Looking for your opinion

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Ben Franklin "

I find my self wondering more and more each day , just where is this war on terror going to take all of us ? And the big question , is it worth it ?

Seeing how the government is suppose to be representing us , I need to ask my fellow ATS'ers , are you in favor of giving up freedom for safety ? Is it worth it ?
Or is it nothing more then a slippery slope that once started only gets worse with time ?

Speaking for myself , I personally feel that it will only get worse and any freedoms we give up now will never be returned even long after the war on terror is over , assuming thats even possible .

Look I am totally open to the possibility that I am wrong and don't know what the heck I am talking about . Perhaps these freedoms have saved us from some big attack , I just don't know ?

But still , I can't help but think that we have seen the end to a way of life we all enjoyed not that long ago . I will even go one further and say , I don't believe that these freedoms that have been given up ( including new government powers ) have done very little to protect us , in fact I think it has done the opposite .

Ok enough from me , please share your thoughts on this important issue ...

Is it worth giving up freedom for safety ?

Is it worth empowering the government to the point where they have dictatorial powers ?

Or , is this simply a matter of paranoid people getting all worked up over nothing and the government is really doing all of this for the best ?

I personally believe that our rights have already been taken and they are just kind of "letting us know" there are so many laws already in place to take our liberties, rights, and even conscience.

It doesn't matter who's elected, it doesn't matter who our Mayor is, or Congressman, we are but lost souls in a debate that has already been decided. In our history man has stood his ground, but this time around.. I wonder.

Here's a weird way to put it, but I believe that they have to give us for warning, and as we sit idly by and except this we will always be the victim of "war", security threats, and illegals. We fight for them, we always have and though the power have change, the agenda has stayed the same.


Peace to you...

This passage from the book " Propaganda " keeps coming to mind ...

Organizing Chaos
in every question, they would find it impossible to
come to a conclusion ( the public ) about anything. We have
voluntarily agreed to let an invisible government
sift the data and high-spot the outstanding issues so
that our field of choice shall be narrowed to practical
proportions. From our leaders and the media they
use to reach the public, we accept the evidence and
the demarcation of issues bearing upon public ques-
tions; from some ethical teacher, be it a minister, a
favorite essayist, or merely prevailing opinion, we
accept a standardized code of social conduct to which
we conform most of the time.

I also feel that this type of public manipulation and has been running rampant for a very long time now and I see this war on terror just another tool .

reply to post by Max_TO


Over-acting or over-reacting ?

That is the question ...

Official paranoia is a massive growth industry ,
and it distracts the population from any real issues.
It also serves to quieten dissent , because if you complain ,
you must be "one of them".

My young son was once impressed by the Navy.
A very large , nuclearpowered carrier was in port , and he hassled me to go and see it . We drove down there to have a look , and could only get to one kilometre away , where we encountered security guards every 50 metres , demanding that I NOT stop the car . I did , just to see their reaction. HA , pathetic . Yelling , screaming , panic .
That ship is capable of wiping out entire countries .
We are NO threat , and NEVER have been !

My son was totally disgusted ,

and is now mistrustful of our OWN side

SAD

It's not a war on terror when the U.S. sponsored the main event.
Its a war against the bill of rights & a war against non members of OPEC.

Google Video Link

Lets say that TPTB see us as something other than "human". As puppets as cattle, and they have to put us in control. With that said, if anyone who knows that the reality is order out of chaos, put in the order of those that make order out of chaos, we are scared, and helpless and even looking for body guards, that is why armed police are still in NY, as if 9-11 didn't happen 9 years ago.

Its adjustment, and we have followed the leader, and we weren't even choosy about who our leaders were. I cringe to what we have left for future generations. The way that we think of cave men is the way that our future will see us.

We didn't stand, we didn't stand together and we didn't stand alone. We sat. ate, watch sports, drank, and didn't have a worry in the world. When you teach an entire people that this lifetime is a one time deal, and there are no consequences this is what we get. We live for the future, and we have left nothing but slavery for those after us.

Peace to you...

Terrorism It is to make us afraid. Fear is the best motivator. Heck why would they take our freedom when will will beg them to make us safe.


They are boogie men made up just like the villains in movies and t.v. The only problem is we are growing tired of it and the fear is wearing off over time.


So they will need something new like a sickness or a disaster. So we will once again live in fear. And then they can come and swoop in and make everything all right.



It is simple really----Problem+Solution=We are screwed.


And look around most people are so stupid it will work. We will loose. It is only a matter of time.

reply to post by zzombie


I see that video as evidence that these PTB do reach out to some in the so called " truth movement "whom they think that they might be able to convert and recruit as a disinfo agent , glad Aaron Russo told him where to go .

reply to post by Subjective Truth


Of course its to make us afraid, but the majority either wants it to go further or are not awakened to the facts, my worry isn't about those of us who know these are tactics, it TPTB that know that the asleep will run with it.

I fear them more.

Peace to you...

Of course the government can kill anybody.

It's the human nature that allows such things to go on.

Life, Liberty, all that sort of thing sounds really good, especially when it's attributed to rights "given to all by the creator."

Cool. God gave me these "rights", but men can take them away.

Unless you refuse to give them up. And where does that get you?

I know it was just a movie, but I watched a movie where Custer held three Native American chiefs as hostages. And Custer said he would free them upon when certain conditions would be met. These chiefs went willingly as hostages, by the way. And when the Custer character said this, the chiefs were amused. Why? Wondered Custer. Because these guys were already free. Like somebody could imprision their spirits. Bah!

Nobody can take my spirit. And so, I am always free.

But many people are willing to give up their spirit, for physical safety.
They are ignorant.

Once one gives up the spirit, then it's a long hard journey to get it back.
But can be done.

The idea of the founding of the U.S., was to give people the ability to say, NO to giving up their spirits and these God given rights. But people will trade these things easily, for some semblance of security.

Seriously, is this not sad? Give up the spirit within yourself for someone else to give you security? And when that someone else can't provide, can you then provide for yourself? Not very many people can do this.

Lost are skills, and lost are abilities, and lost are the will to do for yourselves.