A Christian perspective.

I choose to stand up for my faith in every area of my life

You go about it in the wrong way...imo

Flame me by all means, but if you use bitterness in doing so you are only hurting yourself.

Really? Didn't you come into this thread flaming people who believe in the spirit world but not in god?

The Bible consists of compiled Books, written over thousands of years, and distorted in their translation and intent.

Jesus referes to Enoch, yet the book of Enoch was not canonized. Why?Why were the writings of Thomas left out, he was an apostle and first hand witness to the life of Jesus? why is Jesus life from 12-30 completely left out, what frightened the church leaders so much they erased most of his life? Why are the Feminine aspects of the Holy spirit and God itself erased? Saul of Tarsus is basically a Mass Murderer of Christians, we are told God converts him and he becomes Paul of the new testament. Paul goes on to treat women with such contempt its embarrasing to read. The only reason Christianity exists is beacuse Women taught it, believed it, and were killed because of it the first few hundred years. When the COUncil of Nicea met (326 AD) and canonized the Books of the Bible, it were Patriarchal teachings that were left in, matriarchal teachings were left out.


The ancient greek and Aramiac translate into different versions of the Bible; God is half female, half male. The holy spirit is Female, and on occasion Male. When God is creative, God is referenced as Female. When destructive, God is referenced as Male. ( the Yin and Yang if you will of the Universe).
if you read ONLY what Jesus talks about, there is a very different version of his teachings as when Others speak for God in the rest of the Bible. Jesus is almost Buddist in his philosophy. the rest of the Bible is almost Fundamentalist and abusive in its beliefs.

this are only a few of the reasons people dont believe the Bible as a literal work. It is apparent that people have distorted, hijacked and abused the teachings Jesus left for us. It is why Jesus begs us to search the truth, not to believe any works or teachings without searching first. God knew that people would distort what he taught.

illimey
You may also want to check out this thread - www.abovetopsecret.com...
It discusses the same issue, why people blindly believe we came from aliens rather than God - Harder To Believe In - God or Aliens? You'll find some very interesting thoughts there.
Another on is "Aliens or Demonic Incarnations?" www.abovetopsecret.com...
Both of these question the value of "original thinking over accepted truth.

Have fun,
CS

Bible also got some "superheroes" myths; like Samson, David, The living Dead of Ezechiel, visions of wizdom and premonitions of daniel... Miracles of Jesus...

Joan of Arc was a saint but she was condamned to death penalty, convinced of being a sorceress and a withcraft by people like those who have made this website (www.espministries.com...)

And anyway, what they are doing on the web ?! They don't know that computer sciences is numbers science ? Science of the devil...binary science...

Maybe everyone should STOP trying to convince people they are right on religion and just support others who believe you. Or want help...

Originally posted by Yngwie

I choose to stand up for my faith in every area of my life

You go about it in the wrong way...imo

Then what is the right way? To float along with the tide of popular opinon with only an occasional flail of weakened limbs?

There is only one way to stand - and that is firm.

I ask everyone watching - have I said anything in this thread that can be construed as an unjustified attack on someone elses opinions? Have I violated the terms of this website? Have I done anything tangibly wrong?

I have asked questions, and more often than not I answer received questions with a simple statement of my position coupled with further questions in an attempt to extend the scope of the discussion.

Again - I am a Christian making a stand for my faith in public (well, a virtual public at least!). Please don't ask me to moderate my stance because my refusal may offend.

Finally, although this is a very serious topic, I am having fun discussing it and I would like everyone else to enjoy the thread as well.

There is only one way to stand - and that is firm.

Firm is standing strong, not attacking. I stand firm as I defended myself. You cam e in preaching that if you believe in the spirit world, and not god you are a fool. That is not standing by your believes that is using them to attack another.

Originally posted by Yngwie
Maybe everyone should STOP trying to convince people they are right on religion and just support others who believe you. Or want help...

Good point.

I am not trying to convince people I am right. I am trying to convince people to undertake a logical examination of the world around us in all of it's manifestations.

In doing so, I am not going to resort to claim and couterclaim about the validity of the Bible or the endless historical arguments that surround it. I am, however, going to continue to point out two facts:

Most people on these forums believe in the spirit world in one form or another.

Most people on these forums believe in God/god/gods/ in one form or another.

It's important that people expend a great deal of effort on analyzing their own beliefs in these overlapping areas to see if they make combined sense.

Deny ignorance.

At last, one thats not a total idiot.

[edit on 13-6-2004 by Panzerschreck]

Originally posted by Yngwie

Flame me by all means, but if you use bitterness in doing so you are only hurting yourself.

Really? Didn't you come into this thread flaming people who believe in the spirit world but not in god?

No. I started this thread to ask people who believe in the spirit world but not in god to explain their beliefs to me and, of course, to make an attempt to explain my beliefs to them.

Definition of 'flame' from dictionary.com:

" To rant, to speak or write incessantly and/or
rabidly on some relatively uninteresting subject or with a
patently ridiculous attitude or with hostility toward a
particular person or group of people."

I will leave it to the moderators to decide if I am flaming. I guess if they decide that I am this is probably going to be my last post.

Originally posted by Yngwie

There is only one way to stand - and that is firm.

Firm is standing strong, not attacking. I stand firm as I defended myself. You cam e in preaching that if you believe in the spirit world, and not god you are a fool. That is not standing by your believes that is using them to attack another.

I have not called ANY individual who is taking part in this thread a fool.

This - I think - is the closest I have come to calling anyone(s) anything for what they believe:

"And it seems that many who DO believe in 'God' do so on their own terms... Not very smart, really. "

Do not (please) put words into my mouth.

Keep on topic guys

No flames just good disscussion!

For something to exist....Why does God have to exist?

For a spirit world to exist, why does God have to exist?

Why is that so illogical to you?

To me it sounds a bit like a problem like this:

If a spirit world exists, God must exist. If something is to exist, God must exist. If i can believe in a spirit world, why cant i believe in God?

but also at the same time you are saying: God is the creator. He (With no mention of a she or God being A-sexual or no sex at all...not refering to God as an It but a He...btw...how the hell do you know? or anyone else for this instance) gave me this, this and this, and that, he made everything ladiladida, for something to exist, something must have made it, created it, so for this world and the spirit world to exist, there must have been a creator, that creator is God. God is merciful, god is just, God made Heaven and Hell, god judges us, God is all powerful, creative, loving, I know everything about God, ladiladida.

WHAT THE HELL DO YOU REALLY KNOW ABOUT GOD? GOD MIGHT NOT EVEN EXIST! WHY CANT SOMETHING SUCH AS THE EARTH AND THE UNIVERSE JUST EXIST WITHOUT SOME SUPER POWERFUL, ALL GREAT, ALL KNOWING, BEING CALLED GOD THE CREATOR!????

I mean geez...Think about it logically. In your brain for something to exist, something must have created it. *Picks up a grain of sand*. I dont know what created this, and the rest of the universe, so i'll say some super being that we cant seee, hear, smell, taste or touch, made that grain of sand. So....What made that super being. Meh it must be it's God. What about hat god then, what created it? I dont know. I guess it msut have a god too. Now you tell me that is logical and i'll give you a biscuit.

Hey and i respect everyones beliefs, they can believe whatt hey want, i dont care, it jsut makes me angry sometimes coz things seem so silly ;P

[edit on 13-6-2004 by DaRAGE]

Seek the truth with absolute honesty and you WILL find it.

You believe in God...and you believe that is the truth. Therefore if others stay true to themselves they will find God. This is how I percieved your message. I feel you are more on the agressive side in your older posts...

Is it possible that many people choose to believe in - and seek to interact with - spiritual beings without accepting the existence of God? It does not make logical sense

This right here is where you get an impression of being called a fool. If we believe in the spirit world but not god...then we are not logical. So we are fools.

Originally posted by shauny
good thread....

i am now 30, when i was around 14-15 i knew i had this psychic thing hanging over me, but had few places to turn. when i did turn to someone outwith my family i turned to a guy called dougie, he was a christian, a great man who lived by the bible. he told me back then that i was possesed by an evil spirit who was making me turn against god. the devil comes in all forms he told me, the devil will make u beleive in psychic ability so i then inturn disagree with god. and back then it scared the bajesus out if me. as i grew,and my abilty grew i realised that i could use this for good things. i have in the past told people things that have made them cry happy tears. so my point is that i beleive that a "gift?" as i have is a good thing. but i have never felt it being from god, although i have said it a few times. i have never read the bible, maybe i will one day.

if what i feel and see and hear is evil, then i have a problem with that. if "your god" says that me helping others cope with death is evil, then i dont know if that is a god i want to deal with. your god is a "my way of the highway god" and not something i feel i have to give my life to at this stage. things may change, my feelings might alter as i grow. but right now, today, i dont feel as if what i do is evil or bad.

i might very well be getting led in the wrong direction, but it sure doesnt feel that way.

i hate being like this, but i know i can make a differance, and i feel i do.
i would never organise/plan or charge for it. in my view it is a "free" things that everyone is entitled to hear.

my views on religion are my own through experiance. i have never felt the need to follow a path others state i should, even back when i was 14, and was told my a christain i should.
god requires faith, and i dont have the faith. i respect religion, and totaly respect others beleifs. as i would hope others would respect mine.

until the day i feel the things i do are bad/evil/wrong i will continue to try and help others.
for me the bibile is an outdated book for outdated times.
the world has and still is changing. people are looking for alternative things to beleive in.

if indeed there is a god, and when i die, and im standing there in judgment, and your god tells me i am to spend eternity in hell, that is harsh. its a form of communism in my books. live like this or go to hell.

i understand the bible, i beleive its a good way to live.
but i also feel the world is a wierd place in some places because of religion, most wars are over religion as we all know.

i respect your views, and mean no disrespect.

i am on a journry of knowledge and understanding, and if that path leads me to your god, then so be it. i am open and ready for any eventuality that happens.
i cant rule out god being true, but i cant run my life round something i cant feel or see. i will be honest and say i have looked for god, but i could not find him.
i have searched all areas for help and understanding. and i am where i am today becuase of that.

i feel no pain or badness in what i do.

cheers

[edit on 13/6/2004 by shauny]

I REALLY hope that I can help you. You said you understand the Bible, but at the beginning of your post you said you you have never read it. That is a contradiction. The course you are on is very dangerous. There is a way that seems right unto a man but the end thereof is death.(Proverbs 14:12)
I also have to address another subject. People want answers but as someone said on here don't give me Bible verses, because I don't believe the Bible. If I went to Walmart and bought an entertainment center, I would be wise to get out the assembly instructions so that I could put it together the right way. If you are "assembling" your life, you need the instructions(Bible) also. The true christians on this site have already bought their "entertainment center" and used the "intructions". That is why we can stress to you how important the Bible is. The answer to all of the questions you have are available to you from God, you have to let go of your pride in order to have ears that will hear Him.

dlbrandt...this is no way to try and turn people into christians. To me it seems to belittle me. Don't say it doesn't because I am one you are trying to reach. I know how it feels, and if anything this DETERS me from the religion.

I should have written this in my last reply but I think of things later. One of the reasons I am on here is this simple. God has told us what is coming.(in the Bible) We (True Christians) don't want to see anyone experience the horrible days that God says are going to come, and worse yet be seperated from God for all eternity. If you are a unsaved you can have access to the same God I do. I am no better than you. Many have the wrong impression of who the God of the Bible is. At some point CHRIST WILL RETURN FOR TRUE CHRISTIANS(anyone can escape what's going to happen, start a topic on how that can be done), and then it's going to be extremely hard to see God through the darkness that will be everywhere. Please remember what we have put on here.

Thats an interesting take on this subject iv'e often wondered how deeply religious people would react to this type of study, of what is clearly an ability we as human beings have had for a very long time. I think what gets missed here is that these types of abilitys get "lumped in" with allot of strange and exotic so called occult style groups.
That isn't the case at all if anything the more you look at things like remote viewing or astral projection , the more you see a spiritual side to it.(at least in my case) if anything i believe more now in a supreme source God if you like, than i did before . so if anything this has put me in touch rather than has torn me away.
Look at what religious zealots are doing right now to the world. I am more affraid of them, than a person exploring what is a natural but forgotten ability.
P

I should have written this in my last reply but I think of things later. One of the reasons I am on here is this simple. God has told us what is coming.(in the Bible) We (True Christians) don't want to see anyone experience the horrible days that God says are going to come, and worse yet be seperated from God for all eternity. If you are a unsaved you can have access to the same God I do. I am no better than you. Many have the wrong impression of who the God of the Bible is. At some point CHRIST WILL RETURN FOR TRUE CHRISTIANS(anyone can escape what's going to happen, start a topic on how that can be done), and then it's going to be extremely hard to see God through the darkness that will be everywhere. Please remember what we have put on here.

Once again you just come off as better. What? You can read!? Is that why? I can read. YOU CHOOSE what you believe..that does not make it right, but whatever gets you through the day...or makes your life better, but your preaching just makes me aggravated. I don't want ot hear someone telling me I am wrong...that I have lived most of my life believing in something that is wrong. What makes you right? If you can provide this then it would be done. But can you? I don't believe so. You, I am assuming, were raised Christian. So because of a statistical fact you are going to heaven?


And TRUE Christians are probably very scarce. If every one followed the Bible Word For Word heaven would have 20 seats at most.


Also if there is a God, and if it is your god I think he loves me. I have done very little wrong and tried to be nice to people. And all around do good.
[edit on 13-6-2004 by Yngwie]

[edit on 13-6-2004 by Yngwie]