Sleep Deprivation — Somnambulists of the World, Unite!

I hope this thread stays alive, theres some really interesting ideas and methods that may help to get through or even solve the sleep deprivation problem, for some at least anyway.

I dont know if i can be helped as it's always been the way i am, but im sure others who dont have it so serious can be helped. Ill keep coming back to this one, really good thread OP.

reply to post by pause4thought


Sorry for the delay. Got sidetracked.

I do think it is an individual thing as to how much sleep a person needs.

In my case, I know I drove my own Mother nuts as a child because I simply could not nap. Of course when I was young I did sleep longer hours at night. But as I grew older I found sleeping that long destroyed me for the day. 4 hours and I was full of energy. 8 hours and I felt lethargic all the time.

I am going the other way now. As I age, I'm sleeping an hour or two longer.

Where I think it came from is in our education in part. I clearly remember in Grade School bringing home a paper to my Parents meant to teach them to make sure I slept enough. In those days they taught 10 hours and a nap for little ones reducing to 8 hours as you got older.

Then again in Health classes, we got the same lecture and were told that you must get 8 hours and children and older people more than that. It was programed into our brains. It has made me actually feel guilty if I could not sleep that many hours. Which of course is nonsense, but after you are programed all throughout your life to believe the one number applies to everyone, you get guilt if your not the same.

My Wife can not function on under 8 hours. Her metabolism is clearly different than mine. It is clearly an individual thing.

Having said that, I have gone through bouts of what I think is Insomnia. Where I did feel sleep deprived. As I get older those become more frequent. That is different though. What happens is I actually start to fight sleep mentally. Its like sleep is the enemy and I keep thinking what a horrible waste of time sleep is. It is nearly an argument against evolution in fact. Would not a person who required no sleep have an evolutionary advantage. Of course they would, so why do we sleep. There is something about sleep we have not yet comprehended. Something beyond just needing to rest.

[edit on 7/17/2010 by Blaine91555]

reply to post by Blaine91555


I really do think you're onto something when you talk about a link between age and the amount of sleep we need. Maybe it also varies in keeping with the amount of activity we've undergone in a given day.

I've also noticed that what happens on one day can affect sleep patterns for days afterwards. Too little one night equates to trouble for several days and nights following.

And anything other than a very brief daytime nap plays havoc with my nighttime sleep rhythm as well. I don't know whether this is common, though.

Its like sleep is the enemy and I keep thinking what a horrible waste of time sleep is.

Might this not be an insipid deception of the modern age? A message imbibed through the media and/or the 24-hr business society? (You've clearly acknowledged it's not good for us; just mulling over what puts us in such a state of mind...)



[edit on 17/7/10 by pause4thought]

I sleep from everywhere from 2-3 hours a night. If I'm lucky, which is about once every two weeks, I'll get six hours sleep.

Right now, it's 4:03 AM here now, I'll probably go to sleep in an hour from now and get up around 7 to 8AM. I'm dead tired, and I'll wake up dead tired, but as the day goes on, I'll wake up a bit.

It's been like this for three years, I got some medication for it but I found if I take them, I can easily sleep for up to twenty hours, effectively ruining my day and screw my "rhythm" up.

But hey, at least I have ATS to keep me company.

reply to post by pause4thought


Dude...debating on ATS is hardly the first thing I worry about when it comes to staying up all night...though I've have been through some rather chronic stages of ATS addiction...

It is 05:14 here in Ireland and I have been babysitting a thread.

I am off to bed for a few hours (6) but I will read up this thread later

[edit because I am tired]

[edit on 17/7/2010 by PuterMan]

I have been a chronic insomniac since childhood. I sleep on average every second or third day and usually 3 or 4 hours. It is not unusual for me to go for a week. If that seems extreme well it is, and it affects every part of my life. I have tried medications but build immunity very fast, I meditate and understand a number of relaxation techniques. I simply am unable to shut my mind down. It has gotten so bad that I honestly now dread trying to lay down and sleep. I used to find it all so very frustrating and seeing how other people sleep used to get quite jealous (I suppose in a way I still am) but now just try and except I have extra time. Rarely does it affect my mood, although when I have not slept for 8 days I start getting quite desperate and start thinking slamming my head into a wall might just knock me out. lol. When other people live 7 days a week I live 2 or 3 normally. I tend to run better on less sleep than more. When I have slept 6 hours although very rare I find I cannot wake up properly and spend the next 2 or 3 days (your time 1 for me) yawning and not being able to focus as well. Lately I have taken to alcohol and try to knock my self out that way although more times than not it does not help either. I had a lady in my life for 4 years who had never seen me sleep. Mind you she slept long hours. I am at the extreme end of insomnia and believe there are many factors that contribute to it. I am a glutton for information so find the net great. I am 44 years of age and retired. Not surprisingly I worked very long hours and was able to put myself in a position to stop work. I have more than I need. Although I worked as a Laboratory Techinician (Product Development) I am also a very active person. I find hard physical activity changes nothing for me. I know there are many people that have times in there life where they have trouble, and some try to advise me when they realise just how little I sleep. But unless you are a true insomniac it is not something people grasp well. This subject is obviously very close to home to me and I could sit here and talk about it all day, but that just seems pointless. If I could sleep 3 hours every night I would feel amazingly blessed. Wow just the thought of it makes me smile.

Originally posted by undead trev
I have been a chronic insomniac since childhood. I sleep on average every second or third day and usually 3 or 4 hours. It is not unusual for me to go for a week. If that seems extreme well it is, and it affects every part of my life. I have tried medications but build immunity very fast, I meditate and understand a number of relaxation techniques. I simply am unable to shut my mind down. It has gotten so bad that I honestly now dread trying to lay down and sleep. I used to find it all so very frustrating and seeing how other people sleep used to get quite jealous (I suppose in a way I still am) but now just try and except I have extra time. Rarely does it affect my mood, although when I have not slept for 8 days I start getting quite desperate and start thinking slamming my head into a wall might just knock me out. lol. When other people live 7 days a week I live 2 or 3 normally. I tend to run better on less sleep than more. When I have slept 6 hours although very rare I find I cannot wake up properly and spend the next 2 or 3 days (your time 1 for me) yawning and not being able to focus as well. Lately I have taken to alcohol and try to knock my self out that way although more times than not it does not help either. I had a lady in my life for 4 years who had never seen me sleep. Mind you she slept long hours. I am at the extreme end of insomnia and believe there are many factors that contribute to it. I am a glutton for information so find the net great. I am 44 years of age and retired. Not surprisingly I worked very long hours and was able to put myself in a position to stop work. I have more than I need. Although I worked as a Laboratory Techinician (Product Development) I am also a very active person. I find hard physical activity changes nothing for me. I know there are many people that have times in there life where they have trouble, and some try to advise me when they realise just how little I sleep. But unless you are a true insomniac it is not something people grasp well. This subject is obviously very close to home to me and I could sit here and talk about it all day, but that just seems pointless. If I could sleep 3 hours every night I would feel amazingly blessed. Wow just the thought of it makes me smile.

So sorry to hear that - you really are an example of a rare extreme. The only thing I can suggest is for you to plan a short period of time where you are cut off from all mind-inducing activity. For example, try spend 1 full day not reading the paper, watching TV, going on the computer, listening to the radio or talking on the phone. It's boring but it might help you disconnect from all the distractions that are keeping you up.

When lying down and trying to fall asleep, acknowledge that you are in control of your body and your mind. Put yourself at ease and believe within yourself that you can let go and rest.

I have been following this thread since it started on my cell phone but decided not to reply until I had enough time to actually sit down and read it over on the computer again. That being said.. lets get on with the show.

Yet while some claim to can cope well with just a few hours' sleep, others (such as myself,) are at a loss without a good 7-8 hours.

While everyone says they are fine through the whole day getting 7-8 hours of sleep, I need more along the lines of 9.5 to 11 hours a day. More so if I have been doing physical work during the day or had under 7 hours of sleep the night before.

You people who sleep 3 hours, 4 hours, even 5-6 hours a night -- I am jealous of you. Do you know how terrible it is to constantly feel tired or out of it because it's rather hard to get the sleep I need when living with other people?

I used to have a room mate who would get home after I fell asleep, then wake up before I woke up, made breakfast and was out of the house by the time I was dragging myself to the shower. He said he only needed about 5 hours of sleep a night, sometimes 6, and he was up and at em ready to go as soon as he woke up.

I'm the complete opposite.

It takes about 3 hours to fully get back into this "reality" from the point of waking up. A long cold shower and some coffee does help to kick me into gear sometimes.

Definitely not a morning person if I can't comprehend much the first few hours I'm awake. Like some other member posted in this thread how they KNOW if they took their exams bright and early in the morning that they would have passed with flying colors... and *I* KNOW if I took all my exams after 6pm then I would pass with flying colors. (True story most of .. actually all my morning classes that I've had (this includes anything that starts before 11am) I had terrible grades in or just couldn't grasp simple concepts because it was too early for me to function).

As not being a morning person, I am obviously a night owl. The night time is the best time to be able to focus on reading, thought, productivity, physical labor... I would say my prime hours are anywhere from 6pm to 2am, although it varies from time to time. For example 9pm-3am would be prime while other times 5pm to midnight might be another time frame.

The question is to what degree are you affected?

The best way I can describe how I am affected (and also to make all you people who are jealous of people who sleep long hours -- not so jealous) is when I worked full time in an office. The regular 9:00A.M. to 5:00P.M.

Let's start with monday: Wake up at 7:30 (I know some people wake up 2 hours before to get ready but I wanted every last minute of sleep I could get), Shower quickly, eat maybe a small bowl of cereal, make instant coffee, bring it with me to the car in a travel mug. (I can't eat anything in the morning or it makes me sick also, my digestive system doesn't really wake up until 3 hours after i wake up. If I eat anything more than an apple I'll literally feel like vomiting.)
8:00-8:10 leave and drive to work, get in around 8:45-9:00 depending on traffic.
9:00-11:00AM day is dragging so long and my eyes are burning. Takes awhile to think. I'll have eaten a granola bar or two during this time.
12:00pm Eat lunch, finally get some energy back.
1:00pm feel like I've ran a marathon and sweated so much that I need a shower and just want to lay down somewhere.
3:00pm still pretty tired, out of it.
5:00pm finally get to go home..
5:45pm get home, basically put on comfortable clothes, grab some juice, collapse in the chair, play a video game because I'm way too out of it to read ATS or what not.
Eat something around 7pm, then just sit here waiting until 10pm so I can go to bed.

Probably go to bed at 945pm fall asleep by 1030pm.... wake up again at 730am... thats what, 9 hours? so around 8 hours to 9.5 hours a night. "Wow you get a lot of sleep!"

Repeat, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday.

Friday Night. "Hey want to go out?" "No I'm exhausted from working this week"
Stay up a bit later, say 11pm, then collapse and sleep until 2:00PM the next day.

Without fail nearly every Saturday I managed to push 14 hours of sleep from Friday night. It then took me a few hours to get up to par with reality again but I was feeling a LOT better.

Saturday into Sunday I'd push around 11-12 hours. Felt great on Sunday but couldn't do much because I had to be go to sleep at 10pm for work the next day if I didn't want to feel like a total zombie.

So in reality I had 8-10 hours a day to myself on weekends, and perhaps 3-4 hours on weeknights after commuting was taken into account and everything.

This was no life, it was more like torture. And on the weekends you had to mow the lawn, clean the place up etc. If this was what an office job was going to be like than I'd rather be dead I thought to myself.

Thankfully that was for 1 summer and I now have 1 semester left in school before I graduate, and I'm more worried about being able to keep a job rather than finding one to begin with. How will I function 2 months into a job if I'm going to have no life at all? Will I have to sleep 11 hours a night? That will leave me with 2 hours a night to myself, enough to clean tupperware and make food for lunch for the next day. Pooey!

Well OP Hope that's what you wanted and I'm glad I finally wrote all this down. Will probably use it for future reference.

My typical sleep pattern is about 5.5 hours. If I get too much more, I feel horrible for most of the following day.

I have friends who insist I need 8-9 per day, but I can't imagine living like that.

I don't hate sleep, try to remember my dreams, and so forth. I just know my limits, and 6 hours is about as much as I can stand in any one 24 hour period.

By the way, I prefer to get all of my work done as early as possible. I am the stereotypical "morning person", even if I do indulge a bit too much the night before.

Strange how people can be so different.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by 0zzymand0s]

reply to post by LOLZebra


Plenty of food for thought there.

You made me wonder whether there are ways to reset the 'body clock'. It seems there's quite a lot of info on this out there.

Rest your body clock: not a morning person?

Maybe approaches like this could help some deal with their daily schedule a little more easily.

reply to post by Catch_a_Fire

I hope this thread stays alive, theres some really interesting ideas and methods that may help to get through or even solve the sleep deprivation problem, for some at least anyway.

I dont know if i can be helped as it's always been the way i am, but im sure others who dont have it so serious can be helped. Ill keep coming back to this one, really good thread OP

several years ago I read an article that gave me one very useful tip

it's not magic - it doesn't work every time - but it's worked often enough that I'll do it when I'm desperate

the point is to try and cause a drop in your body temperature - it's temporary and artificial - but it can sometimes be enough to get that little gizmo in your head to tell the rest of you to go to sleep. Staying asleep is another problem

take a hot shower or bath - as hot as you can stand it for as long as you can stand it

follow with cold water - as long and as much as you can stand

not fun - especially at 2:00 A.M. Pretty much sounds like the last thing we might want to do - but I think the chance - even the chance - you might sleep is worth it

couldn't find the original article - I filed that someplace safe. I'll never see it again

here are some related articles:
www.unisa.edu.au...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Usually,the more I think about sleep the less I get but,after reading through the thread I am getting sleepy (10 am here been up since 5:30ish) I wonder if "THEY" started this thread as a subliminal control over ATS members? Sleep...Sleep....say it with me sleep sleeep sleeeeep?
WAKE UP!

reply to post by pause4thought


:-)

here you go Pause - there is a history of sleepwalking in my family on my father's side - and I had a few minor sleepwalking incidents when I was a kid - then 2 when I was in my 20s. But it's not a regular thing

also - I have to believe because I'm constantly a little sleep deprived, if I do nod off - in public let's say - I start dreaming immediately

reply to post by pause4thought


Thank you for the article. I'm reading it now.

And the hot shower / cold shower thing... I'll try that out tonight.


I noticed if I stop trying to kick myself into gear (drinking a lot of Caffiene), I sleep better (wow captain obvious ). I won't be as alert in the morning but I don't get drowsy/tired later on in the day either.

I started to drink chamomile + valerian root tea 2 or so hours before I want to sleep. It has been working alright. Except I can't get up in the morning



Cheers

Zebra