leaving any money to create a market.

So until people have MONEY and better paying jobs -- well, we can always occupy ourselves by creating tensions between poor ethnic groups.


>> I expect many more death threats as people like HammerDown create more fear and anxiety so that they can get death threats that they must respond to with more fear and anxiety. This is EXACTLY how things fall apart. But American's had more home-grown production in the last Great Depression and I don't think we were this stupid.

Anyone who buys any of this should come see me I have a bridge to sell you. Also anyone who really wants to stop illegal immigration would create a law people that hire them that has an automatic 30 years for every illegal found to be employed by them. Of course that will never happen because that would mean rich white men going to jail and we can not have that. Right now we say don't come.... but if you make it we have lots of good paying jobs for you. The law in Arizona will fix nothing and panders to idiots who think that illegals will ever stop coming when we reward them with jobs for doing so. Take away the jobs and they will not come. We will end up paying alot more for food and stuff but that seems to be what people want. Untill of course people start complaining about the high cost of food and now want to go back to the old ways.

Originally posted by blamethegreys
[RANT]

Has it been too many generations since your safe way of life was threatened?!

There are many posts here against the militia actions, and I assume that many posters are not US citizens. Has it really been so long? Has history been so whitewashed and watered down that you haven't any grasp of what a classic threat to your border even means?

Fact: Sovereign American lands are invaded daily by paramilitaries carrying military grade weapons.
Fact: American citizens found by said paramilitaries in borderlands are executed, armed and unarmed alike. No quarter given.

Do you have some documented examples of incidents such as these?

I mean specifically US citizens executed by foreign paramilitaries in U.S. territories as a result of military actions.

Fact: These paramilitaries are bringing mountains of drugs across the border. Drugs destroy our society through violence, addiction, theft, murder, costs to hospitals and court systems.
Fact: Our federal and state governments have not done anything to control the problem, which is why these paramilitaries have become so brazen and defiant.

It may be insufficient, but the number of people in US Federal and State prisons seems to belie this, as well as the enormous increase in the DHS budget over the last few years. The federal and state governments certainly have tried to do "something" to control the problem.

Originally posted by lee anoma

Originally posted by RussianScientists
Americans hunting other people with high powered rifles from long distance with night vision scopes is a cowards way of life.

Yeah it's braver to gun down 17 men and women at a party in a surprise attack.

Or maybe just have people hold you while one man shoots you in the head and dumps your body down a deep cave.
25+ by last count.

Seriously...the drug cartel are not only cowards, but bloodthirsty savage animals.

- Lee

Reminds me so much of how the "Al Qaeda in Iraq would just cut off your head as soon as look at you -- of course we need to come down hard."


>> Nothing is so deadly as the delusions of people who want to rationalize their desire to kill people not like them. Why, I remember just the other week when 50 people were gutted like fish in broad daylight in the Mini Mall by my job. OK, no that was in Mexico.

The Drug Cartels in Mexico are no joke. But they are entirely fueled BY OUR DRUG PROHIBITION. Karl Rove flew down to Mexico during their last election and got lots of help from our government, making sure a pro-corporate Presidente kept any pro-worker Presidente's from getting the job.

There were three months of riots in the South of Mexico protesting the rigged election.

25 families run everything and it is corrupt.


Mexico is exactly where our "free market" corporate controlled government is headed.


>> So anyway -- we GET that the drug cartel's are BAD. But what the high powered rifle guy putting holes in heads at night on the border doesn't realize -- is that Al Qaeda was not in Iraq until after we invaded, and the poor schmucks crossing the border are doing some menial job to feed a family. The Drug Cartel Killer is driving across because he is borrowing someone's legitimate papers for the trip -- and he is only coming to America because WE CREATED the environment.


Decriminalize drugs and the Drug Cartel's and the funding for CIA black ops dries up.




But seriously -- these morons are just going to create a war zone by shooting innocent people in the head whose only crime is trying to have a better life. If you and your family were starving -- you'd be sneaking into Canada.

reply to post by JacKatMtn


I dont know how this is the presidents fault? No president can make everyone happy, and the republicans seem like the treasonous ones to me these days. The president is sending all sorts of national Gaurd to AZ to help secure our borders. Did Bush ever do that? Do people think this is a new problem? I dont think the law is right to check ID of our CITZENS not doing anything wrong, but if they see you coming over the border or from an area where there is people coming in... of coarse check if they are legit.....ITS CALLED COMMON SENSE... I just hate how everything gets blamed on OUR president. When Bush was in there (the bumbling fool that he was) he was still MY president. Doesnt mean you have to support what they do...thats what makes this AMERICA. Have some respect for your country and join the militia if you have to, but although our politics are corrupt as hell, try Saudi Arabi or Lebanon otr Cuba out for your home country. Mexico for that matter...and see if you arent trying to get over here yourself. The honest people trying to come to America are not the problem, thats what America was built on. We are the melting pot, but dont leave the world to one man, take control and regulate it for ourselves. President doesnt mean anything anymore, its all corporate controlled no matter what party. What would Palin be doing in the white house right now, lol. I mean seriously, Republican, Democrat, all these political issues are only meant to divide our country further. If you see illegal activity call an authority, or document it and do something bout it. But stop blaming one dude. Seriously.

reply to post by mbkennel


I would also like to see examples of the militia doing something other than pretending to play call of duty in real life

reply to post by 52Reasons


bush built a BS fence (safe fence act 2006). i can't explain how mad "miss me yet?" makes me.

glad to see people still supporting the temporary/expensive solution of "kill em all" rather than real legislation and enforcement.

not.


oh, and can I see a source that isn't just the same article reiterated on someone's blog?

or is this just more right wing lies?

reply to post by mbkennel


Fact: Sovereign American lands are invaded daily by paramilitaries carrying military grade weapons.
Fact: American citizens found by said paramilitaries in borderlands are executed, armed and unarmed alike. No quarter given


Wow. Just wow. These people make this stuff up, and then other's repeat it. Eventually you hear every other reactionary saying; "and those Hippies were spitting on troops" -- or "Burn the Witch!" Fact: "Witches worship Satan and will eat out your babies heart." Sure, all baby eating Satin-worshipin' Witches do that. Are there any at the Quickie Mart? No. Then this is a bit over the top to start burning Witches to prevent the Baby Eating isn't it?

If you make up enough nonsense like this -- eventually it becomes true. Undoubtedly, after enough Mexicans have been victimized by deluded and hysterical race baiters and of course the Spanish Inquisition.

I'm a white guy -- and I know that the Rich Guys want to stay rich. They don't really care that I'm white and another guy is black, or Arab -- or whatever. But when times get tough -- it's a lot better for a guy like me to blame someone NOT RICH for my plight.

While we were all crying for the taxes Rich people had to pay, and for lower import tariffs to give the Company a competitive advantage -- they moved jobs and manufacturing to cheap labor countries, and set up offshore bank accounts. Did we chase the money away or does "the money" just go where the profit is and doesn't care about "giving back"? If you don't realize the latter option is they way the world works -- you too could be surprised like Allen Greenspan that "Wall Street was Greedy."

These people who woke up and found their White Privilege being denied them are very angry. They worry that they aren't smart, sexy, and worthy -- so they flock to anyone who tells them they are smart, sexy and worthy -- and devotion and faith in those people absolve them of all Guilt.

Yeah, once GOD commands these people who make up stories about the Mexican threat to go to war -- all bets are off.


>> I predict that crime will increase in Arizona. Why? Because disenfranchised Latin Americans will stop calling the cops because they are more afraid of the police than the criminals. Arizona has found a very effective recipe to create a failed state out of an otherwise merely piss-poorly run state.

reply to post by VitriolAndAngst

you make very excellent points but I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss lee's claim that the cartel is dangerous. I hate mentioning this but two of my uncles (on my mexican side, of course) have been murdered (one was kidnapped, we haven't seen him in a year and we've given up hope). I'm not here to lie or exaggerate this, these people don't give a goddamn about anything but the money.

I just ask that you please take them seriously, is all.

reply to post by The Sword


The military is not there to wipe the floor with anyone. They are specifically forbidden from engagement of any suspected illegal immigrants and must inform the Border Patrol whose job it will be to apprehend if they so see fit.

so your saying that the military forces that are there, are acting in a "security officer" capacity? as in 'observe and report' and nothing else?!


and AMERICAN PEOPLE dont see this, as a problem, if true?

that's exactly why i believe anyone with even an ounce of balls remaining, should be organized and defend your countrymen/state.

Originally posted by piddles
reply to post by mbkennel

 

I would also like to see examples of the militia doing something other than pretending to play call of duty in real life

LOL


Yeah, so much of this nonsense would be great for laughs -- but enough yahoos parading around in military outfits while desperate immigrants die in the desert in trailer trucks,... eventually, it's going to be ugly. Eventually SOMETHING will rationalize their fears beyond the BS spewed every moment of the day by Corporate Jesus Inc. Radio and TV.


I understand the fear of these people and that they sense things are out of control -- but they ALWAYS look at the symptoms and not the cause of the problems. Every one of them is probably against minimum wage and welfare -- yet THOSE are the only things that FORCE companies to hire skilled labor. Paying people for nothing COMPETES with crappy jobs.

If minimum wage kept up with inflation -- it would be about $15 an hour right now -- that's kind of the BASE for a person to raise a family. Couple that with sensible tariffs on imported goods to PRESERVE JOBS, and ENFORCEMENT against illegal employers (and IGNORE illegal workers) and we wouldn't have these problems.


But know, the people who feel like they have no control, buy some guns and play Call-of-Duty in the Arizona woods threatening people without money and power as if that would solve anything. I don't care WHAT the problem is; The POOR are not in control and NOT causing the problem -- there are always people who make bad choices or had bad families -- there probably always will be -- but the DIFFERENCE between Sweden and Mexico is that the person on the Lowest Rung in Sweden is about as well off as the Middle Class person in America. The Poor in America are about as well off as the Middle Class in Mexico.

Do you get it? Mexico is wealthier as a nation than most any Northern European country. There are very few countries that have NO safety net that have a good standard of living and upward mobility.

We need to raise the bar folks. There is no "austerity plan" that will rebuild our economy -- it's not the stone age anymore. You can't have 100 people who eat compete with one person with a Bulldozer -- technology is cheaper than people because it eats less.

I'm NOT For illegal immigration. Because it competes with labor in this country and makes jobs lower paying. What our problems really come from is the disparity between the wealthy and the poor and that gap has tripled in the last 30 years. When MONEY makes MONEY on MONEY -- and Workers barely squeak by -- well, then things start going down the tubes -every time.

You can't say ignorant things like; "It doesn't matter what the board of directors chooses to compensate useful Executives with -- the Stock Holders control them." You are part of the problem. Because 95% of the Stock is held by rich people and large Funds which are CONTROLLED by other rich people. You may have a few stocks in your portfolio, but a 401k and Mutual fund are managed accounts -- if you've voted 3 times on a stock, that's more than 99% of the country but a fraction of what influence the top 1% have. Unless you have more money invested than you owe (and that includes your mortgage and leased car) -- then you are NOT a CAPITALIST -- you don't even know what the term means most likely.

You are a debtor and a Citizen but about 90 of us are NOT Capitalists -- and never will be. I've got some stock, a 401k and 65% of my house paid off without one car lease -- and I'm NOT YET a Capitalist. I cannot make money on my money and I likely never will. I'd much rather have a good job than a good stock portfolio.

Too many of us have been fooled into thinking like a CEO as if we were ever going to be one. Even if I do become one -- I'd be happy to pay a lot more taxes in order for the country not to fall apart while Poor angry Americans go on witch hunts against whomever Glenn Beck is angry at this week.

Any of you read the article below?

www.washingtontimes.com...

It explains the rights of states and a militia. These militias as granted authority by the state cannot be prosecuted. Arizona has been invaded.

On to my opinion. This is only the start and as others have said, we are unknowing participants in a game of chess. We may think we are more than pawns but in reality we have been manipulated into this position. We would like to think we are the King, as most pawns would. Truth is, this is a necessary reaction due to where we have been placed. If we were the King we would not be facing this confrontation. The enemy’s movements and strategy have been obvious for those paying attention and could have been easy to prepare for. Now we must relax our focus from other threats to address the more imminent danger, while the knight flanks us from the side.

The moves are so obvious and have been performed so many times that they are ignored by those most threatened by them. Our king has positioned us as a sacrifice for his protection, never to be thought of again once removed from the play board.


I wish you all well and God speed.

And hey, have a good day today!

Originally posted by EyesWideShut
I smell shenanigans! , Does anyone else get the feeling that the ACM is nothing more than 10 -15 airsofters? These people seem only to have a "Virtual" presence. No competent media or professional journalists seem to have made a peep about them , they seem to only live in the blogosphere.

Riddle me this... why is it that none of us knew who these folks were 90 days ago and now all of a sudden they are apparently the "zeta extermination force" , to me this sounds like a bunch of bull...

There are a few THOUSAND Zetas that are actually disciplined with a full chain of command and backed by logistics and supply and some pretty expensive toys to go to war with, They do recon , they have snatch and grab teams and they have CI's in many gangs here not to mention the Original Zetas were actually Delta trained operators ... compared to Billy Bobs paintball team ACM militia members.

The average American is not ready for the extreme violence and ruthlessness of these guys and I think they are romanticizing this whole "take our country back , protect the border" cry that's been going on. Once one of these guys sits watch on the border and comes home to find his family massacred maybe they will get the point that this is not a game. They think It's like hunting... It's not, It's war and they need to leave the war to the warriors. You have every right to protect you and yours by any means necessary up to and including deadly force... on your land. But if you go out looking for a problem , eventually you're gonna find it.

What needs to be done is this ,our government needs to send a few teams down south and let them take care of the problem discreetly and let the Mexican government take credit for it. This is the same tactic we used to hit Escobar in Colombia 20 years ago.

Are you pissed with whats going on on the border?... good then do something about it... stop typing here and go collect your like minded friends , organize and go pay your local politicians a visit. If they won't listen , vote them out and get people in office that will. But this pissing match is not the way to get what you want.

The funny thing is that many of you haven't even stopped to wonder why the government is allowing this to happen in the first place...

[edit on 21-7-2010 by EyesWideShut]

[edit on 21-7-2010 by EyesWideShut]

You made a few assumptions here:

Assumption 1
*Militia's, specifically "ACM" are wannabe bad asses who in reality amount to nothing of significance.

-I can tell you that these "militia" not particularly the ACM but many many others in the U.S. are absolutely no joke. Most ex-military/combat vets and all die hard constitutionalists. They may not be as well equipped as most organized armies but that is to there advantage and they know this. Those who can survive and function effectively off of LESS equipment and "material necessity" are far better off.

Sure you will find a rag-tag untrained wannabee militia here and there but most are far more serious then you apparently give them credit for.

Of course this is just my "word" so take it how you like.


Assumption 2
*like the assumption that we could actually vote someone out of office...if we wanted to.

I have stopped to wonder why the government is allowing this to happen and I could come up with a ton of different theories and explanations most all of which include a system of leaders so corrupt it makes your suggestion of voting them out of office completely asinine.

Originally posted by piddles
reply to post by VitriolAndAngst

 

you make very excellent points but I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss lee's claim that the cartel is dangerous. I hate mentioning this but two of my uncles (on my mexican side, of course) have been murdered (one was kidnapped, we haven't seen him in a year and we've given up hope). I'm not here to lie or exaggerate this, these people don't give a goddamn about anything but the money.

I just ask that you please take them seriously, is all.

I agree with you. I AM SAYING that the Cartel is dangerous. The problem is, that the Anti-Immigrant groups will point to the WORST OF THE WORST to justify their actions. It's the same as what we heard about Iraq -- when Iraq has never attacked the US and the anecdotes had nothing to do with them. On 9/11, most of the Hijackers were from Saudi Arabia and trained in Florida.

The Cartel does not have cowards on it -- it has bloodthirsty men and kids who've seen a few of their family members hacked up.

But that's because we've allowed these conditions to fester.


I could go into a long discussion on how our policies have fostered the corruption and inequities in Mexico -- but that's kind of the way of the world. DuPont and companies like that, run a fairly tight ship in the US -- and in Mexico, they dump everything in the river.

So when we allow them to import cheap chemicals from a subsidiary in Mexico, we just PAID a profit to some Executive (the product is only cheaper to us if there is competition in the marketplace), and we've supported pollution and a horrible way of life.

If we had tariffs on Labor and Environmental damage for goods -- then the Exec in Mexico would have to spend his profits on our Tariff, or throw that money away raising the standards in that Mexican factory or "throwing that money away" at raising a workers salary.

The Mexican Worker and the American Worker share the same destiny. We are duped by patriotism and thinking like our corporation is GIVING us a job and a product. The more we squeeze out of the hands of Robber Barons, the better life will be for the average citizen of BOTH countries.