It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Who is to serve who between God and man?

page: 1
0
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 04:30 PM
link   
Who is to serve who between God and man?

Some seem to think that man was created to serve or appease a need within God.
To do as commanded and love and adore Him. They also indicate that if we do not do so, a resentful and vengeful God punishes those who will not do so forever.
Christians tend to say, turn or burn while denying that there is a hell.

Others think that God is here to serve man as savior and scapegoat that we ride into heaven. He serves to the point of dying for us while at the same time the Bible tells us that we are perfect. Something that most Christians do not believe. Why we, Gods perfect works, would need saving remains unanswered.

Who is to be master and who is to be slave?

Are we here to serve or to be served?

Is the master to die for His slaves or are the slaves to die for the master?

The vicarious sacrifice of Jesus was refused by God. As it should have been. It was immoral.

Why have you forsaken me is answered here.

Pro 21:3 To do justice and judgment [is] more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice.

Spa 49:7 None [of them] can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:
To the idea of blood sacrifice----

Are you willing to look up these and comment on our salvation without the blood or Jesus?

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

Regards
DL




posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 04:56 PM
link   
"The vicarious sacrifice of Jesus was refused by God. As it should have been. It was immoral.

Why have you forsaken me is answered here.

Pro 21:3 To do justice and judgment [is] more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice."




No the sarafic wasn't denied by God. That verse Christ was going over is found in Psalms 2:21 I think.

" why hast thou forsaken me "

Christ was going over the Psalm signifying that the saints would have to go through a dark night of the soul to reach perfection.

Every saint went through the dark night of the soul.


Now as for the bible saying we are perfect.

That's not correct. it says we are all sinners and need conversion. Unless the bible blatantly contradicts itself which is not true. It's out of context.



We are here to serve but in a communial way. We have Christ literally living in us. Through communion Christ enters the soul and it rises to perfection unless we stop going.

The soul fills with grace and is removed of all its self love, pride, self importance and Christ enters in. We no longer live, but he in us.

It's a communial thing.

I have gone to communion and felt this, and it's unmistakable. The graces I can pinpoint when they enter in every time of the day when i used to go.

Some saints even reaching ecstacy.


So we serve him, he serves our soul.


peace oP.



[edit on 6-7-2010 by JesusisTruth]



posted on Jul, 6 2010 @ 04:59 PM
link   
Oh and that why hast thou forsaken me has been used by rebellious people like system of a down.

They are idiots. They don't take time to study why God said that and who gets destroyed over it?

People like the OP and millions of clueless headbangers.

the age of lies.

Sorry for the rant OP.



[edit on 6-7-2010 by JesusisTruth]



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 12:49 AM
link   

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Who is to be master and who is to be slave?


no more of either

we are waiting on the "Liberator."



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 01:06 PM
link   
JesusisTruth

Where does the perfection line that God begins end?
This says that it does not.

Must be out of context right?

If you do not like and agree then show a verse where God is said to create imperfection.

Deuteronomy 32:4
He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

When did God, the good tree begin to produce evil fruit?

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 01:08 PM
link   

Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Who is to be master and who is to be slave?


no more of either

we are waiting on the "Liberator."


So that he can do our work.

God is to serve man once again then.

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 02:37 PM
link   
" a good tree cannot bear good fruit "

Its out of context. We he means in that verse is on the individual soul itself.

It was in context that you judge each man according to his works and fruit. If you were right evil wouldn't exist but it does.

But it's not bad fruit on Gods part. It's lack of God in that soul. We are like souless burnt coals wthout Gods grace in us.



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 11:25 PM
link   
there is nothing created that isn't created of GOD!

how can a soul lack GOD when GOD is the substance of all things? GOD is in us and we are in GOD.

EVERYTHING is included or else it would not exist.



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 01:22 AM
link   
For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 6who gave himself as a ransom for all men—the testimony given in its proper time.-1Tim2

His body was like chrysolite, his face like lightning, his eyes like flaming torches, his arms and legs like the gleam of burnished bronze, and his voice like the sound of a multitude.-Dan10.6



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 12:26 PM
link   
q anne. wow, there is no understanding today. This is giving me a headache trying to explain the easiest things.


" how can a soul lack GOD when GOD is the substance of all things? GOD is in us and we are in GOD. "

In (terms of love) Love is God, that's NOT in everybody, trust me. It's called graces. God infuses them in souls.

In sin graces cease in souls gradually. This is biblical. That's why Christ said, if you live in sin you die in sin.


Yes God created everything, but his grace is only in certain souls.


peace.



posted on Jul, 9 2010 @ 06:52 AM
link   

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Some seem to think that man was created to serve or appease a need within God.
To do as commanded and love and adore Him. They also indicate that if we do not do so, a resentful and vengeful God punishes those who will not do so forever.
Christians tend to say, turn or burn while denying that there is a hell.



If a "Christian" denies there is a Hell, chances are they are not a follower of Jesus Christ, but a wolf in sheep's clothing. No other figure in the Bible spoke/taught/warned about Hell more than Jesus Christ Himself. To deny Hell is to say/think Jesus was a liar.



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:10 AM
link   

Originally posted by JesusisTruth



"The vicarious sacrifice of Jesus was refused by God. As it should have been. It was immoral.

Why have you forsaken me is answered here.

Pro 21:3 To do justice and judgment [is] more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice."


No the sarafic wasn't denied by God. That verse Christ was going over is found in Psalms 2:21 I think.

" why hast thou forsaken me "

Christ was going over the Psalm signifying that the saints would have to go through a dark night of the soul to reach perfection.

Every saint went through the dark night of the soul.


Now as for the bible saying we are perfect.

That's not correct. it says we are all sinners and need conversion. Unless the bible blatantly contradicts itself which is not true. It's out of context.



We are here to serve but in a communial way. We have Christ literally living in us. Through communion Christ enters the soul and it rises to perfection unless we stop going.

The soul fills with grace and is removed of all its self love, pride, self importance and Christ enters in. We no longer live, but he in us.

It's a communial thing.

I have gone to communion and felt this, and it's unmistakable. The graces I can pinpoint when they enter in every time of the day when i used to go.

Some saints even reaching ecstacy.


So we serve him, he serves our soul.


peace oP.



[edit on 6-7-2010 by JesusisTruth]


My my. Belief in silly dogma right up to your eyeballs.
I see you like to make un-provable statements. Must be hard walking about with such a swelled head.

"Every saint went through the dark night of the soul."

This is impossible to know as a fact silly.

----------------------------------

"That's not correct. it says we are all sinners and need conversion. Unless the bible blatantly contradicts itself which is not true."

The bible does quite often. Like here.

Born in sin is not scripture.

In fact, Genesis is arguably not our fall but our elevation to gaining our moral sense.

Born in sin is not scripture.

In fact, Genesis is arguably not our fall but our elevation to gaining our moral sense.

To Adams sin being passed down.
Ezekiel 18:20
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

-----------------------------

"We are here to serve but in a communial way. We have Christ literally living in us."

Yet God, the slave owner died, well sort off, for his slaves.
That is the master serving us as our scapegoat.

BTW, if we are to discuss much, stop your #ing preaching.

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:14 AM
link   

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
Oh and that why hast thou forsaken me has been used by rebellious people like system of a down.

They are idiots. They don't take time to study why God said that and who gets destroyed over it?

People like the OP and millions of clueless headbangers.

the age of lies.

Sorry for the rant OP.



[edit on 6-7-2010 by JesusisTruth]


You seem to lie quite easily.
You are not sorry at all.
Do try to be more honest.

Now, you should know that blood sacrifice is not scripture.

God rejected the vicarious atonement of Jesus as it would be immoral to offer it or accept it.

Why have you forsaken me is answered with this .

Pro 21:3 To do justice and judgment [is] more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice.

Psa 49:7 None [of them] can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:


As to the idea of blood sacrifice----

Are you willing to look up these and comment on our salvation without the blood or Jesus?

www.youtube.com...

www.youtube.com...

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:17 AM
link   

Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Who is to be master and who is to be slave?


no more of either

we are waiting on the "Liberator."


Jesus. The slowest God in history.

"And behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according to his work shall be. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

Jesus Christ, Revelation 22:12-13

Any idea why Jesus abandoned the ancients?
Why not hang around and do the savior bit at that time.
Hell, he even said that the time of the end was at hand.

Could it be that Jesus is just a myth?

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:20 AM
link   

Originally posted by JesusisTruth

" a good tree cannot bear good fruit "

Its out of context. We he means in that verse is on the individual soul itself.

It was in context that you judge each man according to his works and fruit. If you were right evil wouldn't exist but it does.

But it's not bad fruit on Gods part. It's lack of God in that soul. We are like souless burnt coals wthout Gods grace in us.



Quite a slave mentality you have there.

If we are to also judge God by His works and you think them imperfect then you believe your God to be a loser. Tsk tsk.

You think way too much like other Christians who see God as a loser.

Is God and His works perfect.

The way many Christian see God is to see Him screwing up heaven with evil.
Strike one.
They then see God screwing up man's beginning in Eden.
Strike two.
They then see God cleaning house in Noah's day with Genocide and starting over.
Strike three.
They now wait for His return at end time to clean house yet again.
Strike four.

Strike four?

God plays by His own rules I guess.

You and I both know that this view must be false if God‘s works are as perfect as scripture indicates.

To my way of thinking, God gets things right the first time and every time.

This is why He has not and will not return. His perfect systems are here today the same way that they were here in the beginning. He judged Eden as good.

It is just to us to see it. I do. Even with sin and evil and woes, all is perfect and humming along exactly as God wants it to. I call it evolving perfection.

Did your version of God get it right or does He need to return to fix things?

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:22 AM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 


Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who was a pattern of the one to come.
15But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God's grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many! 16Again, the gift of God is not like the result of the one man's sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification. 17For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God's abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ.-Rom5



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:23 AM
link   

Originally posted by No King but Jesus
For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 6who gave himself as a ransom for all men—the testimony given in its proper time.-1Tim2

His body was like chrysolite, his face like lightning, his eyes like flaming torches, his arms and legs like the gleam of burnished bronze, and his voice like the sound of a multitude.-Dan10.6




B S.

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:29 AM
link   

Originally posted by JesusisTruth





Yes God created everything, but his grace is only in certain souls.


peace.


Rather a tribal mentality. You must be old. No wonder you think like you do. Senile.

What a game for God to play!
Create a place for eternal bliss as well as a place for eternal suffering.
Then create beings whom you love dearly and watch over.
And in the end, decide which to consider "trash" and "throw away" into the place for eternal suffering and which to cling to and love in the place for eternal bliss.
Even man, with all his faults, is greater and more responsible.

Do you not realize that your view says that if you have 3 children, you will only love 2 of your 3. If you are not that big a fool then do not make God out to be one either.

Show you can still think now old timer.

Regards
DL



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:32 AM
link   
reply to post by Greatest I am
 

They will say, "Where is this 'coming' he promised? Ever since our fathers died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation." 5But they deliberately forget that long ago by God's word the heavens existed and the earth was formed out of water and by water. 6By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed. 7By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire.But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.-2Pet3

After two days he will revive us; on the third day he will restore us, that we may live in his presence.-Hos6.2



posted on Jul, 16 2010 @ 07:35 AM
link   

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Greatest I am

Some seem to think that man was created to serve or appease a need within God.
To do as commanded and love and adore Him. They also indicate that if we do not do so, a resentful and vengeful God punishes those who will not do so forever.
Christians tend to say, turn or burn while denying that there is a hell.



If a "Christian" denies there is a Hell, chances are they are not a follower of Jesus Christ, but a wolf in sheep's clothing. No other figure in the Bible spoke/taught/warned about Hell more than Jesus Christ Himself. To deny Hell is to say/think Jesus was a liar.


Then Jesus was a liar.
No self respecting God would create such an immoral construct.

Prove it for yourself by answering these truthfully.

Is it good justice that a man can only sin for 120 years and then must suffer for 1200000000000000000000+ years?

It is good justice for punishment to continue after the attitude or action have been changed by repentance?

If no repentance is forthcoming, is it good justice to continue torture without a purpose?

Hell would be immoral. Right?

Regards
DL



new topics

top topics



 
0
<<   2 >>

log in

join