Never before seen UFO photos - Debunkers?

Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
for me to believe that you are correct in your analysis, i would literally have to deny the experiences my five senses have provided me with and admit to myself my senses are not reliable.

who is right, your or my sensory perceptions, doc?
when someone is being diagnosed with dellusional misperceptions they are analyzed and patients of a panel of doctors with PhDs.

so if no one person can legally be permitted to diagnosis someone of any unsubstantiated mental dissorders, then how can you?

I usually enjoy your posts quite a bit. This one...? Assumptions and delusions are two different things. "Misperceptions" is not a mental illness, symptom, or even a word. I have not claimed to diagnose anyone with anything. I simply commented on what is clearly visible to anyone who can read English.

to make the claim people are too quick to assume anything is only a reflection of what you hold up for comparison when judging others, that is what you know of yourself is what you can accept is the reality as what must be plausible for them.

In other words, people are only capable of recognizing the aspects of other peoples intentions when they can recognize it within themselves, otherwise they are just full of

That is something your mom tells you when you are a kid so that you do not make fun of your sister or castigate your friend that likes to dance more than play ball. If what you were saying applied to reality, all psychiatrists would have to suffer all illnesses in order to be taken seriously at all. All cops would have to also have committed every crime in order to find guilt in anyone else. So let's dispense with empty platitudes that help us sleep at night.

case & point:
Homosexuality, a choice some say.
me? i'm a well versed hederosexual who can not even begin to imagine that even if i had every gun on this planet pointed at my head ... i still couldn't get sexually aroused by another man.

Sounds like you really gave it some thought.

That is super. The first thing I thought about when I read the ENTIRE OP was how someone could relate this to their own personal sexual proclivities. Thanks.

so those who say it is a choice are only correct and not lying if they themselves once looked at a person of the same sex and thought to themselves: "maybe".

You really had to reach for that one, didn't you? Shame. You are better than this.

otherwise, they are lying, aren't they? how else would they claim to know why?

Because they did not read the bold print at the bottom?

i'm not quick to assume, and i'm not eager to believe.

Then I guess what I said did not apply to you, did it? I commented on some other things that did not apply to you in a few other threads. Perhaps you want to opine on those too?

It seems that perhaps English is not your first language. If so, then I advise you to familiarize yourself with the word "assumption." Anyone that looked at these pictures and reacted by CLAIMING they were real or expressing that they BELIEVED they were real, were quite obviously assuming they were genuine photos and obviously so eager to believe that they did not stop to ask one single pertinent question. If they were not so eager and did not assume, they would have read the included text at the very least. Does that apply to you?

even if we totally dismiss 51% of all photos as junk, the odds are still in favor of us being visited by either our futures, our pasts, and/or being of origins as of yet unknown.

Slow down, pokey. You are going off on a tangent here that really does not apply to me so shhhh.

earth is only 1/9000 the age of the universe by most accepted accounts.

"we are attempting to communicate through time"
-Morgan Freeman, Wormhole Series

if we are attempting it, we are doing it....

maybe some people do not need the pictures either way.

perhaps science fictions' wildest imaginations don't even quantify the possibilities. maybe truth is the currency of choice between civilizations far older than us.....

I'M STAR TREK CAPT.

can i have your permission to turn theat "M" upside down? do i need your permission to do so?
can i have your permission to re-arrange those letters a different way? do i need your permission to do so?

PATRICK STEWART


but who am i, and what do i know,
ET

may the forces be with you,
ET

Wow dude. I am really not sure what you are going on about. You seem to think I am insulting anyone that believes in UFOs or alien life. That is not remotely what I said. I am simply thanking the OP for helping to demonstrate that some are not worth listening to because they will believe anything, including admitted fakes.

[edit on 7-7-2010 by K J Gunderson]

[edit on 7-7-2010 by K J Gunderson]

I don't get the point of this thread. Fishing for attention towards your "professional" digital skills? Ego boost? The 3rd one was really obvious. I think we all know that in this day and age, anyone with a copy of Photoshop can fake a UFO picture. So what's your point? That all pictures are fake? That we need real physical evidence and not just pictures? If that's it then all I have to say is... duh? Sad this got to the front page, was hoping for something interesting.

Good point you made here. It shows just how easy it is to make fakes.

I think it will make people consider pictures more carefully before judging pictures to be real. Well done.

Now a days web is filled with all kind of crap and fakery it is hard to seperate wheat from chaff.. any ways its very hard to believe any pics posted on web even though it looks legit.

This thread should not exist.
The OP is basically treating us all like children.
Of course we all know there are fakes and that most of the videos and photo's we see are indeed fakes. I don't need someone to tell me that. It's common sense.
What we do not need is another genius playing with images.

OP also said he got a kick out of some people not reading the whole thread and so left thinking they are real.. Great... so now we probably have these very same photo's floating around somewhere else on the net being touted as real.

Brilliant.

Thank you The_Zomar.

Originally posted by black cat

Originally posted by The_Zomar

Originally posted by -Blackout-
I have seen that 3rd picture somewhere before.......

Without the UFO I'm guessing, because I assure you I created it.

I actually got a kick out of the people that didn't read that they were fake and complimented the photos. I got a kick out of it because it further illustrates my point in creating this thread.

What point? That you like to make fun of people? This board on ATS exists for one purpose - to discuss and debate the issue of Extraterrestrials, so when someone posts a photo for analysis here one shouldn't have to wonder whether the OP is playing some stupid game with everyone else. Yes, there are unscrupulous individuals who will fake evidence, but this thread serves no purpose whatsoever other than to poke fun at people. And poking fun at people isn't what ATS is all about.

1. Read the entire OP, then you won't have to wonder if there's a game being played.

2. Use critical thinking on ALL posts - even those that don't self-identify as fakes.

Originally posted by wmd_2008
They see an orange orb float across the sky no noise the suddenly it shots of at high speed. NO what it was a chinese lantern and the candle goes out.
....
People see what they want not whats there thats the real problem with ufo pics and videos.

I agree with your post much more than the OP post. I DO NOT think most UFO pics and videos are fake, though SOME are.

I DO think MOST UFO pictures and videos are ordinary objects which are misidentified as UFOs, exactly as you suggest. In fact the position of MUFON is that MOST UFOs are natural phenomena or manmade objects.

The chinese lantern video you reference is an example. Even the misreporting of objects taking off at high speed when the light winks out, I don't really think is a hoax so much as a defect in the human perception system. Our brains try to make sense of what we see, so when we see a light wink out, we want to explain what happened to it so our brains tend to "fill in the blanks" by thinking it shot off at high speed when in fact it didn't.

Here's a perfect example:

Here's a case where we have an eyewitness with 20 years in the aviation industry (Paul Hurley), and I find him credible as in I don't think he's lying, I think he's being honest.

Listen to what he describes at 1m45s saying the UFOs "took off" !! This would clearly cause us to rule out the balloon theory.

video.google.com...#

Yet we know the objects didn't "take off" because they were just flares attached to balloons. This is just one example of how a witnesses mind plays tricks on them. They see an object one minute, don't see it the next so their brain tells tham it "took off" when in fact that's not what happened.

Paul Hurley is credible.
Paul Hurley is not lying.
But like any other eyewitness, you can't even trust him to accurately report even the most basic aspects about a sighting, like whether the object "took off" or not (and at what rate of speed, etc)

I admire the effort and the idea of this post.

I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU MEAN.... BUT-

I just don't think that it will have any sort of effect on the ATS readers who spot a mark on a film and scream ALIEN SPACESHIP GHOST GNOME MOON BASE!

They will just be insulted, post up some stupid 'mlarg your spost is shtupid' response and wander back to their respective caves.

To put it bluntly, People who are stupid enough to believe a blurry dot are a UFO cannot be convinced by your post. You will just have to wait until their carer takes them home, or they hit puberty.

What the post DOES, is get up the skirts of the respectful UFO Googlers lurking in ATS, they know a blur is a blur and a hubcap is a hubcap, they know its dumb, and they just think you are belittling the subject.

So even though I totally agree with you, I beg that you ignore the applause from the denier douches spluttering 'bahahahahabum thatll shutup the beleebers', I want to bring you back down to earth.

Illustrating the obvious to those who can not see the obvious is pointless.

reply to post by The_Zomar


I disagree with Most, as you would expect

All the Photos I believe are Real and NOT cooked

The only thing that is possibly false is the circumstances and their
Interpretation.

There is nothing special about any of those Photos
The power of suggestion is a very powerful tool, and some people can
be very easily convinced what it is they are looking at.

What saddens me with this thread is when you think of what's the point of this nonsense.

Do you want people to believe the UFO phenomenon is all real or all fake?

You don't need a hundered UFO stories or photos to believe in the UFO.

The fundamental point is if there is any outer space beings visiting earth or not at all, which is a very serious existential question.

I think this post is an IDIOTIC distraction.

People relax.

Do you think the OP made this post through animosity?

Do you genuinely think the OP wanted to show off his photoshop skills?

Do you really think he is aiming to treat us like children?

If you answered yes to any of the above I'm afraid you are too paranoid of other humans and need a serious reality check.

The post is clearly not aimed at members who have been here for a long time, or for that matter, people who have studied ufos for a long time.

The OP clearly wanted to highlight a point, a point which helps some people on here deny ignorance. I'm sure, no matter how painful it may be to you, if you look deep within yourselves you can see the point the OP was trying to make.

Use your minds and intuition to understand what message the OP is wanting to convey. Pull yourself away from the normal robotic human reaction of defensiveness and aggression. Why attack when you can understand?

The OP is getting a hammering when all he/she wanted to do was spread some knowledge. I can totally see a point in my ATS life when this would have served me well and in many ways it serves me well today, reminding me not to get too heated up when I see an awesome picture of a saucer.

Part of denying ignorance is looking inside yourself and learning how to understand and react to situations like a wise and mature human.

I applaud you OP. Long have I thought of posting a "This is a test" thread on ATS! I have to laugh at the "poo-pooing" going on in this thread, this thread is a legitimate (if not more so) then any other. This thread is as lesson, a lesson that says you must be skeptical. Oh gosh, I know for many thats like dragging out "Socialism" in the political forums but its not something to be afraid of, its just a word.

(also I love the responces the clearly show they did not read the entire original post!)

[edit on 7-7-2010 by Helmkat]

Originally posted by black cat
This object:

Originally posted by The_Zomar

Desert Sphere

Is this image too good to be true? Most of the time that statement is true, but with this image we can see what appears to be a reflection on the surface of the water, and what may possibly be a shadow below (Don't quote me on that, it could be a smudge on the film) Some say it is a weather balloon, but I've never seen a metallic weather balloon before. This image was taken in Nevada.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f877d6edd36d.jpg[/atsimg]

Looks exactly the same as the object in this picture and others in the link below:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3d29d8366994.jpg[/atsimg]

www.ufoevidence.org...

Except the picture you posted was taken in Nevada and the one I posted was supposedly from Zdany, Poland.

Edit: I just read the bottom of your post that you say you created these pictures. Threads like this one don't serve any purpose but to mock believers in UFOs and discredit legitimate sightings, despite what you say about being a believer.

Incidentally, you say you "created" these pics. How did you create that one over the "Nevada" desert? Did you actually create it or did you just copy it from another website and claim it as your own work?

As for the last UFO that object is the same as one of the STS "Tether" UFOs or one of the objects seen in orbit around Earth.

[edit on 6-7-2010 by black cat]



[edit on 6-7-2010 by black cat]

Zdany Poland = HAOX

Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
for me to believe that you are correct in your analysis, i would literally have to deny the experiences my five senses have provided me with and admit to myself my senses are not reliable.

who is right, your or my sensory perceptions, doc?

We know our sensory perceptions are not reliable, right? So why wouldn't we admit that? I sure admit it and if you don't admit it, I think you need to investigate further.

For example:

en.wikipedia.org...

That's a list of demonstrations on how fallible our senses can be. According to Tyson we should call those "brain failures" instead of optical illusions, because they demonstrate how easily our senses can be fooled.


Neil Tyson explains how unreliable our senses are and that they absolutely cannot be trusted to be accurate, and he's right.

Originally posted by notsoperfect
What saddens me with this thread is when you think of what's the point of this nonsense.

Do you want people to believe the UFO phenomenon is all real or all fake?

You don't need a hundered UFO stories or photos to believe in the UFO.

I think he just wants you to slow down and ask a few questions before just believing any evidence handed to you. How can that be anything but good for the UFO believer?

I believe in the UFO phenomena but to be honest, ATS is killing that. There are so many threads full of people just believing anything that finding a genuinely interesting UFO story around here is really quite hard. Everyone I click on leaves me wanting for my time.

So many people saying "proof" and "evidence" only to post something either easily debunked or far to hard decipher to be any proof or evidence of anything but bad photography. After a a while, it makes me trepidatious to click on a UFO thread.

If people just follow the advice I think this thread has to share, there would be fewer UFO threads on ATS but they would all be incredibly interesting instead of this junk pile of blurry lights and bugs on windshields we have now.

The fundamental point is if there is any outer space beings visiting earth or not at all, which is a very serious existential question.

I think this post is an IDIOTIC distraction.

What does that say of those distracted by it then?

reply to post by and14263


I don't believe he is "aiming" to do these things just that unfortunately it is seeming that way.
I am sure his post is honourable in it's intentions but the fact is that it could be clogging up the already clogged UFO information highway even more so my fear is that the opposite will be achieved.

If he wanted to educate people new in this field then this is not really the place to do it.

If nothing else this thread shows that a helluva lot of people don't read to the end of the original OP before replying, which is pretty bad.

I probably shouldn't be surprised - in 'the news business' (best followed with 'dhhhhhaaaarrrrrrlllling') they assume that most people don't read beyond the first four lines.

Can somebody move this to the hoax forum? I think the OP made his point.


Edit to say.... I look forward to these pictures turning up as genuine on UFO websites, magazines and ATS threads in the coming years.

[edit on 7-7-2010 by eightfold]

really like the 1st photo. good job on the thread fake out.
love it.
great idea.

Great thread! It really shows that more people need to read, and need to consider more likely options before they chalk things down to being unexplained. I am a firm believer that we are being visited, but this shows how easy it is to fool people, even when it is written in rather large letters that none of what you posted was real.

I really don't see how it is mocking believers. If you are so blind that you'll believe any old shape in a photograph without thinking about terrestrial objects, then you are setting yourself up to be mocked. Not that I personally would mock anyone, but that it is how it comes across. Blinkers really aren't productive to the discussions and debates about UFO's and other unexplained phenomenon.

In the interests of letting people know how I look for fakes, here it is.

With the third picture, the reflection didn't line up and when I zoomed in I could see the pixels around the object in the sky. That was a dead giveaway. Always look for the pixel halo. I use firefox as my browser with the "zoom" add on to save time. And consider the composition of the photographs you are looking at. If they are perfectly positioned, they shouldn't be. It's not an aesthetic shot, it's a hastily captured UFO shot. This was far too perfect.

The black and white photograph was far too compressed, and I generally automatically rule those out right away. It's so easy to hoax something on such a compressed scale, where artifacts start popping up and leading to gross misidentifications.

I saw nothing worth talking about in the Europe one. I would have counted those as either chemtrails or fine clouds if this hadn't been in this section, and they looked so nondescript anyway.

Above Rome also suffered from the pixel halo, and where the "craft" met the window, I could see a dark line indicating it had been placed there.

The only one I had problems with was the first one. That was pretty convincing with the motion blur considering it looks like a shot taken from a car.

If someone can hoax these and admit to it, just bear in mind what the unscrupulous hoaxers can do.

I'll try and explain these sightings in number order:

1. Looks like a bird but the most interesting.

2.Could be a camera artificate as back in those days it took hours to take a photo.

3. That one looks exactly like this one from Zdany, Poland which looks like two bowls were stuck or welded together and thrown, reference:

www.ufoevidence.org...

4. Looks like a water droplet on the lens

5. Looks like a small crack in the window

Thats my explanations of these anyway

[edit on 7/7/2010 by diamount]