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Why is sorcery considered so bad by so many?

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posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:08 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


Then you havn't gone back far enough.

Amun was a local god, a sky and wind god of Thebes similar to En-Lil.

It was only later that he was turned into a Deus Absconditus. That kind of bizarre nonsense went on throughout the dynastic period of Egypt.

Horus, the chief god of Upper Egypt, ends up as the son of some minor god that didn't even exist in pre dyanstic Egypt.

Set, chief god of Lower Egypt, ends up getting second place at first by another minor deity elevated to greatness, then later he's demonized after getting involved in a divine soap opera where he kills the new father of Horus.

Looking at the predynastic material I have read so far, I am about convinced Set and Horus were the same god, both chief Sky and weather gods, patrons of the monarchy of their kingdoms, just like En-Lil.




posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:10 AM
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the original chart



source
www.balaams-ass.com...



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:12 AM
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
 


anu was back far enough to place amen in the anu role, and anu was the god of the heavens, right next to enlil and enki. and their histories predate the written bible.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:15 AM
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ANu's etymology traced backwards from Egyptian god amen.

YMN
AMUN
AMEN
AMON
MONTU
MENTU
ENTU
ENU
EN
ANU
AN



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:21 AM
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Originally posted by undo
reply to post by MikeboydUS
 


anu was back far enough to place amen in the anu role, and anu was the god of the heavens, right next to enlil and enki. and their histories predate the written bible.


Anu is older than Amen. When Thebes dominated Egypt they took their local god and mixed it was Ra, (another former local minor god) and basically made a new god.

That kind of nonsense had already happened with Ra twice in the past, first Atum and then Horus.

Atum of Heliopolis comes the closest to Anu. Atum was the chief deity of Heliopolis. Here is the good part since your obsessed with linguistics.

The city was also known as On in the Bible from its orginal Egyptian name: An and Annu.

If you want some really weird linguistics high strangeness, you have to check out Atum's shadow Juesaes, Iusas, or Jusas.



[edit on 4/7/10 by MikeboydUS]



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:29 AM
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
 


i know anu is older. lol that's what i'm trying to tell you. and RA, from what i can tell, is EA and ENLIL combined, known in biblical text as JEHOVAH. one place i found the trail for that theory was an egyptian text called THE LEGEND OF THE DESTRUCTION OF MANKIND. the description of enki's temple in the older sumerian-akkadian texts, was the same description of RA, which revealed (to me anyway) that RA was a deified building



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:41 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


The later Egyptians made Ra into whatever they needed him to be, but he started out as a local minor god.

In predynastic times Set in the north and Horus in south were the top dogs.

Its like all of the nonsense with Marduk. A minor local deity turned into a chief deity.

As for the Lil(Loft) etymology, all I can gather is that its the Aeros or lower heavens. Nin Lil is the "Lady of the lower heavens" and En-Lil is "Lord of the lower heavens". Lil is not the name of the god. Lil would be where Kur-gal is at, between An(heaven) and Ki (earth).



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:48 AM
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
 



so we have a god of the heavens,
a god of the air
and a god of the earth and waters (on the earth).

count 'em, that's three, who are all condensed into jehovah. that's why they were originally refered to as elohiym (plural of EL, meaning more than one).



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 03:54 AM
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reply to post by Ellie Sagan
 


Any practice that may involve eye of newt is for sure evil... seriously. look it up!!!
Line2



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 04:20 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


So your theory is that HaShem is Anu, Enki, and Enlil combined into one?

The only thing with that is Canaanite myth and it is quite old, the Baal cycle recovered at Ugarit were 3200 to 3500 years old.

El and his children the Elohim and his 70 sons were all part of the myth cycle. The Ebla Tablets found in Syria are inscribed with El as Most High and father of the gods. They date back 4300 to 4500 years.

These predate the Eridu Genesis, the Sumerian creation epic, by up to 700 years.

Ebla tablets

They all date to the period between ca. 2500 BC and the destruction of the city ca. 2250 BC. They are the oldest and the largest collection of tablets yet found from the ancient Middle East.

en.wikipedia.org...

Cities of the Middle East and North Africa: a historical encyclopedia By Michael Dumper, Bruce E. Stanley
books.google.com...=onepage&q=tablets%20of%20ebla&f=false






[edit on 4/7/10 by MikeboydUS]



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 06:43 AM
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reply to post by MikeboydUS
 


yeah it's just from a different language and cultural variant!

same bat time, same bat channel.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:01 AM
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Originally posted by undo
reply to post by Tayesin
 


i think the problem is a matter of the english translation of old words.
sorcery as you think of it, is not the same sorcery as the english translation depicts it. sorcery is not the performing of sacred rites, it's the ingestion of hallucinogenic drugs to imitate spiritual reality, while performing a sacred rite.

the "sorcery" you are thinking of, and to which the words of yeshua refer, is not the same thing. one is a matter of faith, knowledge and understanding, the other is a matter of hallucinations.


I'm not talking Sorcery as "Shamanic" or as per Castaneda's descriptions. I'm talking Wizardry/Sorcery, the using of the flow of energy via awareness for specific outcomes... like energetic Healing or creating weather changes for example.


Originally posted by DISRAELI
The condemnation of sorcery runs all the way through the Old Testament, so it can't be attributed to "the early church movement". It is much older than that.


Thanks for pointing out that silly blunder of mine.

So the misinformation and control has been going on for a much longer time, as you say.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:13 AM
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reply to post by doctor j and inmate c5779
 


You make some very interesting points. I think it is a possibility that what you said about the advanced race teaching us things before we are ready. Also, I do absolutely feel obsessed with knowing stuff. Not necessarily secrets, but they intrigue me too. It bothers me that secrets even exist! heheh I know, that's a bit much, but I really feel that way. I like how you put it in your reply that maybe we need to get back to a simpler time and a lot of these problems would go away. I fantasize about it actually. There's no way I can see that it would happen without a catastrophe, on a large scale anyway. More individuals are going that way in their personal lives now though.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:24 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


That's extremely interesting! It reminded me of a passage in the Book of Enoch. While maybe not related to what you said, perhaps it is. The agitated stars and lightening and the place being made of crystals. Crystals have electrical properties. Again, I'm not sure it really means anything.

Chapter 15: 8A vision thus appeared to me.
9Behold, in that vision clouds and a mist invited me; agitated stars and flashes of lightning impelled and pressed me forwards, while winds in the vision assisted my flight, accelerating my progress.
10They elevated me aloft to heaven. I proceeded, until I arrived at a wall built with stones of crystal. A vibrating flame surrounded it, which began to strike me with terror.
11Into this vibrating flame I entered;
12And drew nigh to a spacious habitation built also with stones of crystal. Its walls too, as well as pavement, were formed with stones of crystal, and crystal likewise was the ground. Its roof had the appearance of agitated stars and flashes of lightning; and among them were cherubim of fire in a stormy sky. A flame burned around its walls; and its portal blazed with fire. When I entered into this dwelling, it was hot as fire and cold as ice. No trace of delight or of life was there. Terror overwhelmed me, and a fearful shaking seized me.
14And behold there was another habitation more spacious than the former, every entrance to which was open before me, erected in the midst of a vibrating flame.
15So greatly did it excel in all points, in glory, in magnificence, and in magnitude, that it is impossible to describe to you either the splendour or the extent of it.
16Its floor was on fire; above were lightnings and agitated stars, while its roof exhibited a blazing fire.
17Attentively I surveyed it, and saw that it contained an exalted throne;
18The appearance of which was like that of frost; while its circumference resembled the orb of the brilliant sun; and there was the voice of the cherubim.
19From underneath this mighty throne rivers of flaming fire issued.
21One great in glory sat upon it:
22Whose robe was brighter than the sun, and whiter than snow.
23No angel was capable of penetrating to view the face of Him, the Glorious and the Effulgent; nor could any mortal behold Him. A fire was flaming around Him.
24A fire also of great extent continued to rise up before Him; so that not one of those who surrounded Him was capable of approaching Him, among the myriads of myriads who were before Him.

reluctant-messenger.com...



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:40 AM
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reply to post by Tayesin
 


I think you could be right. I've thought of these very same things. I don't think the Bible is untrue, but I think we've been taught the wrong way through the centuries. For example, we are told that Jesus' whole ministry was not just in His death and resurrection, we are to learn how to live by emulating His life. Well He did amazing things, and how? By being in connection with God. He also was part God and part man. I don't know how to say what I'm thinking. Perhaps He was trying to show us we need to be in both the spirit and physical to be able to affect the physical realm. Maybe there were others throughout history who did the same kinds of things and He is one example. I know there are other accounts of virgin births (sorry no links, I don't remember where I read it).

Also, I was just thinking of the wise men yesterday. They were called magi? And yeah you just confirmed, I did think that meant they used magic or whatever.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:46 AM
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reply to post by Ellie Sagan
 


new city jerusalem sounds similar

revelation 21

17And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.

18And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.

19And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;

20The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolyte; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.

21And the twelve gates were twelve pearls: every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.

22And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.


some people assumed that is describing a cube.
but other scholars believe it is describing a pyramid.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:50 AM
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reply to post by undo
 


Personally I think its a pyramid.

If you look at Revelations, the city was in the Heavens and descends to earth. If Enoch I is right, then it may be describing the same city from a different point of view.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:53 AM
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reply to post by cybertroy
 


Even though I still believe in God, I think you may be right. I also think that maybe we think we understand God but I don't think one really could if He is really God. I know this sounds silly the way I'm writing it, but I'm serious. Maybe God wants us to be empowered to be all that we can be, but as you said certain powers that be do NOT want us to know and act on the knowledge of what we can actually accomplish.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:58 AM
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reply to post by DISRAELI
 


If that's the case, and I believe you presented it very understandably, then is it only the looking into the future thing? What about things like spells for protection or help with an illness or whatever... does He say anything specifically about that? Or even, as lately I have been considering strongly, is the use of rocks and crystals for their healing energies. I'm not sure about that. I keep talking to God and letting Him know I have no interest in evil and contacting spirits or anything like that. I don't even think we can know the future, as I believe it is always changing.



posted on Jul, 4 2010 @ 07:58 AM
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reply to post by Tayesin
 


i don't think that kind of "sorcery" is actually against the biblical teaching, in fact, i don't think that's sorcery nor idolatry. it's when the individual begins to worship the created instead of the creator, that the problem comes in, from what i can tell. if it were a problem, science would be considered evil, but science on its face, is just an effort to understand god via his handiwork, as it were.



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