Arizona Militia Engaging Mexican Narcos & Military, 2 Mexi KIA

Originally posted by earthdude
It will be such a strange country when the states have a patchwork of different laws dealing with immigration. Arizona will have to legalize murder. This will really foul things up. "I suspected my wife was an illegal so I killed her".

We already have legalized murder at the federal level and have had it for over 100 years.

The U.S. Federal military can go into any non threatening country it wants and for it's own agenda ( or the agenda of those above the military giving the orders) can murder any person it wanted, to reach it's goal.

You don't serve in the U'S military for honor and duty, or even to protect our country. You serve to be a pawn in a game of political life and death for a few corrupt men who want more money and power.

I challenge anyone to prove me wrong.

Since WW2 every war we have been involved with has been unconstitutional and only to serve the needs of the men in power. No one has ever threatened this country where we needed to go and stop them before they invaded us. That is The Only reason America should have a military and the Only reason to go to war.

Now after all these years we have a situation that correct6ly counts as an illegal invasion and occupation and what are we doing? Nothing? That's ass backward. THIS IS the reason we need our military and or legal militia here and at the border to do their job.



[edit on 14-7-2010 by JohnPhoenix]

Originally posted by danielhanson420
what happens when they shoot up a mexican family trying to cross the border kid's and all, is that fair game because their illegal? while i agree that america should be woried about it's border people taking the law into their own hands is bownd to end in disaster and probably loss of inocent lives. use your guns to protect your property and family. ask your selfs why the goverment dosnt protect your borders properly... who benifits from all that cheap labour and latino votes.

If they are a innocent family then they probably won't unleash a storm of lead like the drug runners in the OP when they are stopped to be questioned. And would be held for the State Authorities or just shown the door, I mean the Fence.










[edit on 14-7-2010 by prionace glauca]

I am active Militia in MS, i have yet to recieve confirmation on any KIA/WIA. I do know that ACM did deploy to the border. I made a few calls and no one I know can confirm or deny that a firefight took place.

I am sure if that were the case the MSM would be all over the "racist" militia groups. Thats how the MSM is.

I am sure word will come out soon and we will have some evidence if this event did take place.

I know with my unit it would have been 6 KIA not just 2 but .... we have several former operators and snipers.

Militia is no just a dumb bunch of rednecks with guns. This is not the 1990's

Armed conflict is the last thing any of us want.

Originally posted by prionace glauca

Originally posted by danielhanson420
what happens when they shoot up a mexican family trying to cross the border kid's and all, is that fair game because their illegal? while i agree that america should be woried about it's border people taking the law into their own hands is bownd to end in disaster and probably loss of inocent lives. use your guns to protect your property and family. ask your selfs why the goverment dosnt protect your borders properly... who benifits from all that cheap labour and latino votes.

If they are a innocent family then they would probably won't return any fire if they are stopped. And would be held for the State Authorities or just shown the door, I mean the Fence.

This kind of thing does happen a lot with the National Guard troops on the boarder, one soldier I knew, never fired a shot. He only saw an illegal immigrants and he would just yell "get the hell out of here" or some harsher language and the people would run back to the other side of the fence. It was as simple as that for him.

What the issue becomes is the drug runners and "coyote" human smugglers, they would go head to head with the guardsmen.

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


Well done, militia. Perhaps the drug smuggler will think twice next time.

PatriotResistance.com is calling it "confirmed". Time will tell. More info,

Incoming Request from M.FREEBYRD

IMMEDIATE CALL FOR ACTION BY ARIZONA CITIZENS MILITIA COMMANDER
ARIZONA MILITIA UNITS ARE TAKING FIRE AND UNDER ATTACK BY MEXICAN CARTEL
MEMBERS............THIS IS NOT A FALSE ALARM.........ARIZONA COMMANDER HAS CONFIRMED AND IS CALLING OUT TO ALL PATRIOTS FOR HELP.

Originally posted by merkaba93
PatriotResistance.com is calling it "confirmed". Time will tell. More info,

Incoming Request from M.FREEBYRD

IMMEDIATE CALL FOR ACTION BY ARIZONA CITIZENS MILITIA COMMANDER
ARIZONA MILITIA UNITS ARE TAKING FIRE AND UNDER ATTACK BY MEXICAN CARTEL
MEMBERS............THIS IS NOT A FALSE ALARM.........ARIZONA COMMANDER HAS CONFIRMED AND IS CALLING OUT TO ALL PATRIOTS FOR HELP.

A call for assistance is counter to the OP, but does make military sense. I'll tell you right now, if this was real, and a drug cartel, those militia members could very likely end up dead. In Mexico, military leaders, political officials, law enforcement officers and journalists that come out against the cartels come up on hit lists and end up killed.

If the militias get into this fight, there will be a lot of them killed, and the complications to the overall operations being undertaken by Mexican and American officials will become a lot more complicated. If this happened, and it still is an enormous "if," they have just gotten involved in what amounts to a civil war in Mexico.

Be careful not to bite off more than you can chew.

Some people express concern over thee 2nd amendment being suspended or revoked over this action. This is a non issue as these men are not doing anything illegal, they are simply camping when it comes right down to the base fact.
The other worry is that the feds may intervene, maybe you have never been with a militia group when approached by the “authorities”, they will simply ask the feds to leave them alone.
From there if the feds escalate the militias escalate also.
From there it is a non winnable civil war especially for the feds, who will be the ultimate losers as the militias will be able to muster much more support.
We the people and all.
So don’t worry about our rights, if they press we will press right back.
We have a deal with them from birth, let me live and I will do the same for you.
As for the border report, I have not been there yet but it does come from a reputable source as far as I know.
And the uniform issue, Zetas have a patch to identify them by. I would assume said individuals were either wearing those or dressed commando style.
Either case they are dressed for battle so all bets are off.
And about the illegal immigration issue, if a person with no ill intent except but to cross cares to go through a known war zone, they do so at their own risk.

This is huge news if it can be verified. I know some people involved with the militias in Arizona and New Mexico. I am trying to contact them now to see what they know.

If the militias get into this fight, there will be a lot of them killed, and the complications to the overall operations being undertaken by Mexican and American officials will become a lot more complicated.

Maybe there will be a lot of us killed. Maybe not. Many militia members are combat bloodied vets. The tree of liberty must be watered and all of that. Though I do not seek out armed conflict I will gladly use my skills and gear to fight now so that my children do not need to.

Are you referring to the overall operations of the US and Mexi officials to eliminate our border and destroy our Constitutional Republic. From all the evidence of their action this is the only goal I can see them attempting to reach.

Let's treat the armed Mexicans the way the Mexicans treat armed trespassers on their southern border. They are shot on sight.

Get out there and track these folks down. "Go Rhodesian" and hunt them for given the opportunity they will surely hunt you.

Originally posted by g146541
Some people express concern over thee 2nd amendment being suspended or revoked over this action. This is a non issue as these men are not doing anything illegal, they are simply camping when it comes right down to the base fact.
The other worry is that the feds may intervene, maybe you have never been with a militia group when approached by the “authorities”, they will simply ask the feds to leave them alone.
From there if the feds escalate the militias escalate also.
From there it is a non winnable civil war especially for the feds, who will be the ultimate losers as the militias will be able to muster much more support.
We the people and all.
So don’t worry about our rights, if they press we will press right back.
We have a deal with them from birth, let me live and I will do the same for you.
As for the border report, I have not been there yet but it does come from a reputable source as far as I know.
And the uniform issue, Zetas have a patch to identify them by. I would assume said individuals were either wearing those or dressed commando style.
Either case they are dressed for battle so all bets are off.
And about the illegal immigration issue, if a person with no ill intent except but to cross cares to go through a known war zone, they do so at their own risk.

If these were Los Zetas and the militia caught them unaware, then posted this online, that's the militia members funeral. Also if commando-dressed LZs are coming into the USA at squad level, then you are going to have some much bigger problems on your hands because they usually hire MS-13 and the Texas Syndicate to do their work in America.

If they are here, you've got big problems.

As for the rest of your post, your hubris is laughable though. Your "I can take em" attitude may be fine for the internet, but remember that the United States Government can escalate far beyond what you can do.

Tell me something, when have militia members ever won an engagement with the US Government in modern history? They haven't.

Your buddies may support the militia movement, but the majority of America wants continuance of governance and change through voting, not revolution. I've written several papers on this and done quite a bit of research work for my employer on exactly this issue.

Originally posted by KilrathiLG
about damn time get stop them at the fence stop them at the rio NOT one more illegal gets to set foot in this country with out a good chunk of led in his butt if the feds wont do it federal Remington Winchester Ruger and colt will defend the border screw the fed if they wont do it the people of Arizona will My uncle lives in Arizona and he has a ffa and class 3 license and is arming his militia with machine guns mg42's Vickers and Lewis guns and once his troop get there there will be a dent in the illegal tide only "money" we should be giving those illegals is the brass we leave behind on the battlefeild

Bolded for emphasis...

And if you are telling the truth, you have just sent the feds to take a look at your uncle. Posts on a conspiracy site such as ATS are not as anonymous as you may wish to think. If we have our militias standing up for us where our government is failing, we do not need posts such as this one that will ultimately send the feds to go against our own citizens.

You may think it's "cool" to brag like this, but you may have just screwed your uncle by pointing out that he is handing out automatic weapons to his buddies.

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy
Well if this story is true, I'd be more comfortable with a source here too, I have no idea who these guys shot, the Mexican government does not use AKs or SKSs and the drug runners do not use uniforms.

This makes it sound a lot more like a hoax to me, but this shows one of the biggest flaws in the independent militia movement to me: Lack of knowledge, lack of experience and a Rambo-complex.

Edit: Nothing over the wires about this yet at the office, but if this did happen you can bet that the media will swarm over it.

Actually the drug runners in the past have geared up exactly
like the mexican military with even a Humvee.

Of course it is entirely possible it was a rogue unit of
the mexican military that decided to upgrade their pay rate.

There is also the chance they were told to cooperate or be killed
like the Narco's do now to public officials there.

reply to post by ProjectJimmy


Jimmy - Perhaps the militias have not "won" an engagement with the US government - yet, but as with everything there is a first time. I think most Americans and most militia members do not want another civil war, but there may come a time when lines will be drawn and we will have to choose sides. The militias likely have more support now than they ever have had before, so that also may come into play.

Also, wasn't it "just the civilian militia" that won our independence from Britain?

edited for clarity - changed "feds" to "US government".

[edit on 14-7-2010 by tallcool1]

Originally posted by Ex_MislTech

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy
Well if this story is true, I'd be more comfortable with a source here too, I have no idea who these guys shot, the Mexican government does not use AKs or SKSs and the drug runners do not use uniforms.

This makes it sound a lot more like a hoax to me, but this shows one of the biggest flaws in the independent militia movement to me: Lack of knowledge, lack of experience and a Rambo-complex.

Edit: Nothing over the wires about this yet at the office, but if this did happen you can bet that the media will swarm over it.

Actually the drug runners in the past have geared up exactly
like the mexican military with even a Humvee.

Of course it is entirely possible it was a rogue unit of
the mexican military that decided to upgrade their pay rate.

There is also the chance they were told to cooperate or be killed
like the Narco's do now to public officials there.

I agree with you completely but the OP still does not make sense. The Mexican military and Federales do not use Russian or Chinese made weapons, at all. They use American, European and Mexican guns, none of which resemble the AK-series or SKS-series.

The cartels do use Russian-style weapons imported from the US and Asia but not when in uniform impersonating Mexican government troops. For this reason they import AR-15 rifles from the United States and modify them to look like M-4s.

As I said it sounds much more like something out of a movie and does not add up to Mexican or cartel tactics, which are both quite advanced.

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy

If these were Los Zetas and the militia caught them unaware, then posted this online, that's the militia members funeral. Also if commando-dressed LZs are coming into the USA at squad level, then you are going to have some much bigger problems on your hands because they usually hire MS-13 and the Texas Syndicate to do their work in America.

If they are here, you've got big problems.

Fear of your enemy will guarantee loss.

The cartels are banking upon their victims fear, to bad they are garden variety thugs. If US citizens start talking some down, they will hide in Mexico and send "mules" and "coyotes" to die.

I'm sure that the ACM members are very aware of LZ's capabilities, and I don't think that will deter them.

reply to post by ProjectJimmy


There has not been an actual engagement between the feds and the militia in recent history. There was the Battle of Athens, but that was the county level. Randy Weaver's wife getting shot in the head while nursing is not a "militia engagement". It is murder. Waco was a religious group vs. the feds, and during the initial raid the Davidians actually did drive the fedz off and force them to eventually burn them alive. Hardly a military victory.

It does not take a lot of folks to cause a lot of problems. Say if maybe only 3% of gun owners wanted to get busy on shutting the border down? That's a lot of guns. It's not goofs either. It's ex-mil and folks who have been shooting since they were little kids. So yeah it would be rough going up against the School of the Americas trained cartel soldiers but rough for both sides.

Off topic but as far as your research... The feds know they can't put the toothpaste back into the tube. Maybe they want the chaos maybe not but they have been pushing pretty hard with the trumped up faked Hutaree arrest and charges as well as July4Patriot Charles Dyers ATF arrest and illegal incarceration at the hands of the feds. There is still an element of the American spirit that survives.

Originally posted by tallcool1
reply to post by ProjectJimmy

 

Jimmy - Perhaps the militias have not "won" an engagement with the US government - yet, but as with everything there is a first time. I think most Americans and most militia members do not want another civil war, but there may come a time when lines will be drawn and we will have to choose sides. The militias likely have more support now than they ever have had before, so that also may come into play.

Also, wasn't it "just the civilian militia" that won our independence from Britain?

edited for clarity - changed "feds" to "US government".

[edit on 14-7-2010 by tallcool1]

The Continental Army, supported by but not subject of local militia, with the material support of the Kingdom of France, Spain and the Dutch Republic defeated the forces of Great Britain.

The Continental Army was a real army, established by the Continental Congress on June 14, 1775. That's the equal to today's American Army.

Originally posted by ProjectJimmy

Originally posted by tallcool1
reply to post by ProjectJimmy

 

The Continental Army, supported by but not subject of local militia, with the material support of the Kingdom of France, Spain and the Dutch Republic defeated the forces of Great Britain.

The Continental Army was a real army, established by the Continental Congress on June 14, 1775. That's the equal to today's American Army.

It's a bit different these days though. The military has all kinds of aircraft, armored vehicles, nuclear, biological and chemical weapons that Militias could not dream of getting.

reply to post by tallcool1


target practice is completely legal especially in the desert most of his weapons arent even covered by fire arms bans due to there age and as far as being worried about my "uncle" im adopted different last name and im one of the few to talk to him in my family i can hand my shotgun to any one i want at the range and by defaut thats "arming" and is completely legal like some one said earlyer there just camping and if any illegals happen to show up hey accidents happen in the middle of a big desert. big difference letting your friends fire your weapons on a "trip" then transferring or letting them keep them in there homes

www.everydaynodaysoff.com... where are the feds cracking down on them? i see a lot of people using other peoples guns maybe my verbatim was off but the point still stands its not illegal to use some one else's gun especially if there there with them search youtube for other such events lots of them have been going on for years with little to no federal involvment

arizonas not chicago gun laws alot more "liberal" down there

www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
those all illegal too?
[edit on 14-7-2010 by KilrathiLG]

[edit on 14-7-2010 by KilrathiLG]