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The "Facts" of the bible and where we come from

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posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 08:28 PM
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Originally posted by undo
the flood

a couple of geologists from oxford university discover that the flood of the epic of gilgamesh and biblical account happened and the mechanism that caused it


I have tried my best to watch these videos but I hope you can forgive me. Watching tv on my computer is not a favorite thing and that is a lot of video. So they are discussing a localized flood? Did I miss something there?




posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 08:30 PM
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Originally posted by mamabeth
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


Which translations would you recommend?
I have a KJV,NKJV,Torah,Jewish NT...
I have the 1611 KJV on my old computer.


Whichever you feel best represents the views expressed by today's fundamentalist Christians.



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 08:32 PM
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Originally posted by undo
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


well jehovah is a triple deity. i'll explain:


jehovah is the sumerian EN.LIL, EN.KI and ANU.

EN.LIL is seen in the akkadian text, THE EPIC OF GILGAMESH (Tablet XI), tells the same flood story, in which we see EN.LIL pronouncing judgement on the earth with a flood. The story is 100% the same as the biblical flood. This absolutely cinches EN.LIL as Jehovah.

In the akkadian text, ENUMA ELISH, a section is seen in which a king named ENMERKAR (biblical nimrod) has a new temple...




I guess I am confused. How do external texts help me to understand what Christians claim the bible proves by itself, being the perfect word of God?

edit to truncate quote.

[edit on 7/20/10 by evil incarnate]



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 08:34 PM
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Originally posted by Abuaisha
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


Hi,

Anybody interested to know what Quran and Prophet Muhammed(PBUH) narrations says about Adam son Cain and Noah arch story.



Hello.

I am certainly interested myself but I am not sure that it really pertains to anything I am asking about in the OP. Perhaps you feel it adds some level of incited. I guess we will see?



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 08:44 PM
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Originally posted by Genesis322
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


I believe so also.

I might have missed it in your opening post about fundamental Christians or those that believe the bible word for word, the inerrant word of GOD and as historical fact.


Perhaps I did not make it as clear as I could have. Hopefully by this point in the thread it is more clear. I appreciate all the input likewise, just pointing out when it does not answer the question at hand. If I was too vague, I apologize.


With that said I am neither.
I replied to answer what I thought was a question you wanted the answer to.
If you are seeking answers and not just trying to disprove the bible I’ll keep at it.
Looks like undo is heading down the same path that I was taking.


I am trying to understand the people I see here and elsewhere that make claims such as "Noah's Ark is a true story because there are only 18,000 species of land animals." Such a thing is so easily checked and untrue that I cannot help but feel like I must be missing something that people would tell obvious lies in order to promote the idea of truth in the bible.

Then there are the ones who claim to believe the bible 100% simply because of faith. Well, again I missed something. I want to know what it is that inspires people to feel or believe such things. Anyone that believes the bible is word for word history must have a reason. Many of them seem perfectly sane and intelligent in other places so I am thinking that perhaps there are just things I do not understand.


All I can say is if you want to seek spirituality, seek and ye shall find. There are many sources of information out there- non biblical. But some will teach you about the bible its origins and transformations.


This is not at all a search for spirituality. I have a spirituality that I feel quite comfortable with. I am just not so closed minded as to believe it might never be changed. The thing is, fundamentalist Christians intrigue me the most because of the things I read and hear said in defense of a book so utterly confusing.


Will you have more questions? Yes of course, because that is the journey. The more aware you become the more that needs to be answered.


I do not expect to ever find all the answers to anything but a few basic answers would be nice. Simple things like if the bible is literal and true, why were Cain and Abel not malformed? The logistics involved in the idea of us starting all over again after the flood offer up so many basic questions that I feel my search for some answers is pretty valid. Do you not?


The first lesson I give everyone at this point is to find the 3 deities named in the first sentence of Genesis. Then find out who they are. It will give you more questions but that’s a good thing. Every time you look at one aspect you will be presented with multiple new ones to explore.


This first sentence?

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.



That should take plenty of time and opens so many doors that you will be on the path.


Sorry but I guess I need a little more because I am not sure if I have the right first sentence.



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 08:46 PM
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Originally posted by DZAG Wright
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


I wouldn't say it's a matter of subscibing to a religion, but rather having the full story.

It's another thing that voided the bible for myself. I would want the bible in the language and context it was written with all the books attached.


Me too. I mean if I were to begin to believe in anything the first thing I would ask is how it was originally put. That is me, that is you. There are people claiming this book is perfect and infallible. It is the untarnished word of God, even after all these translations and edits. This is not just a few rare nuts either, it is a great many people. So I have to understand how this has come to be and continues to be.



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 08:51 PM
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reply to post by No King but Jesus
 


I have asked you before what you feel you are accomplishing with you bible spam. Please, can you point out one person that has thanked you for offering up knowledge by simply quoting the bible with no input of your own?

As stated before, many of us have bibles. We all have access to the internet. Please stop spamming threads with countless bible quotes that could easily be referenced and not quoted. Your posts are void of original thoughts or any expression of insight or opinion or understanding. Instead of posting quotes that vaguely reference the idea that bible should be universally understood, how about you address the logic of the fact that that is simple not true. Not all languages are equal. How about you address the fact that none of your quotes even actually references translating the bible but speak of God's words. Can you explain how once written down, they remain God's words when translated by men? Can you add anything that comes from your own mind?



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 09:04 PM
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reply to post by evil incarnate
 


it was fascinating! the Mediterranean use to be a valley. imagine if you will, the Nile river flowing south to north into the Mediterranean valley, as a water fall! that must've been pretty. anyway, the water shot across the strait of Gibraltar from the Atlantic, filled up the Mediterranean valley, shot threw the Bosporus strait that connects the Mediterranean to the black sea and then from there, down into Iraq, the Euphrates and Tigris. flow rate thru Bosporus was over 100 mph and 1000 times the water flow of Niagara falls.

[edit on 20-7-2010 by undo]



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 09:10 PM
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reply to post by evil incarnate
 


well since it's clear that EN.LIL is one aspect of JEHOVAH, i think it's safe to suggest that the concept of the trinity is not new nor is it purely a christian notion. it's quite ancient, in fact, going back to the first known civilization.



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by Genesis322

Amen brother.


sister. i'm a lady person, who inadvertently discovered that the bottomless pit mentioned in revelation (the abyss) was the sumerian abzu. i've always had an interest in prophetical texts, as they have so many interesting symbols. the bottomless pit with a gate, that had me stumped, but i think i know what it is now, but to find that answer, i ended up studying not only the biblical text, but their contemporaries. wowzers, if people only took the time to study this stuff, it's better than scifi.

[edit on 20-7-2010 by undo]



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 09:30 PM
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reply to post by evil incarnate
 


He who speaks on his own does so to gain honor for himself-John7.18

There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that VERY word which I spoke -John12.48

"I am against the prophets who wag their own tongues and yet declare, 'The LORD declares.'Jer23.30

If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not be guilty of sin. Now, however, they have no excuse for their sin.-John15.22

no one will hear his voice in the streets.-Matt12.19

They spread a net for my feet— I was bowed down in distress. They dug a pit in my path— but they have fallen into it themselves.-Ps57.6

But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet to warn the people and the sword comes and takes the life of one of them, that man will be taken away because of his sin, but I will hold the watchman accountable for his blood.'-Eze33.6

From that time on Jesus began to preach, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near."-Matt4.17

oh yeah-
Am I now trying to win the approval of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ.-Gal1.10

[edit on by No King but Jesus]



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 09:38 PM
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Originally posted by No King but Jesus
oh yeah-


This is all you wrote in that post. I guess I was asking you to give me a good reason not to ignore you from here on out. I am not sure that is much of an argument.



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 10:10 PM
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reply to post by evil incarnate
 


you missed what those other men wrote? I would rather you copy your source of other mens writings instead of just vaguely saying well so and so said or I read so and so-lol



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 10:19 PM
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Originally posted by No King but Jesus
reply to post by evil incarnate
 


you missed what those other men wrote?


What other men? You mean the bible quotes? I did not miss them, I found them unnecessary. How many times does this need to be explained to you? I have a bible right here. I have read it. You are not showing me anything I have not seen or do not have access to. What I am looking for is something enlightening about these words. All you are doing is repeating words I have here in front of me already and adding nothing to it. That is pointless.


I would rather you copy your source of other mens writings instead of just vaguely saying well so and so said or I read so and so-lol


Guess how much I care what you would rather I do in response to my own questions. This is my thread with my questions. While anyone should feel free to add anything pertinent they so chose, you telling me what you would rather I do makes little sense. If I do not like what you have to offer in lieu of actual responses, I am free to not like that. If you do not like that, you are free to not post.

[edit on 7/20/10 by evil incarnate]



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 10:26 PM
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reply to post by evil incarnate
 


yeah add enlightenment to these eyewitness and friends words? -LOL
go back to page 1, see the testimony thats the only enlightened words you really need to see of mine but of course did'nt you ridicule those on another thread? in which I had to show you again the testimony of Paul? but that was ridiculed too huh?



posted on Jul, 20 2010 @ 11:44 PM
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reply to post by No King but Jesus
 


well, i for one enjoy your posts. don't be discouraged. scripture can be confusing for people and especially if you don't describe why you are quoting it.



posted on Jul, 21 2010 @ 12:51 AM
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Originally posted by mothershipzeta

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33

Originally posted by evil incarnate
Were their multiple Gods at first?
No.


So, now we're ignoring the Bible?



Notice this part of the question
Were their multiple Gods at first?
It`s NOT, is there multiple gods? Because then the answer would be yes.

Later Satan went form an angel to a god, he is a real god just not Almighty God.
Then you have the thousands of fake gods that came after Adam and Eve.
I am not ignoring the bible I am focused on answering the question as it was asked.



posted on Jul, 21 2010 @ 01:04 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


why thank ya thank ya very mucsh-Elvis
girls add another notch on ye ol' friendship belt!

The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.-John6.63

Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.-Matt24.35

[edit on by No King but Jesus]



posted on Jul, 21 2010 @ 10:46 AM
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Hey, i've been lurking around here for a while but I felt the need to sign up just to reply to this post..

Something that boggles my mind is if God created man along with everything else in the world...why is there no scientific evidence of man during the time of dinosaurs, millions of years ago? The bible was obviously written by a HUMAN after dinosaurs became extinct..or were adam and eve and everyone else during that time just cavemen that spoke hebrew? lol



[edit on 21-7-2010 by Sacriligeous]



posted on Jul, 21 2010 @ 11:06 AM
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reply to post by Sacriligeous
 


well there is a possible answer to that but it's out there on the fringe of accepted theology. an author by the name of finis jennings dake, wrote a book years and years ago called, GOD'S PLAN FOR MAN. even though i would describe him as a theologian, he does have many controversial positions on the subjects in the text. i do believe his religious affiilation is what is referred to today as penecostal protestant, but many penecostals do not necessarily hold the same beliefs or doctrines as he does about the bible.

anyway, he claims and attempts to prove that the earth is not only incredibly old but that before homo sapians were created, the previous occupants were the seraphim (angels who apparently have serpentine features). in modern ufology lingo, we would
refer to them as bipedal sentient reptilians or perhaps bipedal, sentient amphibians. they developed technologically and went out to colonize other planets and moons.

dake also claims and attempts to prove that God has an universal government, and some of the members of the seraphim/cherubim decided they wanted to be in control instead. this lead to what sounds like an intergalatic war.

i'm telling ya, this stuff is better than scifi.



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