Seriously. Can I just lick batteries? It was always a pain & pleasure at the same time when I did that as a child. Maybe it was actually healthy!

Originally posted by NoHierarchy
Is there any proven science behind Bob Beck's claims?

Has there been any confirmation of his techniques/inventions by impartial/respectable scientists/institutions?

Is there peer-reviewed research on this?

Or does this just seem like another pseudo-scientific panacea placebo?

in google scholor loads of research papers but it is not a big money spinner like an ingestable drug with a 60000% markup you have to take for the rest of your life.

i gave you the links already above.

Fascinating thread looking forward to the posters results!

Might even build one myself if the results are promising, not too sure on the colloidal silver taking though as it can turn you into a smurf if you use it too much

---

---

Originally posted by VneZonyDostupa
If you're asking people to simply report their results on ATS, the study is already not going to work, due to self-reporting bias.

And how would it be biased ? Surely if someone is feeling & noticing either positive or negative effects by using the machine without changing anything in their lifestyle then it's not biased no ?

Or are you presuming that people will make stuff up to suit their agenda, which they could do regardless thanks to the anonymity the internet grants ?

Originally posted by Discotech

Originally posted by VneZonyDostupa
If you're asking people to simply report their results on ATS, the study is already not going to work, due to self-reporting bias.

And how would it be biased ? Surely if someone is feeling & noticing either positive or negative effects by using the machine without changing anything in their lifestyle then it's not biased no ?

Situations like that are subject to self-reporting bias, a well-known phenomenon in medical research. If a project relies on a patient relating their own results, they are more likely to relate information that they personally deem noteworthy, which might be more or less sensitive than the investigators criteria for noteworthy data. One person might think it's not worth reporting that they feel a bit more exhausted, another might not feel it's worth reporting that their foot was a bit sore right after treatment, and so on. When you have a researcher/doctor meeting with each patient, they can ask probing questions and do a top down systems review in a few minutes.

Not to mention, as you said, there is always the possibility of people only reporting positive or negative data, depending on their own personal view of the experiment. That's why 'survey studies are rarely pubished and seen as weak science.

Originally posted by RogerT
As a note on double blind and or simple use of placebo control group, I wouldn't personally be interested in participating in any study that suggests someone may get help with a disease and then gives them a placebo, it is not within my integrity to do so. (by participate, I mean organise, initiate, fund or promote in any way).

Perhaps this is not scientific, but the idea of giving someone hope with a dangerous condition, then letting them die or get sicker because they use an empty black box, is really not something I'd entertain or endorse in any way.

If you remove a controlled, placebo group, then the study will not work. Period. You can't have just an experimental (treatment) group with nothing to compare it to. If you don't have a control, then you can't account for age, sex, disease status, time of day the treatment was delivered, etc. Even having a large, random mixture of patients wouldn't suffice.

Why not just use patients who have non life-threatening diseases? Why not use animals? To suggest throwing out a placebo group because of some vague philosophical objections is silly, especially when you assume using a placebo would cause people to die. All trials have guidelines in place for using placebos that ensure no patient is seriously harmed due to lack of treatment.

[edit on 7/13/2010 by VneZonyDostupa]

Well because we are talking about confirming Beck's claim that his apparatus cures AIDS and other so-called incurable diseases, plus deadly infections etc.

Demonstrating that a zapper will rid someone of thrush doesn't really make the news does it

I understand as a scientist you may think my moral objection silly, but I do tend to take misleading someone who is looking for a cure from their alleged killer disease rather seriously. I also accept you probably didn't mean it that way, just trying to clear that one up.

I really don't understand the problem of not having a placebo control group.

Take 100 people with presenting symptoms of AIDS, put them on the Beck protocol, if 50 of those people later present no symptoms, then isn't it fair to say the Beck Protocol has demonstrated a 50% cure rate in this scenario?

If the above experiment was conducted under clinical guidelines, with appropriate data recorded, would this not encourage people like yourself to consider this a highly effective alternative to for example AZT and other highly toxic drugs that are not even touted as cures and are quoted in terms of 12 month survival rates?

Additionaly, are you saying there is no ethical consideration in requiring participants to cease their current medications, even if they are being given a placebo in exchange?

Hi guys

I've read this thread with great amazement. There is so much information that has been suppressed and kept away from us that it is far from funny. If this simple self made electrical device works as everyone says it does, then I'm up for giving it a go.

A few questions are on my mind about the process.

1. Is colloidal silver drink as effective as the electrical device strapped to the wrist?

2. How will each one of the processes effect you if you are a heavy drinker (alcohol)?

3. How will each process effect you if you a heavy smoker (20 a day)?

S & F - Due to being a great topic.

Gareth

---

---

Just an update.

I've been using the machine for a good two weeks everyday, on as high as I can take, for a minimum of 1hr but on some nights 2 hours. So far nothing out of the ordinary.

Bachrk, is there a specific condition you are using it for, or just for general health? you may have said so before but I can't remember.