The Filesharing Conspiracy

I don't agree.

People have a right to make a living off of their intellectual property.

The only way to make a living on their intellectual property is to protect their property from people who would wrongly take credit for it. If there is no credit for it, they simply can not make a living off of it.

And if somebody can just so easily take away your work, then what incentive is there to produce even more?

reply to post by NIcon

Very very nice. Probably the best post I've read in a long long time. As many stars as I can muster and keep on rockin'!

www.youtube.com...

Notice the comments of the poster for his relevant observation, from a retail store in Japan.

i think this is the beginning of the information age. soon schools will be obsolete. people can get what ever they want and learn what ever they want. im better than most college students at what i what to do as a career because the information on the skills necessary were so easily accessible. things like degrees will have less of an impact in the future. and i dont think that conspiracy by the government can keep up with society's (or humans for that matter) natural will to learn explore and evolve. if the government wants to stay relevant it will have to bend to the will of the people

but thats just me

I have posted this on an other website, but feel like posting it here as well..

A way to decriminalize filesharing, to make it easier to find everything, and to let the people behind the work get their fair share.

This is just a thought, i know this isn't as simple as i write here...there's many, many different owners that have to agree on this, and many governments also, so i guess it will never be possible, but anyway, here goes,

what if, the owners of all media and (most)governments of the world agreed on an international, centralized, website with every kind of media, music, movies, apps, books etc ever created available for "free", legal, and with no restrictions what so ever.
Every artist and developer could submit their content to the database(no censorship),

the submitters will then get paid a certain amount of money depending on how many people download their work(or in some other way, guess people should be able to preview first before its fair to give the people behind the work money)...

the way to fund it would then be a small tax on the people, that i bet doesn't have to be that big..

I guess it could mean win for both parts, people would be able to find Any media they desire, legal and fast, and the artists and copyright holders won't loose the profit(but probably gaining profit). also i think this would make it easier for artists and developers to release their work without a any restrictions of having big corporations with money to agree to releasing their work = more variation for us...

There's a lot more to this of course..

I do realize that the governments of the world is probably not to trust with all of this responsibility, but maybe the operator could be a neutral entity.

New Fed Crackdown

All these replies but not a single industry-official among them offering explanations.

This is a very interesting topic to me. I am a recording artist and so it's something that I've mulled over quite a bit over the years, and yet I keep changing my perspective.

Let's dissect the argument:

-On one hand, that line "the corporations get all the money anyway" isn't always true, and certainly isn't as true today as it was years ago. Theirs TONS of independent artists and labels these days where the money is distributed a lot more fairly.

-If an artist was lucky enough to get signed by a major label, they usually have to sign to a minimum of a 3 album contract. They are usually given a quota on how many albums they are expected to sell in say, a 6 month period. Let's say it was 80 thousand. So 6 months pass, they sell 48 thousand but had 200 thousand illegal downloads. They don't meet their quota so they are "shelved", which means the label will not promote or further do anything for the current album, or the other 2 albums. The big problem is, they are signed to a 3 contract deal, so they can't go to another label and try again, their effectively in limbo. Meanwhile, far more people are enjoying the music for free than they even needed to sell.

-The labels: I've actually been offered deals by 2 labels, and I can vouch for the notion that, at least in my case, it was a HUGE rip off! One of them was at the point where I wouldn't have gotten ANY money from CD sales and only 10% of the revenue generated from live shows....right. I ended up doing everything myself....and sadly, I can't help but wonder what might have come from the promotion I would've gotten from said label.

-Now the consumer. It is also true that there have been MANY albums with tons of filler and until the whole file sharing system was in place, CD's were GROSSLY over priced! I paid 30 dollars plus for single CD's years ago, some CD's only featuring 3-4 good songs, and lets be honest: They were obvious filler songs, the artists and labels I'm sure knew that they were filler, but released them anyway. So the consumer was ripped off a lot too, maybe some of this file sharing is a build up of resentment because of it.

-We are in the digital age. There has never been more music, and it has never been as accessible. Unfortunately, that means every kid in his basement with a computer, cheap mics, instruments, and stolen software think they are producers and artists. What we get is an overabundance of crap that further cheapens the value of music. Even more unfortunate, that devaluation of music carries over to the other side of music as well. I've spent well over 20 grand over the years building my studio. I spent close to 3 grand JUST on a stereo pre-amp (great river 2nv) because sound quality is so important to me, THAT'S the kind of commitment I put in. I'll take 2 years to write an album so that I get the right inspiration for the right songs, to make sure not only that all the songs sound great, but are unique, relative to the over all album theme, so I can get feedback and further perfect it, and that I still feel that way after some time passes; But it doesn't matter, because music is music, and if that guy who recorded his album with a 2 hundred dollar mixer and a 50 dollar microphone in his basement, an album that just sounds like a drunken jam session of topics they find funny, wrote in 2 weeks, gives his album away for free, than that stigma of worthlessness carries over to me, and other musicians who slave their a**'s off for their art, and are also expected to give away our music, because that's what Joe blow is doing.

-On the other hand, I'd be more than willing to give it all away for free if it meant I could also download for free. In fact, why not free trade for everything? Everyone has something they are good at, why not just free trade all goods and services?

(continued below)

-Now lets talk about software. I have a real problem with DRMS and some software prices. One of my instructors had a plug in bundle for audio that was $5000.00 and only like 80 megs in size, or something ridicules anyway. Consider the size of an email, how many pages of text makes a 80 meg file? couple hundred? So a couple hundred pages of code...than again half the size were probably the pictures of the graphic interfaces. Compare it to the price of a video game. Some games take like 2-3 years to make, have hundreds of staff, costs millions and millions of dollars...and they charge 59.99. I know, I know...supply and demand, but I can't help but feel it's highway robbery as well. If you do audio work, you need those kinds of plug ins and since they are all competitively priced, you don't have an option.

Why do I have to be connected to the internet in a single player game? The people who pirate the games don't have that problem....but I pay for the game and get punished. Hell, to use my cubase program I have to have a USB key plugged into my PC with my license to use it. If I lose that stupid little key, that's a thousand bucks gone. These are the kind of DRMS that make me crazy, only the people that BUY the product get punished!

-We apparently are only allowed to make one copy of our software/audio....most of which have protection so that you CAN"T copy it. What is this only one copy crap anyway? I bought it, I should be allowed to make as many copies as I want, and you know what? Blank media uses dye unlike a pressed CD/DVD/Blue ray you buy at the store. The blank media does not last the same. I have actually had CD's that stopped working after about 5 years. Today I actually buy some software off of the internet via download, so If I'm only allowed one copy, when it dies, there goes my money.

.....anyway, I've gone on what now feels like a jumbled incoherent ramble. I'm over tired so please excuse what may be disjointed and hard to follow. It's just one of those topics that gets me going

It is 4:01 EDT on Monday July 5th. I was just wondering if we had a time table for the experiment yet.

Thought I'd post an update on my earlier "boast" within this forum
indicating my confidence that a piece of software can best a human
in terms of producing QUALITY multimedia content and thus obviate
the need for illegal file sharing.

So far so good...my original estimate to turn a Britney Spears
song into a "Basso Profundo" male voice is going ahead, if slowly,
and is at 58 hours of grid processing so far. (The company uses the
network during the day so I have to pause it until the night.)

The key element regarding this type of processing is to
do the following:

a) Separate ALL audio frequencies into multiple bands that
concentrate and divide themselves into voice, music
and background data.

b) Compare and seperate individual snippets of audio data
into singing phonemes and/or musical instrument rises/falls.

c) Time the duration of these snippets and determine minimum,
maximum, mean and average auditory power & strength which
can be expressed in dB or in watts/milliwatts per square meter.

d) Vectorize the timing and rise & fall profile of the voice/singing
phonemes and the timings and rise/fall profile of the
instruments and then analyze and account for any
background for echos, reverb, flanging, multi-path, etc.
NOTE: THIS PART IS REALLY TIME-CONSUMING TO DO!!!!!!!

e) Take ALL that data and create multiple 3D bitmap arrays
( i.e. Array[ 1..X, 1..Y, 1..Z ] of Single_Sample_Points for
EACH sample point within the audio stream. i.e. create
44,100 3D bitmaps for each SECOND of music.
Each bitmap represents a point in 3D space within
a specified room or concert hall size and shape.

"Audio raytraced" all seprated waveforms to find out their
signal/waveform positions and signal paths that are occuring
within the current 3D room or concert environment.

f) Use Bezier Curves and Quadratic equations to vectorize those
signal paths and then RESAMPLE/RESIZE/MOVE the individual
samples to NEW positions within A NEW 3D environment that
represents the NEW concert hall or room shape and size.
Recreate the original time & place sample points but at
resampled audio power/strength settings with re-mapped &
resampled phoneme rise/fall characteristics that match
a new voice or new instrument type and characteristics.

g) As each current voice or singing phoneme AND instrument
snippet is resampled CHANGE it's characteristics to match
the strength & power characteristic of the new voice using
the same timings/snippet lengths as the original samples.

h) Use the sample snippets of a male voice and convert all female
voice snippets to the male characterstics using the same timing
characterstsics and phoneme rise/fall patterns as the original.
This effectively changes the pitch of the voice but preserved
the natural smoothness so it doesn't sound like a chipmunk
or Evil Deceptagon Transformer!

i) Re-combine all 3D bitmaps for each one of the separated-out
and audio-raytraced 44.1kHz samples to achieve a fully-mapped
3D acoustic environment which is then mapped down to a final
2-Channel or multi-channel waveform using common DSP
transforms.

The key issue is that for EACH sample point...a 3D bitmap of an
acoustic environment is created which means I have to create
44,100 3D bitmaps for EACH second of CD-quality music!

This means MANY TERABYTES of data move, copy and DSP
processing which means grid processing is a NECESSITY
in this type of endeavour.

Like I posted earlier, I THINK that all will go well....I THINK
I can prove that machines can excel in multimedia production
....AND I THINK that this result of a digital male opera singer
making out like Britney is gonna be funny as all h***!!!!!

And to soothe your skepticism, I will post the results to Youtube
no matter how BAD....or GOOD...those results may be.....If I get
egg on my face because of my earlier boasts....then so be it!
You may then slam me for my braggadocio...BUT if the results
are SUPERB.....then please do grovel and kiss at my feet in
UTTER AWE of my superior programming skills....he he he :-)

Originally posted by MikeNice81
It is 4:01 EDT on Monday July 5th. I was just wondering if we had a time table for the experiment yet.

I originally said 100 to 200 hours of processsing time but
me thinks I'm a bit on the optimistic side in terms of
that...however, it IS actually processing quite smoothly
with little error and I DO THINK it is all going to work out
quite peachy!

I was going to showcase individual snippets of audio as they were
processed but I haven't quite finished all aspects of the 3D bitmap
layer re-combining software so this will be an all-or-nothing affair.
... You'll get to see the ENTIRE FILE ALL AT ONCE as soon as it is completed.

So I am now at about 65 hours (i.e. Network combined
processsing time or Total Clock ticks and NOT linear time)
of network processing but it will probably take LONGER than
the original estimate but I'm not quite sure yet....!!!

Now for those of you who would think this is an impractical
demonstration of multimedia content creation software,
my software was originally designed for an array processor
which start at 1024 processors at $150,000 and goes up to
64,000+ processors (megabucks!) which would have completed
this task within seconds or at most a few minutes.

For this test, a local area network (LAN) is being used
which is more constained by network communications
speeds rather than any lack of CPU horsepower.

And as general purpose home and laptop computers
get to 4, 6 and 8 core CPU's these types of programs
get more and more practical for home use!

So don't despair, multi-core grid processing will soon be
CHEAP and PRACTICAL for HOME USE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[edit on 2010/7/5 by StargateSG7]

I still think it will be more than a decade before it is practical and we still aren't testing whether it can create from scratch or mix better than a human.

However, I am awaiting the results with mixed emotions. If it works it will be amazingly cool. On the other hand it will mean time is ticking on studios and that whole experience.

The results of this have more than artistic or economic consequences. This could strike at the very definition of art. We could be standing on the edge of some very big questions in the coming days.

Viva progress, maybe.

In terms of economic practicality MANY STUDIOS would add my software
into their technical arsenal because it is RELATIVELY CHEAP compared
to a multi-hundred thousand or even million dollar mixing console.

Just add 20 to 100 cheap motherboards that have 4 quad-core processors,
and for less than $150,000 one could have all the power and ability
and then some! of a multi-million dollar SSL Scenaria multimedia
console in a space of four to eight 72" racks.

AND it would be a heck of a lot easier to use than the SSL Scenaria
console and my software could handle MORE data at a higher quality
level than the Scenaria.

This FIRST TEST is to determine if the QUALITY of a voice replacement
within any generic song is bad, merely adequate or superb. If it can do the
job the first time out, then I'll do a secondary set of tests which would include
a LIVE mix of a real concert in FULL AUTONOMOUS MODE where my
SOFTWARE will make the decisions as to how to perform a SIMULTANEOUS
stereo mix-down and 5.1 and 7.1 Surround Sound final master mix IN
REAL-TIME! Since I've already tested it at 20,000 live tracks it can
EASILY mix down to 2.0, 5.1 & 7.1 in real-time....but what HAS NOT YET
been answered is whether thoses mixes are considered HIGH-QUALITY!

In terms of science, sound mixing is algorithmic in nature based upon
previous experience and personal musical taste. The knowledge-base
of a mix engineer CAN BE distilled into general, wide-ranging
rules-of-thumb that CAN be encoded into a computer algorithm.

What I want though is the experience of a Master Engineer
such as Bob Ludwig coupled within the production genius of
a Bob Rock or Mutt Lange and turn THEIR experience into
MANY rules of thumb that are then encoded into a real-time
neural-net based decision tree that just happens to have enough
horsepower to duplicate ALL 3 of those musical masters MANY TIMES
and at an insignificant cost for real-time mixing and production of
music and video for the great unwashed sheeple hordes of
uncaring BUT PROFITABLE multimedia consumers.

I will then retire to the Cayman Islands as my master music machines
automatically produce extremely profitable audio/video pap and pulp
whilst I suck down shot after shot of exotic libations and laugh at all
the young turds who will buy my "product" without a second thought
making me ever richer by the hour...and ever more able to obtain
those elusive but nubile 72 virgins for glorious and nefarious times.

I will then FINALLY be able to gaze at my navel and dig all the lint out of
its cavernous confines with nary a thought or care of what others think!

P.S. I should note that even IF this test is a MASSIVE FAILURE, because
it is a NEURAL-NET it can LEARN from it's mistakes and subsequent
operations will then have a much higher chance of success as the
multi-state boolean logic trees get more and more refined during
each application of the MANY rules-of-thumb that are applied to
each NEW data-set. This process is generally quick and autonomous
and becomes ever more qualitatively refined as more and more
data sets are encountered over longer periods of time.

[edit on 2010/7/6 by StargateSG7]

[edit on 2010/7/6 by StargateSG7]

reply to post by StargateSG7


You don't get the fact that it will greatly alter the studio experience. For music guys the studio is a refuge. I think I've told more jokes and laughed more times in the studio than during all the comedy movies I have watched. Thereis a relationship that develops between humans when pressed together in a studio to create art. That relationship dynamic could disapear forever. That part of the process that allowed modern humans to create works like Sgt. Peppers, A love Supreme, Kind of Blue, and Johny Cash's American Recordings would die.

The effect of that change, not only on musicians but humanity, is something that must be considerred.

What will happen to creativity in general when every song sounds like it was produced by Mutt Lange and engineered by Bob Ludwig or (my personal favorite) Warren Peterson? What happens when Jazz gets passed through these rock and country oriented filters? Will we see a death of genres that can't be easily processed for large profit?

All you are looking at is the ability to quickly turn out pop hits for money. What you're not looking at is the non-technological consequence. Every new technology brings a set of negatives as well as positives. Technology changes the human experience it always has and always will. I am much more worried about the long term effects of something like this on humanity than how much money it can make.

I mentioned this to a friend in the industry today. I may be getting in touch with some very serious questions soon.

Some very powerful people are either going to approach with questions or to laugh in my face in the coming days. I want to know what this technology has been proven capable of and some proof that it even exists.

All I did is ask a friend if he had heard of this type of program or interest in this type of technology. He said he would be back in touch tonight. Then he said, "call me tonight. I mean it, you better call me tonight."

There is a storm starting to brew over this little wager. I would be willing to bet that by Wednesday morning it will be known to a lot of music industry investors and decision makers. Sony and Universal will definitely be aware by 5pm CDT.

Originally posted by MikeNice81
I mentioned this to a friend in the industry today. I may be getting in touch with some very serious questions soon.

Some very powerful people are either going to approach with questions or to laugh in my face in the coming days. I want to know what this technology has been proven capable of and some proof that it even exists.

All I did is ask a friend if he had heard of this type of program or interest in this type of technology. He said he would be back in touch tonight. Then he said, "call me tonight. I mean it, you better call me tonight."

There is a storm starting to brew over this little wager. I would be willing to bet that by Wednesday morning it will be known to a lot of music industry investors and decision makers. Sony and Universal will definitely be aware by 5pm CDT.

----


Because of the industry interest, maybe I should dampen
the enthusiasm as to the final results of this experiment!

Please do remember that I THINK that everything will
work out out in terms of a QUALITY mix result....BUT....I cannot
TRULY guarantee an INITIAL HIGH QUALITY result....but to push
a few more industry buttons....that doesn't mean I can't add more
rules of thumb to the logic tree database to eventually
(i.e. within a few months!) to get the system to such a level
that it actually COULD best ANY HUMAN in terms of producing
high quality multimedia content !!!!!!

Please do remember that the logic trees were INITIALLY created
by ME...I can mix music, half-decently but am I an industry
veteran like Bob Ludwig?...NO! So do remember that this test
result is based upon rules of thumb that are created by
someone who has good industry experience but it won't be
perfect....however if I COULD pick the brains of someone
like a Bob Ludwig then we could produce SUPERB quality
content by embedded THEIR experience into my software.

Since mixing and voice reproduction are essentially algorithms
(i.e. humans basically ARE machines - organic ones!) that from
a COMPUTER SCIENCE PERSPECTIVE I CAN and DO quantify
basic rules of thumb for sound mixing and content production
INTO logic trees that can autonomously create multimedia content.

What I do must confess though is that I don't yet KNOW whether
or NOT that content will pass muster with a trained human ear.

I KNOW ABSOLUTELY FOR A FACT that my software CAN produce
multimedia content! What I must highlight though, is that it is
currrently quite unclear until this test is completed, that my
autonomously created content will sound PROFESSIONAL and
SONICALLY pleasing to both professionals and the general
multimedia consumer.

----

And for those of you who are scared of what might happen
to the industry, it'll just be a another tool in the arsenal.
The basic music duties will be outsourced to machines and
the high quality stuff will be done by real industry pros
(young or old!) who'll use it as just another TOOL to get
THEIR projects done on time and on budget but at a quality
level that puts them head & shoulders above the hacks.

And to counter the "Everything Will Sound The Same" argument,
since software IS RE-PROGRAMMABLE, it can adapt and change
to varied music types and styles...AND...it could even bring back
the dead to LIFE using sonic and video similarity synthesis....for
example Jimmy Morrison's or Elvis's voice could be put to use
singing RAP, SKA, Metal or even OPERA because I'd be able to
duplicate their singing styles and VOICES but then apply them
to OTHER music types and genres in both the audio
and the video realm.

I hereby INVENT TWO NEW WORDS:

"Vusicians" -- Virtual Musicians

and

"Vactors" --- Virtual Actors

to indicate that multimedia content was produced
by neural-net based computer algorithmic means.

Remember that software is a TOOL --- how you use it IS UP TO YOU!
My software can put you out of business OR it can MAKE YOUR
BUSINESS depending upon what you do with it and depending
upon if you can find NEW WAYS, MEANS, METHODS to create
NEW TYPES of multimedia content that could be charged for
when people finally realize they REALLY WANT IT!!!!!

And that's where MARKETING comes in!!!!!!!! Which means
we STILL NEED A&R, the Sony's, BMG's, Dreamworks and
Lucasfilms of the world to PUSH that newly created multmedia
into the homes and computers of John and Jane Q. Public!

There is MONEY to be made and FINE CRAFTS to be given or sold!

Which side of the fence WILL YOU BE ON ?

The Debbie Depressed or Dave Downer

or will you BE:

the Thundering Stallion Multimedia Opportunist and Guru?

It's YOUR CHOICE!!!!!!

I'm just supplying the tools either way!

Thank You,

U2U me if you want more info.



[edit on 2010/7/6 by StargateSG7]

[edit on 2010/7/6 by StargateSG7]

Thanks for the response. You might want to pull your personal info though. I think it is a T&C violation.

Thanks for the update, Stargate! Looking forward to hearing the results..

Originally posted by J.Clear
Thanks for the update, Stargate! Looking forward to hearing the results..

Up to 87 hours clock time (i..e total processing time)
so we'll keep plugging away....Because of the time it's
taking, I will make the comment that the advancement
of CPU technology will make use of this gridding software
MUCH MORE practical for use at home....EVENTUALLY!

We just installed an AMD hexacore processor system
with a high end ATI graphics card and 8 TERABYTES of
disk storage using four 2 terabyte drives which were
less than $200/each which allows me to do
some pretty serious computing for less than $1500

5 years ago that setup wasn't available or would have cost
$20,000+ so NEXT YEAR I'll guess the prices will be $1500
for a 12 core and 32 terabytes of storage.

Now in terms of finishing...right now...I'm just watching a series
of blue bars going from left to right as each 3D dataset is computed.
It's like watching paint dry....I start & stop the test run whilst we run
our "Daily Corporate Money Jobs" on our network and in between
and at night I let the grid system run the test....like I said earlier
we just have to WAIT AND SEE !!!!!

I just hope the end result sounds as funny as h*** !!!!