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Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
reply to post by edmc^2
So, let me get this right. Because of the perfection of the human form, (and other things) you believe in an intelligent creator? Basically you are saying that all the working things you see around you, eyes, bodies, etc., show that some intelligence was involved? It could not have just been random?
And if that is your argument, how do you explain these?
Does God just have "unintelligent" days sometimes?
Originally posted by UmbraSumus
Originally posted by edmc^2
If it takes a team of engineers, scientist and programers to 'create' a robot what would it take to 'create' a human body?
What would it take ? ........time.
If you have Variation
........................ Selection
........................... and Heredity
What would it take ? ........time.
If you have Variation
........................ Selection
........................... and Heredity
................................... you MUST get Evolution
Originally posted by hippomchippo
The OP changed gears from evolution is false and I can prove it to, well okay but the universe is so complex it HAD to have had a creator.
More arguments from ignorance.
I don't understand how the universe could have formed naturally, therefore a supernatural being did it.
THAT is the illogical reasoning of this thread.
Originally posted by edmc^2
To me it's more like:
................................... you MUST get Adaptation
Originally posted by Wertdagf
reply to post by edmc^2
So thats why babies get backed over by cars and die months after being born due to genetic deformitys??? Why little girls who pray to god every night are viciously raped by their parents and relatives? Why children drown during baptisms?
....Because of the sin of man? How neatly you wipe your precious prayer awnsering diease curing evil smiting god of all guilt.
It wouldnt be because this god of yours doesnt exist would it?
i can only hope the pain of those who have suffered without relief who you labeled deserving and sinfull is laid upon your back.
[edit on 18-7-2010 by Wertdagf]
Originally posted by Nyrossius Maxim
I probably shouldn't even get invlolved, but.... it's so hard to resist.
First off, one of the first responses in this thread summed it perfectly ( OnceReturned) . That should have been the end of the thread ( and kudos to OzWeatherman for appropriately identifying the argument of the OP immediately ). My other favorite response(s): yadda333. Zen vs circular reasoning. Love it.
Since the debate rages, here's my 2 cents:
Test: bogus.
Here's a wrench for the whole topic:
What if there wasn't a beginning. God, universe, conscienceness- the whole kitandkaboodle. What if it's all been around, in its everchanging state, for ever, with no end?
Now, I know the creationists wont have a problem with that in reference to God, but I'm suggesting the eternal aspect includes the Creator and the created, in fact, I'm suggesting the two are inseparable.
My view, and I do not claim this to be fact, just my feelings ( I know, logic only! Oh well, sue me! ) is that the physical universe, everything we've discovered and all that has yet to be discovered, is the physical manifestation of an infinite being commonly understood to be spirit. This being wanted to experience itself, in all of its infinite wonder, and thus the physcial universe came into being and developed( through EVOLUTION, the process ). Since there is no end to infinity, why would this process ever end? And since infinity goes both ways on the timeline, why does it need a beginning?
Yeah, I know. I'm going to hell AND I have no proof.
Originally posted by FritosBBQTwist
How does believing in evolution disprove a creator??
Not that I believe in one or not...just curious.
Oh wait, nevermind. This is just another stereotypical thread guided towards people with incomplete beliefs, made from someone with such a belief themselves.
Originally posted by edmc^2
How does believing in evolution disprove a creator??
...
Because evolution is not compatible with creation for many claim that creation is not scientific.
Consider this: as soon as you say you believe in Creation, evolution will break down. vise versa.
[edit on 18-7-2010 by edmc^2]
Originally posted by edmc^2
Originally posted by SinsMayburn
I don't have enough time to read all of the replies, but Im sure there are a few intelligent ATS'ers here saying the right thing. Reasoning is something that you learn, whether through experience or teaching. If your teaching deals with a biased towards creation, your reasoning will be damaged. This is very faulty reasoning. You ask us to answer a question with a set of predetermined answers... that you made. And then you interrupt answering for US. An answer that is quite strange really.
The fact that you say it is impossible for complex designs to happen by chance is irrational. For that specific statement, you cannot prove. But for your following theory, creation, is in place for being proven. So your job is to prove creation. This silly antic did nothing but bring your input of creation without any proof.
[edit on 17-7-2010 by SinsMayburn]
Then by all means answer the question the way you see fit. Don't use the
"predetermined answers... that I (you) made.
So my question - let's pick one: Microprocessor.
We both agree that a microprossesor was made by someone which is a fact. But on the same token, a brain does not require a maker?
Why is that?
I await your answer.
ty,
edmc2