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Ask An Atheist Anything

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posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 04:23 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by ChickenPie
 



So you believe eternity is plausible only when we're not talking about a God then?


Where did i profess my belief in eternity?


So you were just saying, "where would a creator come in there, when infinity is introduced?" For comedic effect?




posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 04:32 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware

Originally posted by adjensen

I like the idea of design in a grand sense, but at the level most people think of it, no, I'm okay with a purely scientific view. Makes sense to me, from both a theological perspective and from outside that.


But to science, its an illogical and unnessisary assumption; Stephen Hawking has said we don't even know for absolute certainity that the universe hasn't always been, is, and always will be; where would a creator come in there, when infinity is introduced?


I went round and round with TD on this earlier in the thread, please don't make me do it again :-)

It is only illogical if you lack faith. If you have faith, it makes perfect sense. Basic difference between you and I, and we're back to the gulf.

But the bottom line is that I didn't come to God because I needed to know how the Universe was created. How it happened, what his relationship with it is, how it all fits together, I don't understand, but ultimately, I don't really care, because what is important to me is my relationship with him and how that affects my life.



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:00 PM
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reply to post by adjensen
 


Faith is illogical.



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:07 PM
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Originally posted by ChickenPie

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by ChickenPie
 



So you believe eternity is plausible only when we're not talking about a God then?


Where did i profess my belief in eternity?


So you were just saying, "where would a creator come in there, when infinity is introduced?" For comedic effect?


No as an argument to show why believing in a supernatural cosmic overlord would be an unessisary belief to hold. See "occam's razor"



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by adjensen
 


Faith is illogical.


That is a incorrect and judgmental generalization, but regardless, my comment about logic wasn't addressed to the subject of faith. Go back and read what I wrote.

Is it a typical tactic for atheists to claim that theists say things that they did not, and when called on it to say "oops, sorry" and go off and do it again? How would you ever expect to find common ground or, at the very least, gain respect for your view if you misrepresent your opponent over and over?



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:32 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by adjensen
 


Faith is illogical.


If I'm gonna have Faith in something - - it better be tangible - - with good odds.

Make that great odds.



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:39 PM
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Originally posted by adjensen
How would you ever expect to find common ground or, at the very least, gain respect for your view if you misrepresent your opponent over and over?


How is there common ground between an Atheist and a Theist?

Your posts are all the same message. What is misrepresented?



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware

Originally posted by ChickenPie

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by ChickenPie
 



So you believe eternity is plausible only when we're not talking about a God then?


Where did i profess my belief in eternity?


So you were just saying, "where would a creator come in there, when infinity is introduced?" For comedic effect?


No as an argument to show why believing in a supernatural cosmic overlord would be an unessisary belief to hold. See "occam's razor"


The alternative to not believing in God is to believe that something just happened to come from nothing and that something just so happened to unfold into a universe with a degree of order that allowed life as we know it to take place here on earth.

Secondly, you either think eternity is plausible or you don't. If you don't think it is, then it doesn't make much sense to pose a hypothetical situation where there could have been an eternal natural process that preceded everything and had no beginning.

[edit on 31-7-2010 by ChickenPie]



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:48 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by ChickenPie
 



So you believe eternity is plausible only when we're not talking about a God then?


Where did i profess my belief in eternity? I was merely showing the poor assumption of God stating the POSSIBILITY that the universe could be infinite, It is plausible, what does eternity have to do with God?


I always find this eternity thing interesting - - also fear of death. It always amazes me how those who believe strongly in an afterlife - - seem to fear it the most.

I don't need it. I don't need eternity. What makes me so great that I can't just say "Bye - your turn".

I do fear pain associated with some death situations - - but I don't fear death at all.



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by ChickenPie

The alternative to not believing in God is to believe that something just happened to come from nothing and that something just so happened to unfold into a universe with a degree of order that allowed life as we know it to take place here on earth.


What is energy. Where did it come from? Was it just always in existence?

Could energy have its own evolution into consciousness? Rather then consciousness creating energy.






[edit on 31-7-2010 by Annee]



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:55 PM
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The alternative to not believing in God is to believe that something just happened to come from nothing and that something just so happened to unfold into a universe with a degree of order that allowed life as we know it to take place here on earth.


Firstly, God is the unsessisary assumption there is no "alternative" because that is the illogical concept anyway, all i am saying is science doesn't know, it doesn't know yet the the universe is infinite or that any God exists, so why would you put faith in something without evidence.


Secondly, you either think eternity is plausible or you don't. If you don't think it is, then it doesn't make much sense to pose a hypothetical situation where there could have been an eternal natural process that preceded everything and had no beginning.


Secondly, and again, science doesn't know that the universe is infinite for sure, but its a possibility, but no one has enough reason to put "faith" or trust in this when there is a lack of evidence. I merely stated that hypothetical question, as an argument against unessisary assumptions.



[edit on 31/7/10 by awake_and_aware]



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 05:56 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by ChickenPie

The alternative to not believing in God is to believe that something just happened to come from nothing and that something just so happened to unfold into a universe with a degree of order that allowed life as we know it to take place here on earth.


What is energy. Where did it come from? Was it just always in existence?

Could energy have its own evolution into consciousness? Rather then consciousness creating energy.


I don't see how energy itself could have evolved into conscious form unless an outside force caused it to evolve that way. Do you know of such a natural process?



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:04 PM
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Originally posted by ChickenPie


I don't see how energy itself could have evolved into conscious form unless an outside force caused it to evolve that way. Do you know of such a natural process?


Why not? (I didn't say form - - I said consciousness - - form comes later).

" . . . . Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.



[edit on 31-7-2010 by Annee]



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:04 PM
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Originally posted by ChickenPie

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by ChickenPie

The alternative to not believing in God is to believe that something just happened to come from nothing and that something just so happened to unfold into a universe with a degree of order that allowed life as we know it to take place here on earth.


What is energy. Where did it come from? Was it just always in existence?

Could energy have its own evolution into consciousness? Rather then consciousness creating energy.


I don't see how energy itself could have evolved into conscious form unless an outside force caused it to evolve that way. Do you know of such a natural process?


For all you know the universe could be a bubble within foam like a large cell,Its a possibility, not an assumption. And i won't enforce that theory upon anyone without expecting critisism, thats the basis of all scientific endorsement and progress.

[edit on 31/7/10 by awake_and_aware]



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by adjensen
How would you ever expect to find common ground or, at the very least, gain respect for your view if you misrepresent your opponent over and over?


How is there common ground between an Atheist and a Theist?


Um... we're both human beings and presumably interested in making the world a better place?



Your posts are all the same message. What is misrepresented?


What is my message, then? And I'll save you the trouble, it is not "people can't exist without God", as you misrepresented.

If you disagree with my statements, particularly the one that I called you on, the invalidity of internalizing morality, then demonstrate where I'm wrong. Show me how a child who is selfish and narcissistic becomes altruistic without a parent or someone else teaching that.

But if all you're going to do is whinge that I have a different opinion than you do, what's the point of that?



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:11 PM
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Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by adjensen
How would you ever expect to find common ground or, at the very least, gain respect for your view if you misrepresent your opponent over and over?


How is there common ground between an Atheist and a Theist?


Um... we're both human beings and presumably interested in making the world a better place?



Wouldn't that be a separate thread? "How can Atheists and Theists co-exist?

I think this thread is actually about Atheism. Or questions about Atheism.



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:17 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


Keep talking sense Annee, Star 4 u!



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:29 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Annee
 


Keep talking sense Annee, Star 4 u!


Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

Blushing



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:29 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
Firstly, God is the unsessisary


Firstly, the word is "unnecessary."


assumption there is no "alternative" because that is the illogical concept anyway, all i am saying is science doesn't know


I know science doesn't know, which is why I'm using reason or philosophy.

The issue is if you do not believe in God, then it follows that the universe was arbitrarily created from nothing by nothing; and our universe just so happens to hold observable laws--which can be understood with logic--that allowed for life here on earth, some of which is intelligent enough to question their own existence. There is also the possibility that there just so happens to be some cold eternal natural process that ultimately set everything in motion (lucky for us!). But if we're going to actually consider that idea, then I don't see why we couldn't consider the idea that this eternal source can think (i.e., God). After all, that would explain why the universe seems designed. In other words, there is an intelligent eternal source that consciously created an ordered universe, or there is an eternal natural process that created our ordered universe by chance.


Secondly, and again, science doesn't know that the universe is infinite for sure, but its a possibility, but no one has enough reason to put "faith" or trust in this when there is a lack of evidence. I merely stated that hypothetical question, as an argument against unessisary assumptions.


Let me make this simple for you... Do or do you not believe the possibility of something eternal that ultimately set everything in motion is a plausible idea?

[edit on 31-7-2010 by ChickenPie]



posted on Jul, 31 2010 @ 06:32 PM
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Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by ChickenPie


I don't see how energy itself could have evolved into conscious form unless an outside force caused it to evolve that way. Do you know of such a natural process?


Why not? (I didn't say form - - I said consciousness - - form comes later).



OK... my rebuttal still stands.

Also, if you're just throwing out possibilities... then fine... Why are you so against the possibility of God?



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