“If You Don’t Believe Me, Then You’re Ignorant.”

We say “deny ignorance”, we are in a constant struggle to “deny ignorance”, we try to persuade others to “deny ignorance” and sometimes we even “deny ignorance” from our selves. On the surface “deny ignorance” is an elegant, symbiotic and near perfect motto for a site that strives to “deny ignorance” by disproving that which “they believe to be true”. Yet what is ignorance, what is it we are denying, how do we know that why we are denying is not leading us down the path towards real ignorance.

This word “ignorance” and it varies forms are tossed around ATS all the time. People will often say to someone they disagree with “you are ignorant, why?, because you disagree with me”, that does not make a person ignorant. The term has a number of different forms such as accusations of spreading lies and my personal favourite “disinfo agent”. Sometimes a “lie” is the result of a genuine mistake but you are pounced as “spreading lies”, this does not help deny ignorance it only show’s both parties are ignorant. The state of one being ignorant is now an insult, it’s a put down, this should not be the case we should be helping each other understand the world, not judging those who understand less than ourselves. A perfect example is the reaction one receives when saying “I believe the official 9/11 story”, almost without hesitation you will be branded as “Ignorant” and the motto “deny ignorance” says that you should be held with distrust as what you have said is untrue and this inevitably leads to aggressive posts with no substance.

What if it is all backwards, what if it is them, they who talk down to you because of your “ignorance” who are the people that are really in a state of ignorance. What if everything that the “mainstream” tells us is true, is true. That it is us who are deliberately on a conquest to feed ourselves with as much ignorance as our gluttony to prove them wrong will allow. We have become so blinded in our attempts to “deny ignorance” that we have become ignorant to that which is real and true.

I would say it is Ignorant to say the world is going to end in 2012, we are regularly visited by UFO’s, we can predict the future, say your phone can take pictures of itself and ignorant to believe that your friend is in fact a extra terrestrial. However there are some on ATS who would call me ignorant for holding these claims an untrue as they fanatically believe in such concepts.

The point I am trying to make here is that ignorance is specific to the person depending on their believes. Just because a person does not hold the same truths as yourself does not mean they are ignorant. Therefore the motto “deny ignorance” is meaningless as ignorance means different things to different people.


[edit on 5-7-2010 by kevinunknown]

I completely agree. In the end, none of us really know what is going on the world, and to brand others as ignorant for believing a different story than we do is pretty ignorant of us, because not one of us here has undeniable proof of anything out of the ordinary... or else we wouldn't need this place, would we?

Thanks for this. It helps us open our minds and really see things from ALL perspectives before making up our minds and deciding that everyone who disagrees is just an ignorant disinfo agent.

OP

Saying to deny ignorance is like saying to be honest
If someone tells you, you can trust me I am honest, would you believe him rather then the man that acts honest and never make such a statement?

reply to post by kevinunknown


Fairly deep rant kev.

I think you may be mistaking ignorance among ourselves, with the goal of ATS of refusing to believe 'official' crap, hook line and sinker, and thus denying ignorance fed to the masses.

I hear you though, but i tend to think that certain people are deliberately obtuse, for reasons best known to themselves, and will argue the toss regardless of fact or fiction.

Cheers.

Ignorance is the lack of knowledge. Denying ignorance is a misnomer of sorts because when you are denying ignorance, it means that you are in search of knowledge, not that you have that knowledge so, in fact, you are ignorant in your search for knowledge.

Wow, I think I just called myself ignorant!

[edit on 5/7/2010 by Iamonlyhuman]

reply to post by spikey


Its not meant as a rant, rather a philosophical perspective of our motto “deny ignorance.”

Na who I am tiring to kid, it’s a rant.

In a way we are all ignorant.

We dont know what is really going on and to state otherwise would be well ... ignorant.

It doesnt matter what you believe, be it the mainstream or the alternative theories. I think to "deny ignorance" would be to question everything. To apply logical and critical thought to every subject matter that comes up. Not to make a judgement or dismiss something off hand but to research into it and discuss it and try and have an informed and more well rounded opinion. It takes both sceptics and believers to unearth the real truth behind a situation, or concept.

As such i find it to be the perfect motto for this site.

Not all of us believe the same things. But we all take a step closer to the real "truth" when we work together and listen to each others perspectives and reasoning.

~TR~

reply to post by andy1033


andy i would love to see you open a thread discussing this mind control you have experienced. i have heard you casually throw that out there many times without any follow up. im in no way saying you have not been a subject to these experaments but i am curious for details, if you have a thread about your personal experience out there id love for you to U2U me a link, thanks in advance.

On topic

you make some great points OP. Whenever i see an OP defending his theory with vieled insults to thier opponents reading comprehension or level of ignorance i am highly disapointed .

~meathead

reply to post by kevinunknown

I would say it is Ignorant to say the world is going to end in 2012, we are
regularly visited by UFO’s, we can predict the future, say your phone can take
pictures of itself and ignorant to believe that your friend is in fact a extra terrestrial.

And you would be incorrect. This is not ignorance. It may be incorrect. But even if these things are all untrue, someone who believes them is not "ignorant" of them.

Ignorance is a lack of knowledge or awareness.

It has nothing to do with belief.

Let me say that again:

IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH BELIEF.

If you are unaware of something, you are ignorant of it. If you are aware of something, you are not ignorant of it, regardless of your own personal beliefs on the matter. For example, let's say a person is aware that the US military occassionally tracks unidentified flying objects, and beleives that they are alien spaceships. That person is not ignorant of UFO's. And let's say that another person is aware that the US military occassionally tracks unidentified flying objects, and beleives that they're weather balloons. That person iss also not ignorant of UFO's.

They simply have different beliefs.



[edit on 5-7-2010 by LordBucket]

reply to post by LordBucket


With respect you have taken that entirely out of context. I believe these things are ignorant because I think stem from a lack of knowledge or awareness and thus ignorance. Such as in you example, the person only believes they are UFO’s because that person is ignorant of the existence of the weather balloons. However this is more of a side point, what i was trying to get at in the op is that just because a person does not hold the same truth as your self does not make them ignorant.

reply to post by andy1033


Could you elaborate on your experiences of mind control.

reply to post by kevinunknown


He just spams that in every thread he visits. He will not answer you.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
There are donzens of more i just did not feel like posting them.

reply to post by kevinunknown


I don't agree.

IMO everybody understands the underlying concept of being ignorant.

Also, it's not the one where ignorance means you were just un-educated about the topic.

Deny Ignorance means don't be ignorant. Don't willfully block your mind from receiving new information, new viewpoints and potentially having your views challenged.

To be ignorant here on ATS is something entirely different than the text book definition.

We are a community of open minded and truth seeking individuals, if we, on purpose attempt to quell other's quest for truth or do not hold their opinions and beliefs at the same level as our own then we are being ignorant.

~Keeper

I think i made this same thread a while back, link is in my sig.

reply to post by zaiger


Ah right seems a bit stupid, I thought you were talking about me at first. Who knows maybe he will use this opportunity to tell us everything.

Hi, denyer fans.

What the BLEEP do you know about ignorance, to talk about it ! ! ??
B-))

Now do some reshearches, readings, and film vewings,
about the first line of my signature !

It will inform you about things you ignore, for the moment. B-)

Blue skies.

reply to post by C-JEAN


Oh i was interested in doing some "researches" where do i start?

Originally posted by C-JEAN
Hi, denyer fans.

What the BLEEP do you know about ignorance, to talk about it ! ! ??
B-))

Now do some reshearches, readings, and film vewings,
about the first line of my signature !

It will inform you about things you ignore, for the moment. B-)

Blue skies.

What the bleep is a propaganda piece, read further on what that film is about and where it came from, you'll be surprised..

Sure the quantum physics is cool and all that, but that's about it. There's as much fact in that film as in a bowl of rice crispies.

~Keeper

Hi zaiger.

Originally posted by zaiger
Oh i was interested in doing some "researches" where do i start?

Start with
IXQUICK SEARCH
us2.ixquick.com...
after clicking on the [my settings] button,
put some "key words" in the wide rectangle.
B-)

Blue skies.