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Jailed for Debt in the U.S. in the 21st. Century

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posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 03:42 PM
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Originally posted by purplemonkeydishwasher

Originally posted by jfj123


Then do it and tell us your experiences.

When you're required to appear in court, will you? If so, why? if not, why not?


Ahh, the 'you do it first' syndrome.

No, it's the put your money where your mouth is argument.


I work for contract, and am in the process of moving off the grid - as I can't take the two-faced back stabbing corporate city life any longer.

Ever thought of working for yourself then?


So, I don't use the credit system.

Yet you're telling everyone else how to use it.


I know that paying tax is not required by law.

I assume you don't pay taxes then?


I know that 'driving' means operating in commerce, and that I don't require any sort of licensing to travel in a personal conveyance;

So do you operate any type of vehicle?


that I am not required to pay for anything with my sweat equity,

what ?




posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 03:44 PM
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Originally posted by nh_ee

And now we are surprised to read that Americans are being Jailed for Debt , which is the entire purpose of Bankruptcy protection ?


But nobody has been jailed for simply being in debt.

I like the way this has been twisted around to not resemble any type of factual information.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 04:49 PM
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reply to post by Carseller4
 


Sorry carseller4 not sure what state you live in but in my state MN, if we dont show we get a warrant issued on us. then sit in jail till the judge is ready to see us, could be a day, cooould be 20.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 06:21 PM
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reply to post by nh_ee
 


The fact still remains. Persons that enter into a contract that over extends their cash flow to run negative go into debt. That person willfully made a conscience, yet idiotic decision to do so.

The notion that people are arguing here that those that did so are the victims is asinine. While there are cases that probably fall under the exception, they are by no means the rule.

To think that anything that Congress undertakes will relinquish or ease the debt that you have incurred on ones own accord is pitifully ignorant.

It is high time the people of this country learn what responsibility is once again.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 06:30 PM
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There's so much misinformation and ignorance in this thread I'm trying to figure out where to start denying it. Sheesh.

First of all, what happens if you don't show up for court depends on the type of hearing it is. If you are sued by a creditor in small claims court, properly served, and don't show, a judgment is issued against you and the creditor can then proceed to garnishing your wages (if you have any).

If you offered up collateral for the debt and don't pay and are called for an asset hearing and don't show, then a warrant can be issued. Basically you've said to the creditor "I'll pay you this debt or I'll give you my _____ (computer, TV, car, whatever)" Now you haven't paid and the creditor has the right to take possession of the collateral. Not much different than foreclosure or having a car repossessed. If you don't show up in court (presumably to avoid turning over the promised collateral), you should face some consequences!

Secondly, if you are sued or garnished, you can show up in court and defend yourself, and it does work. In fact, the court clerk will send you a petition form along with the judgment or garnishment notification, and it requires you only to check a box or two, sign it, and return it to the court. Show up with proof of your income (or lack thereof) and a reasonable budget with some documentation, and the judge will either "exempt" you for hardship or negotiate a reasonable payment that you can make, and will often require the creditor to stop all late fees and interest.

And really, let's keep the child support out of this particular discussion. Child support is not a debt, it's an obligation. You brought the child into this world and it is at least half your responsibility to take care of it. Refusing to pay child support is no different than neglecting or abandoning the child, and that rightfully is and should be a crime!
Whining about how terrible your ex-spouse is doesn't cut it. For one thing, it in no way negates your responsibility to care for your child, and for another thing it was your stupid mistake to marry them or have a child with them if they're that bad.


Also, there is a big difference between people who have "fallen on hard times" and are having trouble because they've gotten in over their head through some misfortune or even just poor planning, and people who deliberately defraud creditors (over and over again) and laugh all the way to the bar or bingo parlor because they know (or think) you can't do anything to them.

If your buddy borrows $100 from you and then tells you he isn't going to pay it back and never intended to pay it back, how is that really any different than him stealing the $100 from you?

So how is walking into a loan company and signing a contract to get a loan that you never had any intention of paying back different than stealing the money from that company? It isn't! So why shouldn't it be a crime?

I now work for one of those small loan companies, and I'm seeing both sides of the coin. The people who return my calls and keep me informed, and are trying to pay something .. anything .. those are the people we WORK with. The people who put rude insulting messages on their voicemail, hang up on me, refuse to return my calls, and threaten to sue me for harassment if I don't stop calling them (once a day only during normal business hours, I might add) .. those are the people who get sued and taken to court.

It's one thing to lose your job in hard economic times, or have an accident or medical emergency and end up with bills you can't afford to pay. It's another thing to get loans and credit that you know you won't be able to pay back, or get yourself into trouble by constantly living beyond your means because you won't live within them.


[edit on 20-6-2010 by hhott]



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 08:32 PM
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reply to post by L.HAMILTON
 


Rich vs Poor.
Rich win.
Justice = Just us rich folks.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 08:53 PM
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Hum, debtors prison sounds like a great idea (although I know that's not exactly what the OP implied). Not paying ones debt is one click short of theft, theft from another. Maybe with threats of jail time hanging over ones head, they will think twice about paying their bills before using their cash and/or evil credit card to buy more junk and toys they don't really need instead. Put them in a work release prison and have them pay off their debt before they can go spend their money on smokes and beer and crack and teevees and new cars they can't actually afford .. etc etc etc.

There are too many irresponsible people acting like thieves these days because they believe there are no consequences for mismanaging their lives and finances. And consider this too, who's going to take care of all these debt junkies that haven't been saving a dime for their retirement, but have been living high on the hog instead, spending their income on needless junk instead, hum? I know a dude that's got a boat, and big screen entertainment system, a mortgaged home with a pool in the back and a ton of other STUFF .. all bought on credit or with cash that's burning a hole in their pockets .. yet the idiot hasn't a dime in any kind of retirement account. This deadbeat debtor issue goes a lot deeper than just paying back what one has borrowed from another, it has to do with acting responsible and living within ones means!

[edit on 20-6-2010 by Divinorumus]



posted on Jun, 21 2010 @ 04:50 AM
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reply to post by hhott
 


Good post.
Thanks for posting actual information and not MISinformation !!!

Starred.



posted on Jun, 22 2010 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by jfj123
reply to post by hhott
 


Good post.
Thanks for posting actual information and not MISinformation !!!

Starred.


I don't understand the hostility toward real information? I don't use the credit system, because it's based on FRAUD, and I want no part of that. I work for myself, I thought I made that clear, however if I failed in that regard, please allow me to reiterate that I am a productive member of MY society. Please feel free to look up the legal definition of society, and see how it pertains to you.


You do realise that when your parents registered you at birth, they created a legal entity known as a person, and gave away their legal right to you? You became chattel. I couldn't make this stuff up! I give you advice on using the credit system, because I know how hard it is to get out of the web once you are within it. Your signature is the only thing worth ANYTHING in our economy these days; think about it - what gives a cheque value? Your endorsement, of course. What gives a promissory/legal tender bill of exchange its value? A signature, of course!

From the Bill of Exchange Act in Canada:


BILLS OF EXCHANGE ACT

57. (1) Every party whose signature appears on a bill is, in the absence of evidence to the contrary, deemed to have become a party thereto for value.
___

Now, could you please provide evidence to the contrary that my signature has no value? Stating such things is equal to slander, actually.



more from the BoE.

190. (1) Every consumer bill or consumer note shall be prominently and legibly marked on its face with the words “Consumer Purchase” before or at the time when the instrument is signed by the purchaser or by any person signing to accommodate the purchaser.
Effects where not marked
(2) A consumer bill or consumer note that is not marked as required by this section is void, except in the hands of a holder in due course without notice that the bill or note is a consumer bill or consumer note or except as against a drawee without that notice.


From the Financial Administration Act

Definition for: Money: Money includes any negotiable instrument.

Definition for: Negotiable instrument: Negotiable instrument includes any cheque, draft, traveler’s cheque, "bill of exchange", postal note, money order, postal remittance and any other similar instrument;


From the Bill of Exchange Act (again)

Note means 'Promissory Note'

and

Value means "Valuable Consideration" (BECAUSE THERE IS NO REAL TANGIBLE VALUE IN OUR ECONOMY..aside from us!@!!!)
______________


WHat does that all mean? I think it should be obvious that your signature is all that is required to settle up any BILL, because there is no evidence to the contrary that your signature has no value.

Ok, I just got up, not sure if this made any sense. But it's all true, and there is no misinfomation. GOdspeed



posted on Jun, 22 2010 @ 10:21 AM
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First of all, if your 'buddy' borrowed a hundred dollars from you, and it now defaulting on it; he's a douchebag. That is your sweat equity.

THE BANK IS NOT YOUR BUDDY.

THey don't eve lend out real money, your signature creates the credit EVERY single time. THey are FLEECING YOU, you SILLY SILLY sheep.



posted on Jun, 22 2010 @ 10:36 AM
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Originally posted by purplemonkeydishwasheryour signature creates the credit EVERY single time. THey are FLEECING YOU


I wish more people understood this.

The banks monetize your signature, take the fiat $ from your treasury account at the fed, and transfer it to you while charging you additional interest. It is fraud from the beginning and many of the CFOs of these banks know the truth.



posted on Jun, 22 2010 @ 10:51 AM
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Originally posted by Ionized

Originally posted by purplemonkeydishwasheryour signature creates the credit EVERY single time. THey are FLEECING YOU


I wish more people understood this.

The banks monetize your signature, take the fiat $ from your treasury account at the fed, and transfer it to you while charging you additional interest. It is fraud from the beginning and many of the CFOs of these banks know the truth.


Yes! Thank you, some back up.
I believe with this knowledge our keys to freedom shall be handed to us.



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