Bill Cooper Destroyed by Don Ecker

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posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 02:18 PM
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I have Cooper's book Behold a Pale Horse. I have to say that some of his stuff was a bit of a stretch, but I don't totally disregard what he said.




posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 02:26 PM
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Originally posted by Kandinsky
His original expose on John Lear and Bill Cooper was posted on the BBS in 1991...see what you think.


Thanks for the link.

What is ParaNet?



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 02:40 PM
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reply to post by Mary Rose
 
It was an old bulletin board...Paranormal Network. It was like a petrie dish that helped ufology to evolve into the lifeform it is today. Some of the well-known names in ufology and conspiracy came together on there in the late 80s.



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 02:48 PM
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reply to post by Exuberant1
 


Whatever! That's only your opinion.

Every single person linked to UFOlogy has their naysayers. EVERY ONE of them! No one has everyone on board with them.


Alex Collier
Steven Greer
David Wilcock
John Lear
David Jacobs
Bob Dean
Stephen Bassett
James Gilliland
Betty/Barney Hill
Clifford Stone
Timothy Good
Nick Pope
Stanton Friedman
Wendell Stevens
Travis Walton
Budd Hopkins
Whitley Strieber
Jaime Maussan
Richard Hoagland
Jim Sparks
Kevin Randle
Billy Meier
Erich von Däniken etc etc etc.....................

"He's a liar"...."No he's not"
He's a disinfo agent"....."No he's not"
"He's a paid shill"...."No he's not"

We're such a separated and divided race! Truly we are.

So.....give it a rest! You can't please (or persuade) 'em all!



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 03:34 PM
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reply to post by One Moment
 



Every single person linked to UFOlogy has their naysayers. EVERY ONE of them! No one has everyone on board with them.


Naysayers? Understatement of the month...on ATS of all places!

Cooper was gunned down after trying to run a cop over and shot another one in the neck during a short fire-fight. He threatened neighbors and was known to pull a gun out. He was as popular as cow turd at a barn dance and just as slippery



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 03:44 PM
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Originally posted by Kandinsky
His original expose on John Lear and Bill Cooper was posted on the BBS in 1991...see what you think.



From the above link:

What is all of this, and why is it here? Well, one of Coopers big drawing cards at his $25.00 and $35.00 per head lectures has been the Kennedy Murder. Cooper has been showing a VERY POOR COPY of the famous Zapruder film that "looks as if" the driver of Kennedy's car turns around and shoots him with a pistol. The film was originally worked on by a Kennedy researcher by the name of Lars Hansson. . . .

Hansson also has been a very active researcher . . .

. . . and has just finished an explosive expose entitled "UFOs, ALIENS, and `Ex'-intelligence Agents: Who's Fooling Whom?" . . .

This is a 300 page AFFIDAVIT by Lars Hansson, and is available for $25.00 plus 3.00 postage and handling. If you are interested you can send for it at . . .


So, Don Ecker recommends Hansson's work, I take it.

But I don't understand the statement about the copy of the Zapruder film and Hansson's role in it . . .



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 03:48 PM
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reply to post by One Moment
 


To be fair I've never heard anyone speak poorly of J. Allen Hynek or Jacques Vallee. And to be fair there is good reason for this. If more people approached the subject as they did UFOlogy would be a lot better off. Instead it is now filled with squabbling charlatans trying to make a quick buck.



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by Mary Rose
 
No. It's not about Don Ecker recommending Hanson. The footage was shot by Zapruder.

Hanson had a copy. He gave a copy to Lear who passed it on to Cooper. Cooper then attempted to raise some capital from it.

Watch carefully from 50 seconds...the driver, Greer, appears to fire a weapon over his shoulder...




posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 04:32 PM
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the fact that he lied about many things is exactly that, a fact.

To disregard the amount of people who now see things from a different perspective because of what he did is foolish, though.



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 04:37 PM
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Originally posted by Kandinsky
reply to post by Mary Rose
 
No. It's not about Don Ecker recommending Hanson. The footage was shot by Zapruder.


I'll look at the video, but what is meant by this statement:

The film was originally worked on by a Kennedy researcher by the name of Lars Hansson. . . .


What work?



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 05:11 PM
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Bill Cooper might have been a lot of things.
He was on the razor edge of speaking out against the out of control government years before anyone else was even out of the closet.



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 10:46 PM
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Originally posted by slugger9787
He was on the razor edge of speaking out against the out of control government years before anyone else was even out of the closet.


No.

He just has a fanbase who thinks that he was original in that regard. Thanks Youtube.

It has gotten so bad that people are actually giving him credit for doing something every decent American does.

Bill Cooper did more harm than good insofar as the patriot movement was concerned.



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 10:58 PM
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I think you people have this all wrong. First, to be a fan/follower of Cooper or Ecker or any other human is dangerous and very misguided. But, Cooper was entertaining, and his warnings about this or that were good for that purpose - stay alert and recognize that Truth and Authority don't come from humans. Maybe that's why Cooper burnt so many bridges - because he didn't have the worshipful and naive faith in certain humans (or any for that matter) like you see so often here.

BTW, I didn't like Cooper either, and maybe that's why he was so important.



posted on Jun, 26 2010 @ 11:14 PM
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Originally posted by dalethorn
- stay alert and recognize that Truth and Authority don't come from humans.


What are You on about?

Your post made no sense. Just look at the part I quoted.

And what's with all the 'humans' talk? Don't you mean to use the word 'people'? Or is this some new thing the kids are doing?



posted on Jun, 27 2010 @ 01:52 AM
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Originally posted by dalethorn
- stay alert and recognize that Truth and Authority don't come from humans.



Originally posted by Exuberant1
What are You on about?
Your post made no sense. Just look at the part I quoted.
And what's with all the 'humans' talk? Don't you mean to use the word 'people'? Or is this some new thing the kids are doing?


...dalethorn was paraphrasing cooper's mantra and it was an accurate rendition...

...when cooper first started out, he was an alright guy, entertaining, intelligent, made you think... what folks like him were posting on paranet back then is considered old hat nowadays but it was hot stuff for my generation (some of which remember life before TV)...

...his drinking problem is really obvious in his radio shows, as is his inability to control his anger, his out-of-balance ego and inability to stay focused... his shows hurt my ears, just like alex jones - too much yelling and hysteria...

...however, its arrogant and unrealistic to presume that he did not have a positive influence on some folks (not just the whack job paramilitary types)...

...don had nothing to do with bill's destruction... bill cooper destroyed himself...



posted on Jun, 27 2010 @ 02:02 AM
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Originally posted by Wyn Hawks

...don had nothing to do with bill's destruction... bill cooper destroyed himself...



That's quite true to an extent.

But 'Bill Cooper Self-Destructs: Don Ecker has it on Tape!" wasn't what I was looking for.

Nor was "Don Ecker Helps Bill Cooper Make ass out of Self" .

I think the current title gives the reader the gist of what to expect from the material presented.



posted on Jun, 27 2010 @ 04:56 AM
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Hey Folks,

Just so you all know that Ecker didn't just decide to expose Bill Cooper for the charlatan that he was after the man had died. Here he is exposing Bill Cooper in 1991:




In my job as Director of Research for UFO Magazine, I get to meet
sometimes strange but also very interesting people. Also as
Director, I oft times get documents, books, and papers for the mag
that I can peruse before most of the public. Also, having been
involved with ParaNet since the end of 1987 the beginning of 1988,
I have seen a lot happen in the field and with ParaNet both good
and bad. Late in 1987 Jim Speiser, the founder of ParaNet was at
the helm as Director. I was Co-Sysop with the old ParaNet RHO, now
no longer in service. In late December 1987, Jim Speiser received
the now famous, or perhaps more to the point, infamous *LEAR.DOC*
that set parts of the UFO field on fire. For any of you that were
not around then, for months and finally years, and now even, people
have read Lears paper, and the turmoil continued.

Months later, after Lear "surfaced", another character
hit the field. This guys name is now also famous, or more to the
point, infamous ** Milton William Cooper. Cooper, now known for his
attacks on most researchers, accusing them of being govt. agents,
etc. was much more restrained in those days. After Lear had his
paper posted, many of the then ParaNet users, had many questions
for "Lear and Co." As time went on, Lear grew tired of people
asking him about sources, etc. and more often than not would fire
back. Cooper then began to ally himself with Lear.

Cooper came on the seen with a report about having sighted a UFO
while a crew member on a U. S. Sub, the TIRU. A short while later,
after covertly sending a file to Speiser to be forwarded to Stanton
Friedman, and then also sending a file to me to send to Friedman,
( without Speiser or me knowing about the other ) Cooper began to
upload all kinds of wondrous files with some outrageous claims and
documents. Of course he also came under some fire here because he
could not prove one damn thing that he claimed either. AND, OF
COURSE ONE HELL OF A LOT MORE HAPPENED. But we will leave that for
another day.

What is all of this, and why is it here? Well, one of Coopers big
drawing cards at his $25.00 and $35.00 per head lectures has been
the Kennedy Murder. Cooper has been showing a VERY POOR COPY of the
famous Zapruder film that "looks as if" the driver of Kennedy's car
turns around and shoots him with a pistol. The film was originally
worked on by a Kennedy researcher by the name of Lars Hansson. For
any of you that read my two parter on Cooper in UFO Magazine, in
part two Hansson discussed this entire sorry episode. But you are
still asking what is this about? Ok.......

More here:

www.skepticfiles.org...



This next article is also a good read. In it Ecker points out, amongst other things, how Cooper flip-flopped on the Bob Lazar issue:




On a recent broadcast of the "Billy Goodman Happening" on KVEG from
Las Vegas, researcher Lars Hansson (see article, p. 17) debated Cooper
on the air and pointed out some of the inconsistencies that Cooper has
espoused. Hansson brought up the fact that at one time Cooper himself
gave Bob Lazar his "stamp of approval." Cooper vehemently denied ever
having endorsed Lazar's authenticity,

UFO has been following the Lazar story since it broke upon the UFO
scene. Cooper's claim that he never gave Lazar his support or claims of
legitimacy is untrue. On November 21, 1989, Bob Lazar was a guest on
the Billy Goodman Happening, and during the audience call-in phase of
the show, Cooper phoned in and said the following over the air: "I'd
like to clear up a couple of misunderstandings here. Number 1, I would
really like to thank Bob Lazar for coming forward. I have been talking
to him for the last year, along with John Lear, we have met in groups
and privately. The man (Lazar) is a wealth of information. I am tickled
pink that he has finally decided to come forward and use his real name,
because it helps all of us. the reason he has gotten into this
predicament is because he is a Patriot. He cares about this country and
that is what made him do this. . ." Goodman then broke in, saying,
"That's beautiful, Bill, an unsolicited testimonial, basically, that's
what it comes down to. "

Then Cooper continued, "First, I'd like to say that I personally, and
also Tony Pelham and also the Channel 8 news staff-George Knapp and
several other people, John Lear-we have all investigated this man's
background thoroughly because we did not want to be sucked into a trap
by the government. And I can tell you that he is who he says he is. He
has worked at Los Alamos. He is a physicist, he is a theoretical
physicist. He has worked at Area S4 in Groom Lake. We have verified all
of this-not just me but several other people, and I have verified it by
two different sources of mine who are in the government. One is at
Lawrence Livermore National Laboratories . We are always on the
lookout for somebody trying to trap us and something that we ean be
discredited by. We have to do that [background research] to protect our
own credibility." Cooper has subsequently attacked Lazar with claims
that he knew all along that Lazar was fraudulent. In his CAJI
Newsletter, he now presents a completely different tone than before,
and writes of "Lazar, the so-called physicist who claims to have seen
flying saucers.


More here:

www.skepticfiles.org...



posted on Jun, 30 2010 @ 10:39 PM
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I only came across Bill a couple of weeks ago, after I found audio of him predicting a false-flag operation to be blamed on Bin Laden mere months before 9-11. I've since listened to Beyond A Pale Horse and am getting through his Mystery Babylon series, and I find it very interesting.

Another thing I have discovered is how many people online get caught up in the cult of personality, trying to discredit people's work through personal slander. None of this changes the info Bill of anyone else put out there, and anyone who blindly follows him or any other radio personality (ahem) is just as blind as the "sheeple" they rail against.



posted on Jun, 30 2010 @ 10:57 PM
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Thank you for posting this as I have always liked Bill Cooper and have never heard an opposing view to him . I will listen to the point of view presented in the mp3 file with an open mind .

Thanks again



posted on Jul, 1 2010 @ 05:54 AM
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reply to post by Max_TO
 


You're welcome Max.

Hey, here is a fairly recent article concerning Bill Cooper which you may find interesting:




Rants from Oblivion by Billy Cox

November 25th, 2009 11:57am
Rants from oblivion

by Billy Cox

Nothing, no matter how toxic or discredited, ever dies in the eternal limbo of the Internet. But after hearing a recent podcast lionizing Bill Cooper as the noble martyr who sewed “the seed beds for the patriot movement,” Don Ecker figured it was time for a history lesson. “I’m shocked that people don’t know what a maniac this guy was,” Ecker says from his home outside Los Angeles. “The guy was absolutely out of his mind.”

Combustible, paranoid, grandiose and delusional, Cooper’s ravings continue to attract admirers, and you can still find his One World Order conspiracy rant — “Behold a Pale Horse” — on chain-store bookshelves. At the end, when he wasn’t waving guns at neighbors outside his hilltop ranch near rural Eagar, Ariz., Cooper was spewing apocalyptic confabulism from a show called “The Hour of the Time” ( Which by the way I called THE HOUR OF THE SLIME-DE) via the Worldwide Christian Radio network in Nashville.

Cooper was wanted for tax evasion and bank fraud at the time of his attempted arrest on 11/5/01. An exchange of gunfire left him dead and a sheriff’s deputy critically wounded. In another time, another age, that might’ve been all she wrote.

Talk radio first placed Cooper’s riffs before mass audiences in the late Eighties, when the Navy veteran uncorked insider tales of UFOs and military intelligence. But with each passing year, his conspiracy yarns ballooned by orders of magnitude, careening from JFK’s assassination at the hands of his limo driver to world domination by the insidious Illuminati. Ultimately, he began accusing UFO researchers who questioned his veracity of being CIA stooges.

Among the first to challenge him was Don Ecker, then investigative director of UFO Magazine. Ecker, who calls Cooper’s book “Behold a Pail of Horse*&#!,” (Actually what I said to Billy was Behold a Pail of Horse#) exposed Cooper’s lies in a two-part series way back in 1990. Between the Bill Coopers of the world and a mainstream media that wouldn’t follow a legitimate trail of UFO evidence if was wrapped in thousand-dollar bills and served with Dove bars, Ecker tired of spinning his wheels and left UFOlogy research in 2007.

Gone but not forgotten -- the late Bill Cooper continues to broadcast from cyberspace

Among the things Ecker left behind was a decade’s worth of his own radio shows, called “Dark Matters.” Lately, he’s been uploading these archives on The Paracast network, and they’re worth a listen. His BS meter tingling with the skepticism of the police detective he once was, Ecker tested his lines of logic and research on some of the biggest names in the UFO subculture. The results are instructive and often quite entertaining.

Anyway — after being sufficiently aggravated by the persistent afterlife of the Bill Cooper phenomenon, Ecker assembled a two-hour show restoring some proportion. It’s all here, Cooper in his own words, the bullying, the contradictions, the threatening, drunken voice messages resembling the howl of a wounded lycanthrope.

And it remains, unfortunately, relevant. Because, as the Arizona Republic reported in 2001, at least one avid fan of “The Hour of Time” was so impressed he apparently visited Cooper in early 1995. All it takes is one. His name was Timothy McVeigh.


devoid.blogs.heraldtribune.com...



*The show that this article talks about is the one I posted in the OP of this thread.



[edit on 1-7-2010 by Exuberant1]





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