Russian Bomber Incursions.."Inside the Ring"

Duplicity and subterfuge.

How is it OK to allow overflights of armed weapons systems, and how is it spun into some inconsequential "ego" game?

"Oh them? Yeah, whatever..., we'll chase them if we feel like it."

What am I missing? Oh yeah, context.

Does that mean we can start painting red stars again on the adversary aircraft out at strike, in NAS Fallon, oh boy, maybe I can get back in, while it's exciting....

reply to post by Max_TO


Well, apart from HAARP, even if said bombers are flying near the Alaskan mainland at high altitude, we do have the hardware which usually detects them before they get close enough to do any theoretical damage (not that they're even loaded with anything).

I say this, first of all, because I live in Alaska and I know what military installations we have nearby and second because I'm a civilian contractor that works on military installations up here so I have seen almost all of them. I also spent 6 years in the USAF working in Munitions Systems (2w0x1 career field) and I was stationed at Eielson AFB for my final "long tour" before I separated.

We have the satellite tracking station in Clear AFB which actually has alot more than just satellite tracking equipment. Plus, we have the missile defense site at Fort Greely which has some of its own tracking hardware. Plus all the more remote, more inoquous military sites around the state that probably have all kinds of equipment for the purpose of defending against just this type of attack. This doesn't even include satellite assets and capabilities that might be able to track incomming aircraft at high altitude.

We have so much hardware up here in Alaska, specifically because of the incursions, that it's a wonder they keep trying. I have personally worked on a couple classified aviation-related projects in the Interior but obviously I can't say exactly what they were for..

Although I did spot some really odd looking aircraft at a remote landing strip located at Donnelly Training Area located just West of Fort Greely.. (Thread below).. Which could possibly be a new kind of drone.. But it doesn't match the dimensions of anything else known of publicly in the military inventory. Possible uses could obviously include defense from Russian intrusion at high altitude but who knows!

Odd-looking Military Aircraft in the Alaskan Wilderness

-ChriS

reply to post by Maxmars

How is it OK to allow overflights of armed weapons systems, and how is it spun into some inconsequential "ego" game?

There has to be some kind of gain here for the US to allow/ tolerate these flights. My guess is it is intelligence gathering regarding Russian electronic capabilities. How do they respond to an electronic hit? What is their profile?

Valuable info in the intelligence field and where else do you get it? ...

reply to post by plumranch


Very good point.
There are tons of intel that can be gained by allowing them in close.
The old game of Cat and Mouse works both ways, they see how far they can come without detection and we see what counter measures they'll employ etc.

Both sides gain.

reply to post by SLAYER69


You also don't want to respond to every flight as that also reveal your response time to them. It's better to keep them guessing about your capabilities. I had to laugh last year when our idiot Defense Minister Peter McKay made a big deal about a BEAR-F making a run towards Tuktoyuktuk. It never entered Canadian airspace. Of course there was an election going so it was just saber rattling.

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
The next one that crosses the line we should shoot it down.

I bet they would think twice before doing it again for awhile.



Their tech is so far behind ours it is laughable.

They are truly clutching at straws just like the Chinese. Just remember everything you see today is 40 year old tech. To bad we had to bankrupt our country to do it.

You Americans think you're so superior to everybody else, sorry to inform you but you're not. You're just as vulnerable to nuclear attacks as everybody else, you're also MORE LIKELY to be attacked because of you're high handed attitude to the rest of the world. If your nation would chill out and stop trying the be the big boys in the playground you wouldn't have to panic about Russians flying near you.

Not entirely sure why this is even considered news. This used to be a daily occurrence, back in the Cold War. Which is still the going on, they just don't call it the Cold (We're friends now, honest! We're just testing your airspace. Oops, are those our spies, can we have them back?) War.

"Gentlemen, comrades, do not be concerned about all you hear about glasnost and perestroika and democracy in the coming years. These are primarily for outward consumption. There will be no significant internal change within the Soviet Union, other than for cosmetic purposes. Our purpose is to disarm the Americans and let them fall asleep." - Mikhail Gorbachev

Originally posted by yellowbeard

Originally posted by Subjective Truth
The next one that crosses the line we should shoot it down.

I bet they would think twice before doing it again for awhile.



Their tech is so far behind ours it is laughable.

They are truly clutching at straws just like the Chinese. Just remember everything you see today is 40 year old tech. To bad we had to bankrupt our country to do it.

You Americans think you're so superior to everybody else, sorry to inform you but you're not. You're just as vulnerable to nuclear attacks as everybody else, you're also MORE LIKELY to be attacked because of you're high handed attitude to the rest of the world. If your nation would chill out and stop trying the be the big boys in the playground you wouldn't have to panic about Russians flying near you.

Better is very subjective. Ya we have some crazy tech but at what cost and who are we actually going to use it on?


So save you crap for someone that cares I dont really care what you think. At the end of the day it really does not mean anything.

nice to know the top of the world armies act like 7 years old playground bullies...

Originally posted by plumranch

Russian Bomber Incursions.."Inside the Ring"

www.washingtontimes.com

Russia is continuing to fly strategic nuclear bombers near U.S. and Canadian airspace because the Russian military is seeking to maintain "the illusion of power," the commander of the U.S. Northern Command says.

Adm. Winnefeld, commander of the Colorado Springs-based Northcom. "They are trying to show the world that they are a powerful nation, and we're not giving them the satisfaction … ."

(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 10-7-2010 by mutante]

reply to post by SLAYER69


You're absolutely right.

I also think that allowing them limited access to our airspace once or twice would somewhat clarify the intent of these incursions although we already know what that intent is.

I'm not sure what intel could be gained by doing this save for studying the aircraft's flight path and alititude to figure out how far they are from potential targets before turning around. From there you could, theoretically, gain more intel on weapon capabilities, aircraft range and standard procedures for exiting said airspace.

In THIS case, in particular, the bombers were detected 500 miles from the Alaskan coast, according to the news story. However, we probably have the capability to detect them even further out than that I would imagine.

There's also a danger, though it is unlikely, of a Russian bomber crashing on American soil. These bombers probably aren't even loaded with anything but we know flying anywhere with nuclear weapons has its dangers and if a bomber crashes on American soil with a nuke in it's belly it would obviously cause alot of geopolitical chaos and possibly be a prelude to armed conflict.

Although the device would'nt go nuclear, it could contaminate a huge area and even if it doesn't it would still lead to geopolitical turmoil which could, in turn, lead to armed conflict.

I have no idea how many nukes America has lost completely due to aircraft malfunctions/crashes over the years but if I remember correctly it's pushing a dozen (which is a whole other can of worms). But it's proof of concept that it could happen. And It would be just like Russia to fly over America with a live nuke just to boast about it later.

Just this past March, Russian bombers incurred British Airspace before being escorted back out.

Russian bombers 'intercepted in British airspace'

So we know they're continuing to become bolder and bolder with these incursions. I think we even had a recent case where a Russian bomber flew a couple thousand feet over the deck of the USS Nimitz didn't we?

-ChriS