YOUR New Pledge of Allegiance

reply to post by silo13


It is discouraging to see the type of back and forth you and Epic Wolf are engaging in. I think it is distracting to the overall theme of the thread, and it doesn't appear to be productive for each of you.

I would like to see more participation and input, but the direction your conversation is taking the thread is most likely discouraging it.

reply to post by Wolf321

I've done some looking around and I too am having difficulty finding something suitable - that is if I agreed the pledge should be changed, I haven't come to that conclusion yet, but as I said, I'm reviewing the possibility.

In the mean time I agree this quote seems to be the most suitable of the unsuitable so far.

I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America and to the democracy for which it stands, a nation with freedom and justice for all.

peace

reply to post by silo13


So you have no issue referring to the Constitution standing for Democracy as opposed to a Republic, as the Major mentioned?

What are your thoughts on the version I drafted:

"I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America, and commit to the principles of freedom, justice, humanity and personal responsibility. [optional] So help me God."

"I pledge desire to the currency of the country that has the most value, and to the things that it can purchase, for me to s**t on, and throw away, however I please, wherever I want, and whenever I feel like it."

Hi! I'm a long-time lurker on these forums, but this thread provoked me to make my first post here.



In addition to concepts like justice, equality, and positive human traits, I propose that our national pledge should emphasize the following:


1.) Our right as citizens to control our own government

Our nation belongs to all of its citizens, according to the principle of popular sovereignty upon which our nation was founded. Our government is meant to do the greatest good for the greatest number of our nation's citizens. Our republican government is not meant to be an oligarchy, but rather to respect our democratic power. In recent decades, widespread apathy has enabled entities such as for-profit corporate lobbyists and the CIA to gain significant influence over elections and government officials. The principle of popular sovereignty seems to have been lost on our nation, to at least some extent. It needs to be reaffirmed more than ever.

2.) Our right to be safe while having our liberties respected

One of the primary duties of our government is to try to safeguard us from many wrongs including invasion, violent crime, vandalism, theft, fraud, discrimination, and environmental disasters. However, our government must never use this, or anything else, as a justification for violating the rule of law.



S&F

[several edits on 7/5/10 by skooper1895]

[edit on 7/5/10 by skooper1895]

reply to post by skooper1895


I like both ideas. Any suggestions on how to incorporate those ideals into a short phrase?

Originally posted by silo13
Why change a good thing?

That pledge was created just so for a reason...
A good reason.

America was born a Christian Nation - like it or not.

And don't blah-blah-blah me, I don't want to listen to the BS of crackpots trying to re-write history.
And no I'm not going to debate it.
If you think I'm wrong too bad. You can keep your opinion, it's worthless dog rot to me.

More importantly:

The number of lives that have gone to grave to keep that pledge alive demands, DEMANDS the pledge remains unchanged.

The fallen, that gave their LIVES for America - by their blood alone paid the price to keep that pledge alive and intact AS IS!

To change it? Well, would just go to show what a piece of *bleep* the USA is becoming. Wishy-washy have to please everyone bunch of can't stand up for what's right bunch of p-whipped little wannabees.

Added note: You think any other country, ohhh let's say a Muslim Country would change THEIR pledge of allegiance to make all the newcomers and discomfits happy?

Ha ha ha ha ha!

LOL, nope, only in Americant

peace

[edit on 30-6-2010 by silo13]

There's one of the most disgusting posts of the week here on ATS. Chock full of incorrect facts and absurd propaganda, all delivered in a smarmy and arrogant fashion.

Now to the topic at hand. Frankly, I think a pledge of allegiance is unnecessary and the compulsory recitation of the pledge by school children is at odds with the freedom we proclaim to have. The 1950's addition of "under god" is also unnecessary and further complicates the issue of compulsory recitation by school children. I'd suggest we do away with the pledge altogether.

reply to post by Wolf321


Perhaps something like:

"We pledge to uphold the ideals of kindness, safety, and equality; and to guard the principles of liberty, justice, and popular sovereignty; for all citizens of the republic of the United States of America."

Or maybe base it off the Preamble.

In any case, I want our national pledge to empower us all to participate in an enlightened society; IMO, that's what patriotism is all about.



reply to post by traditionaldrummer

The compulsory recitation of the pledge by school children is at odds with the freedom we proclaim to have.

Compulsory recitation of the Pledge was ruled unconstitutional by the US Supreme Court in West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette in 1943. Unfortunately, many don't know this.

The 1950's addition of "under god" is also unnecessary

I agree. The phrase "under God" is insulting because 1.) Many Americans (agnostics, atheists, Buddhists, most Hindus, etc.) are not monotheistic, and 2.) America is a secular nation with separation of church and state.

I'd suggest we do away with the pledge altogether.

I disagree. I think that we should have a pledge as a succinct statement of our nation's common values.

I'm torn on whether or not people should be summoned to (voluntarily) recite it, though. On the one hand, this can be viewed as indoctrination. But on the other hand, isn't it good to remind people of how they can shape our country's future?



What do you think?

[edit on 7/5/10 by skooper1895]

[edit on 7/5/10 by skooper1895]

Originally posted by skooper1895
But on the other hand, isn't it good to remind people of how they can shape our country's future?

I don't really see how the pledge of allegiance does this. At best it serves as an inculcation of base-level American patriotism by allying one's self to a flag and a republic. The freedoms and opportunities provided by America's methods are enough to instill patriotism without the need for any particular personal pledge. I find the rituals of patriotism unnecessary and I understand I'm very likely in a very small minority with such a belief.

reply to post by traditionaldrummer


Good points.

I agree that actions do indeed speak louder than words.

And on further consideration, I feel that only elected officials should be summoned to say any pledge.

Right now, schoolkids like me feel obligated (although we technically aren't) to say a pledge. I've decided to concur with you that this encourages groupthink and that this is dangerous, no matter how enlightened the pledge is.

To make things worse, our current pledge only emphasizes blind nationalism and monotheism, which makes it IMO not very enlightened at all. I think that if we have a pledge at all, it should be far different from the Pledge of Allegiance.

Now, should public institutions like schools be prevented from summoning (not forcing) people to say a pledge? I'm leaning toward no, even though I personally disagree with the pledge and may disagree with future versions thereof.

[edit on 7/5/10 by skooper1895]

If you need a pledge to remind your people what a great country they live in, it generally follows that your country isn't the greatest.

It's just another form of brainwashing, really.