David Icke…..Ufology’s Worst Ambassador

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posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 11:03 AM
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reply to post by MarrsAttax
 





The thread is titled 'David Icke...Ufology's Worst Ambassador'. Maybe it should be retitled 'David Icke...one of the problems of Ufology, not by himself you understand'. I understand the point of thread well enough. It's Icke bashing pure and simple. And rather than simply demonstrating how his facts are wrong it tries to make the nebulous and undemonstrated claim that Icke is 'damaging' ufology (and democracy ). It's a really weak premise for a thread


Thank you for those posts. I've been asking how the OP got to his conclusions for pages and pages, only to be told it was already answered, how I was spamming and arguiing for the sake of it etc.

Maybe, he will give you some answers.

I doubt it though, he can't answer the questions without admitting his thread is based on speculation and opinion, and meant purely for bashing Icke.




posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 11:34 AM
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post removed because the user has no concept of manners

Click here for more information.



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 11:43 AM
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Originally posted by cripmeister
reply to post by Point of No Return
 




I'm saying there is no prototype Icke follower or Icke "sect', just all random, non-connected people that happen to listen to his work and drop a comment on a Icke thread.


So I take it you haven't visited D.Ickes forums then?


David Icke forum is just a discussion board geared towards conspiracy, much like ATS.

I don't see any worshipping of Icke going on there, and the focus is not on his own work.

If you say that the visitors of the Icke forum are a solid group of people that are all the same, you could say the same about the ATS crowd, but it is BS.



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 12:19 PM
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reply to post by Point of No Return
 




When someone starts a thread and is making claims, he is expected to back up the claims with evidence, or make it very clear that it is just an opinion.


He has, read the OP again.


Icke has extended his alien reptilian fantasies & undertaken a revolting & damaging campaign based on fantasies about paedophilia & satanism, in order to rip money off gullible people by developing & preying upon their paranoid concerns. -MMN


He has posted proof of that...



I asked the OP how he got to the conclusion that Icke was damaging people and Ufology.


It is laid out pretty clear in the OP and has been gone over in this thread numerous times.



I would think he should be able to give at least one real life example of the damage inflicted by Icke upon a person


Calling people reptilian satanist pedophiles is the deffinition of defamation.



I think the premise is wrong, but my point was that the premise is not based on any concrete evidence, but only on speculation and opinion.


Yeah it is we went over that in the post you just replied to. MMN said d.icke's ramblings are damaging to UFOlogy and myself and others have posted why we think that.



I have been pointing out what is wrong with this thread for pages now.

Frankly, I think you either are being this ignorant on purpose, or your reading comprehension and intelligence in general is very poor.


Really? You are going to resort to calling me dumb because you can't read the thread and see that you question has been answered over and over again?

reply to post by Maybe...maybe not
 


Hey Maybe. What time is it over there?



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 02:25 PM
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Originally posted by zaiger
reply to post by Point of No Return


Icke has extended his alien reptilian fantasies & undertaken a revolting & damaging campaign based on fantasies about paedophilia & satanism, in order to rip money off gullible people by developing & preying upon their paranoid concerns. -MMN


He has posted proof of that...


I think I missed the proof. Can you add a link to the post that contained it? MMN already admitted that it was his belief that Icke is a con man but I don't think he proved it anywhere. Happy to admit I'm wrong about this if it can be shown



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 02:34 PM
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reply to post by zaiger
 


Zaiger.....



Hey Maybe. What time is it over there?


It's 5.34am over here me ol' mate!

Cheers
Maybe...maybe not



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by Maybe...maybe not
reply to post by zaiger
 


Zaiger.....



Hey Maybe. What time is it over there?


It's 5.34am over here me ol' mate!

Cheers
Maybe...maybe not


But yet you refuse to answer my question. I find it funny that you refuse to answer my question about what time it is and you do not even try to back up your claim. So maybe i will say it clearer for you
What time is it?



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 04:01 PM
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reply to post by MarrsAttax
 


yes


Icke has extended his alien reptilian fantasies & undertaken a revolting & damaging campaign based on fantasies about paedophilia & satanism


FACT- D.icke calls people reptiles, satanists and pedophiles without backing it up. This is the deffinition to deffamation and itis dammaging.



MMN already admitted that it was his belief that Icke is a con man but I don't think he proved it anywhere.


His use and support of the protocols of zion (a known debunked hoax) make him a contributor to the hoax and himself a hoaxer and a con.



posted on Jul, 7 2010 @ 09:49 PM
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Originally posted by MarrsAttax
Your stance has softened from 'Icke is a danger to Democracy itself' to 'Icke's philosophy along with other nameless demagogues who may or may not exist'. I think hyperbole was a fair assessment of your original claim.


On the contrary, I have not softened my stance one bit. I clarified so that others could no engage attempt to twist it.



The above quote may be what Icke says but it is not what he means.


Did you really just say that? Oh dear.



Originally posted by MarrsAttax
Straw man. Icke doesn't tell people they have no control over their lives. In fact he tells them the exact opposite (the quote I gave but one example).


Not at straw man in the least. It is the natural progression of Icke's philosophy. Even when people "break free"where does that leave them? They are every bit as impotent as before. They still cannot effect change; the Elite are still in control.





Originally posted by MarrsAttax
I've still to hear a cogent argument as to how Icke can damage Ufology.


This has been presented, but you have ignored it.



Originally posted by MarrsAttax
I've read arguments but no cogent ones. I can reduce the arguments to the following propositions


Why does "e" not follow?


Originally posted by MarrsAttax
Q: What is the damage that is occurring?

A: Most people, if they have heard of Icke at all, think he is a raving madman.

That doesn't make much sense. Ok next one.


Why does it not make sense? You do not think a madman's association with a field does not damage it?


Originally posted by MarrsAttax
And you know better than anyone it is a logical fallacy.


Most certainly. However, the simple fact it is a logical fallacy does not stop people from engaging in it.


Originally posted by MarrsAttax
How? Can anyone demonstrate to me what would be different about Ufology should Icke suddenly pack up and stop producing his material? I will make the supposition that in fact very little, if anything would change. Please demonstrate the damage, don't just state it is happening.


Perhaps, perhaps not. Only by attempting to fix the problem will we discover what the outcome is. It may be a drop in the bucket but every little bit helps.


Originally posted by MarrsAttax
That is the crux of my argument. How can he damage something that's already damaged?


Death by one thousand cuts.


Originally posted by MarrsAttax
Would his absence repair this damage and what is the damage we are talking about anyway?


How often have you seen this field be associated with the terms "kooks" or "madmen." One of the things preventing the field from gaining respectability is this association. To be certain, every field has its share of madmen and kooks, but they have been properly marginalized. This is not the case with UFO research. It is hard for both outsiders (and often for insiders) to tell who is or isn't credible.


Originally posted by MarrsAttax
It's Icke bashing pure and simple.


That is a virtue in and of itself.



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 01:06 AM
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reply to post by Point of No Return
 


D.Ickes forum is not "just a discussion board geared towards conspiracy". Check out the forum sections and what they focus on - reptilians, satanism, Illuminati etc the stuff that D.Icke talks about. It's a D.Icke-centric discussion forum.

reply to post by zaiger
 




What time is it?




[edit on 8-7-2010 by cripmeister]



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 02:58 AM
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Originally posted by zaiger

Originally posted by Maybe...maybe not
reply to post by zaiger
 


Zaiger.....



Hey Maybe. What time is it over there?


It's 5.34am over here me ol' mate!

Cheers
Maybe...maybe not


But yet you refuse to answer my question. I find it funny that you refuse to answer my question about what time it is and you do not even try to back up your claim. So maybe i will say it clearer for you
What time is it?


Zaiger.....

It was 5.34am over here me ol' mate!

Cheers
Maybe...maybe not



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 10:27 AM
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reply to post by cripmeister
 


BS. Off the 30+ subforums, only one is dedicated to Reptillians, and one to David Icke.

The rest are dedicated to virtually the same subjects that we have here on
ATS.

Try again.

edit @ Zaiger, I'll respond to your post when I have a bit more time, going to be a long one.

edit @ cripmeister:

Lol.....Hammer Time.



[edit on 8-7-2010 by Point of No Return]



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 11:40 AM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 11:52 AM
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Well I don't see the big deal in him trying to make money. You need money to stay alive in this world and I know that Icke is not lying.

If he were lying and trying to make a buck, that would be much worse.

I could tune into just about any news station right now, and be able to see Reptilians.

Those who can see them were meant to see them

Those who cannot see them well, were not meant to.

As to why people can't or won't believe this I think it is because they are scared, or they just do not contain the capacity to see it is real.

If anything, I think your title should be opposite. But hey, that is just my 2 cents.



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 01:14 PM
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reply to post by thewheelturns
 




Well I don't see the big deal in him trying to make money. You need money to stay alive in this world and I know that Icke is not lying.


Please explain the part about D.Icke not lying.



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 02:15 PM
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Originally posted by thewheelturns
Well I don't see the big deal in him trying to make money.


Indeed; one cannot fault a person for making a buck. We should all be so lucky to have our passions afford us a living.


Originally posted by thewheelturns
I know that Icke is not lying.


That is a pretty bold statement. Please, explain.


Originally posted by thewheelturns
I could tune into just about any news station right now, and be able to see Reptilians.


Why would a race of beings who take such great steps to hide themselves from humanity place themselves in front of devices that would allow them to be seen by the masses?


Originally posted by thewheelturns
Those who can see them were meant to see them

Those who cannot see them well, were not meant to.


Let's play Find the Logical Fallacy!


Originally posted by thewheelturns
As to why people can't or won't believe this I think it is because they are scared, or they just do not contain the capacity to see it is real.


It's time for the second round of Find the Logical Fallacy! Here's a clue: It is the exact same logical fallacy as in round one!



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 04:26 PM
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Originally posted by thewheelturns
Well I don't see the big deal in him trying to make money. You need money to stay alive in this world and I know that Icke is not lying.
If he were lying and trying to make a buck, that would be much worse.
I could tune into just about any news station right now, and be able to see Reptilians.
Those who can see them were meant to see them
Those who cannot see them well, were not meant to.
As to why people can't or won't believe this I think it is because they are scared, or they just do not contain the capacity to see it is real.
If anything, I think your title should be opposite. But hey, that is just my 2 cents.


Thewheelturns.....



I could tune into just about any news station right now, and be able to see Reptilians.


Hence my assertion that Icke damages people by helping to reinforce such delusions.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not



posted on Jul, 8 2010 @ 04:43 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jul, 9 2010 @ 12:30 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jul, 9 2010 @ 01:03 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 





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