Syria massacres Kurds aided by Turkey's Israel-made drones

The Israeli military complex was built by the USA and other powers but since then they have taken off on their own. Yes they use funding by the USA but Israel has its own independent military R&D going on and it is HIGHLY advanced. They actually develop systems that the USA wants.......

Originally posted by Ben81
about the drones .. i wanted to add this
this is how i see things ...

USA is the most advanced country in the world for military equipment
it have already sold many gadjet to countries in the ME and Europe

so they have sold the blueprint with 2 or 3 already builded drones to Israel
i dont think in 60 years of existence Israel can come up with this kind of technology .. so USA must have helped them so they can build them

USA --> Israel --> Turkey --> Iran
im sure Turkey will attempt to sale the technology to other countries

[edit on 17-7-2010 by princeofpeace]

reply to post by Ben81



I think you're getting a bit excited over the UK drones. They won't be able to carry nukes, they have internal bays far to small for any nuclear armed stormshadow or tomahawk and their maximum take off weight is only 8,000 KG, which sounds far to light to carry any nuclear weapon when you add in the fuel and the planes weight.

Also, they are not as "autonomous" as is being made out. They can independantly get their way to the target area, but from what I have learnt about these things (and I have followed them for several years) they won't just pick their own targets and fire, they do actually require a human to say "yes/no".

Originally posted by prionace glauca
reply to post by Silcone Synapse

 

Good thing they still require fuel and haven't been implemented with solar panels or self sustaining energy source. Now if the energy issues are solved, then we are in some deep doo doo.

Start stocking up on portable EMP's.

oh but they have .. im sure of that
you have to think like a military guy
they want always all the best combined
but they havent been released to the public
they are still i think top secret

but check this out solar energy planes

the technology is there... the energy is there ...
why they would they not think to combine all UAV with solar energy so they can remain in sky 24/7
the upgrade would take a few hours to install on a UAV

reply to post by stumason


i wish i could beleive you on this


nukes have no more the size it has "little boy"
they can carry mini-nukes or other WMD

nukes today can fit inside a case suite
UAV now are stronger than ever ... some are bigger than manuel planes
they can carry multiple kind of weapons
dont ever think they cannot for our sake

I fail to understand why one would worry about drones (even with solar panels or other means of prolonged flight) with nukes when there are TENS OF THOUSANDS regular ballistic missiles/ICBMs with nuclear warheads.
Missile travel much faster then UAV. It can carry heavier payload. Most important - technology exists/tested and developed for decades.
I can understand "robotics as a tool for gaining complete control over population " phobia - have one myself actually,with acute "humanity will be transformed into cyborgs then into complete AI pretty soon" complication.
But solar-powered drone with nuke is not a reason to be (more) scared since lot more scarier beasts exist.
en.wikipedia.org...
as an example. Imagine this with solar power...
P.S
Israel does not get 10 billion $ from US. 2.8 billion $ is more like it.


[edit on 17-7-2010 by ZeroKnowledge]

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


you are absolutly right
there is much more scary stuff out there like those mach 3 missiles...
The RATTLRS Penetrator missile is one scary beast

3 billions dollars to Israel in aid and many military stuff ..why ???
Israel is rich enough .. dont you think ..
its USA now that is getting poorer .. 14 trillions in debt .. thats something BIG

reply to post by Ben81

3 billions dollars to Israel in aid and many military stuff ..why ??? Israel is rich enough .. dont you think ..

Actually - i agree. Even if it is "many military stuff" that is "bought" for using those 3 billions since it cannot be used on anything else.
But there are reasons for this.
1) Historical - USA vs USSR, aid to Israel vs aid to Egypt/Syria, then Israeli-Egyptian peace agreement that was "cemented" by US aid.
2) AIPAC. Yes it is one of main reasons for aid. AIPAC is powerful lobby so it is easier to "buy" them then to fight them.
3) Using aid it is easier to influence/control Israeli policy. There were several clashes between Israeli and American policy and every time US politicians mentioned cutting the aid Israel backed down for some unknown rea$on.
Again - i think that it will be better both for US and Israel to stop this. I doubt though that there are politicians strong enough to do it, in US or in Israel.

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


LOL it will never stop ...
the american congress are 3/4 Pro-zionist
so what ever Israel do or say...
the american government will agree with them
the flotilla raid ... an Turkish-American 19yrs old boy was killed SHOT 4 TIMES IN THE HEAD
Obama didnt even flintch
no excuses was given, no condemnations,no compensations
USS Liberty happened .. nothing was done
in the futur 9/11 will be proven to be a Mossad false flag operation
hope we can learn lessons in the futur from the past

USA Gov need to think AMERICANS FIRST SECOND AND THIRD
i dont see that ... very sadly
i live in Canada but i care for the USA to ... my neighboor
thats why so far Obama has deceived me to be THE president Americans diserves ... its Bush with a more appealing smile nothing more

For those doubting the truthfulness of the Debka source? Here is another article about Turkey and Syria joining up to fight Kurdish rebels. The article is from July 8th, 2010.

SYRIA: Damascus teams up with Turkey to fight Kurdish aspirations

With economic and political ties cemented over the last 12 months, the Syria-Turkey alliance has now appeared to move on to the realm of security. Reports from Turkish state media say Syria has arrested around 400 Kurds with links to the Kurdistan Workers Party, known by the acronym PKK, a move by Damascus seen as ending a once troubled security relationship.

Incursions into Iraqi Kurdistan has increased by Turkey and Iran as of late as well. Nothing is said about these nations performing military operations in a sovereign nation. It does seem Kurds are being assaulted left and right by Middle Eastern powers? Everyone talks about the plight of the Palestinian as they endure the struggle for a nation, but the Kurds have been fighting for hundreds of years and practically nothing. They have endured violent confrontations from Saddam Hussein, the Islamic Republic, Turkey, and now Syria.

Where all the animosity comes from is a quite elusive to me? What the Kurds have done with Kurdistan is quite remarkable. It is slowly becoming a tourist attraction and a model for stability in the Middle East. The international community ought to speak out openly against foreign nations infringing on Iraq's sovereignty by attacking the Kurdistan region. It is quite disturbing if Syrians are using Israeli military equipment to attack the Kurds for the Turks? Turkey is really stirring the pot at the moment, and is playing a dangerous game with her allies.


[edit on 17-7-2010 by Jakes51]

Originally posted by Ben81

i live in Canada but i care for the USA to ... my neighboor

thats why so far Obama has deceived me to be THE president Americans diserves ... its Bush with a more appealing smile nothing more

Canada-Israel: 60 Years of Unrelenting Partnership, Now even Stronger

April 2010

The commemorative book Canada-Israel Diplomatic Relations: Celebrating 60 Years of Successful Relations is jointly released by Canada and Israel.

Canada-Israel Diplomatic Relations: Celebrating 60 Years of Successful Relations marks the 60th anniversary of the establishment of diplomatic ties between Canada and Israel. Released jointly with the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the book showcases six decades of partnership in politics, economics, education, culture and defense.

I see that you are a Canadian Citizen as you claim, then maybe addressing your own nations ties might be a better argument to make as you would have first hand knowledge of this since you reside in such nation.

Also you started this article by mentioning the treatment and war on Kurds which is highly unrecognized by the entire world. And then you went onto connect the drones to Israel to blame for the demise of the Kurds, the drones were not controlled by Israel. Its like blaming China, Russia, Argentina, Iran for all the civilians killed by rebels in Africa as they are top suppliers of Arms to this continent.

The "Zephyr" plane, developed by UK defense technology company, QinetiQ, took off from the U.S. Army's Yuma Proving Ground in Arizona on July 9. Seven days on, it was still flying high.

CNN source

UK are very advanced now in these type of planes
-UAV killing machines (exist)(x)
-Solar Energy powered planes (exist)(x)

it just a mather of time before they combine both
seven days of 24/7 remote controlled ... soon it will be a MONTH
peoples dont fight anymore like they did in Braveheart
100000mens + swords + horses + one shot at a time guns = fair fight
now some countries still fight like this but VS a UAV solarpowered 24/7 Predator killing machine ...
the 100000men wouldnt stand a chance .. 30 seconds and its check mate

reply to post by prionace glauca


the subject didnt change
i do answer to reply concerning both sides
some links need to be made from both ...
the concerns here are the UAV that Turkey are using
are technology mad beast ...
made from different part of the world
many other countries... have in the past and are still using them
who sold them these horrible weapons ... ?? Isreal
i cant turn a blind eye to any fact from both sides

about Canada .. Harper is like Obama
we have a pro israeli lobby to
but i was mentionning Obama since Canada usualy follow the USA by the balls like USA follow Israel
Canada is just third from the top figuratively speaking

reply to post by Ben81


Your UAV link to collaborating nations do not hold any merit. It is ultimately up to the end user of those equipments to decide how they are going to be used. Those same UAV's could have been equipped with surveillance equipment, but Turkey decided to go another route.

I agree in the concern regarding the Kurds as they have been shunned by everyone, even those they share religious ties with.

Since you are trying to tie a nation to tools used by another nation for killing, would you also be trying to connect the entity providing the fuel for such equipment? or How about the pilot who was in charge of flying this drone? or How about the Programmer who inputted the codes? or How about the government who made the purchase?

Israel isn't the only manufacturer of Drones as many and you yourself have pointed out. If Turkey didn't purchase this from Israel they would have gone else where.

reply to post by prionace glauca


i dont agree on using them like this from any side
putting weapons on UAV are war crimes ... period
anyone participating in a transaction that will put a weapons upgrade on a UAV is participating at murdering innocent people ... PERIOD

reply to post by Ben81


So you believe there is a military operation against the Kurdish people?

Do you even know what the above statement means, and what it could mean, what it might mean?

It is obvious propaganda, but if you want to discuss history, and what has happened to them, make a new thread and post all the atrocities.

Wikipedia has a whole damn section on it.

Originally posted by oozyism
reply to post by Ben81

 

So you believe there is a military operation against the Kurdish people?

Do you even know what the above statement means, and what it could mean, what it might mean?

It is obvious propaganda, but if you want to discuss history, and what has happened to them, make a new thread and post all the atrocities.

Wikipedia has a whole damn section on it.

wouldnt be surprise ... turkey did lost many soldiers after the flotilla raid
its like the attack from the PKK as increased since the raid .. to punish Ankara or to make it look bad if they launch an attack revenge on the PKK bases in Irak ... like this one
might be true or just other israelis lies ..

i know this is Israelis propaganda... "DEBKA NEWS"
but i wanted to debate the subjet if this was for real

Follow the money... or the pipelines...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
An old thread of mine that may be pertinent now.

Also it's important to remember in that context that Israel has been arming and training the Kurds the whole time the US has been in Iraq and there have been deadly incursions from both sides and it's possible this is a retaliation for the recent attack on the Turkish base.

Originally posted by prionace glauca
reply to post by Silcone Synapse

 

Good thing they still require fuel and haven't been implemented with solar panels or self sustaining energy source. Now if the energy issues are solved, then we are in some deep doo doo.

Start stocking up on portable EMP's.

They are getting there though ...

www.bbc.co.uk...

www.bbc.co.uk...

And remember the new gen of uav are capable of in flight refuels etc

Originally posted by KilrathiLG
problay a stupid question but why do alota Muslim nations seem to dislike the Kurd's what did they do either recently or in the past to make that part of the world hate them so much?

Originally posted by KilrathiLG
problay a stupid question but why do alota Muslim nations seem to dislike the Kurd's what did they do either recently or in the past to make that part of the world hate them so much?