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California on 'verge of system failure'

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posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 06:00 PM
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reply to post by brainwrek
 


Wow thanks dude. Didn't realize I was socialistic, but since you made up my mind I guess it is true.




posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 06:13 PM
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I lived in California for 4 years. Let's just say I'm glad I moved back to "crazy ol' Texas" where we're all some "crazy ol' cowboys"......

edit - grammar

[edit on 19-6-2010 by newBodyoldSoul]



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 06:24 PM
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Originally posted by DimensionalDetective

So how exactly Cali ( and many other states ) are going to get out of this, other than taking a massive hand-out from Uncle Sam, or as was tossed around in this article-possibly defaulting on their debt, is beyond me.



California will end up getting out of their financial hole the same way that the Federal Government will have to eventually go - MASSIVE tax increases (income tax), a new sales tax, and public service cutbacks to things like social security, medicade, welfare, and many other social programs, and with so called "innovative" thinking like legalizing certain drugs for the tax revenue. Uncle Sam quite frankly cannot afford the type of handouts required to bailout the individual states - the Federal Government is bankrupt as well.

Just about ANYTHING that they do to combat the deficit and debt will be massively unpopular and will probably lead to mass protests and riots like they've had in Greece the last few months, and are beginning to see in Spain.

The UK is about to release the "biggest austerity plan since WW II" and the people have been told to "prepare themselves" for massive cutbacks in government spending, and their debt to GDP ratio (about 75% by 2012) isn't as bad as the ration in the USA (predicted to be 100% by 2012). It's not likely that this will be well received by the average Brit.

It's coming soon to the USA, at Federal, State, and City levels.

You simply cannot reduce taxes at all levels of income, increase government spending by massive amounts over the same time frame, and expect that all will be well. It's not fiscally responsible or sustainable.

The population is going to be VERY upset when welfare is cut off or reduced and the length of time allowed on welfare drastically reduced, when medicare is massively cut back, and when other government run social programs are cut back or eliminated, and it's coming sooner rather than later.

Just look at the people upset when the Senate wouldn't renew their two year welfare program that was about to run out - you'll see this in massive amounts when the whole system is cut back and people are cut off in droves, or when the people left working have to sustain massive tax increases to pay for social assistance to those who sit on the couch and collect welfare. You're either going to get riots from those who have nothing when their payments are cut off, or from those who have what little they have when taxes are increased to pay for those who have nothing.

[edit on 19-6-2010 by babybunnies]



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 06:44 PM
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Originally posted by nite owl
HEY WAIT A MINUTE. I will not be able to afford that second mansion in beverly hills unless i get the bailout. Come on here, I need that money, i really do need that money. YOU SMALL PEOPLE, don't understand. California needs another stadium that i can build. HEY, and don't moch our fine upstanding citizens, They not small peoples like some other states. Hey, if i need to spend more money to get the job done, i will. The upstanding people here need that money, to get jobs done around here. We have loans too, we upstanding citizens have to pay off OUR MANSIONS, and keep up with the donations to the golf coarse. WE HAVE BILLS TOO, YOU KNOW. YOU KNOW, the 12 cars i have take gas and insurance. YOU KNOW, all this has to get paid some how. I am an upstanding citizen, can you say that?
THIS will not bankrupt anyone, it's ok, we will spend it wisely.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 08:29 PM
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reply to post by babybunnies
 


Won't work. They already tried that. They have already reached the point the businesses packed their bags. No businesses, no jobs, no money to tax.

They will have to cut spending to a level never seen before and lower taxes to attract jobs and businesses back.

If only they had picked up a history book. It could have all been avoided.

Last time I had the misfortune of living there, about 1980, they actually had Drunk Checks. All they had to do was show up drunk and hung over at a Detox once every three months and they got full Disability Checks. $600 a month plus Food Stamps and free medical which was plenty to live on back then. I met two people who were doing just that. Home of 60 cent Thunderbird Wine.

Can't blame the welfare addicts. You have to blame the Pusher. The farthest Left system in the country. Of course it will fail first.


You know I've smoked a lot of grass
O' Lord, I've popped a lot of pills
But I never touched nothin'
That my spirit could kill
You know, I've seen a lot of people walkin' 'round
With tombstones in their eyes
But the pusher don't care
Ah, if you live or if you die



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 08:47 PM
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reply to post by DimensionalDetective
 


No, this is NOT an ominous sign of what is to come. This is an ominous sign of what IS!



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 09:19 PM
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3 things have destroyed Cali, and the founding fathers idea of America:
1- GOP
2- DNC
3. Party cultists who reward 1 & 2 for failing.

Get a good laugh at us hippies today, enjoy it while you can because whatever bible thumping, war party love'n, "mow your lawn find a car", redneck-nation "y'all" live in is "fix'n" to be next...



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 09:57 PM
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I'm seeing alot of "we Californians can do better on our own" Texas last year uttered the word "secession" And ya'll told us to take a flying leap and the country would be better off without us... the hypocrisy astounds me. We (Texas) are the second largest economy in the country (behind Cali) and somehow we are managing to keep our heads above water. We pay as much in taxes as you (federally) and we are getting less kick backs from the fed to boot ( we don't have scar face pelosi in our corner). Time to take a real peek at the check book ledger and see where the money is going. In life, when we make a budget and can't meet it, something has to happen. You sell something, get rid of bills (shut stuff off that aren't necessary for existence), or increase income. You can't create IOU's and expect debtors to accept those as valid forms of payment.

That being said it's a sad day when we as Americans of these United States are at each others throats, the problem starts at the top and ends with the individual. It's a poo sandwich that we all have to take a bite of.

This isn't a left vs right, or a black vs white issue. We have been duped into fighting each other while the pervert has been having his way with our sisters and mothers (you get what I'm saying?) California's problems are ours collectively and we need them as much as they need us... A LOT. Time to get over your deep seated hatred for the perceived other side, clean the sand out of your vagina's and lets get to work.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 10:01 PM
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The AP psoted on friday that 84 banks have failed this year. this time last year we were at 40. Unemployment numbers shot up again this past week as well. I am an optimist by nature but it is getting more and more difficult to stay positive.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 10:07 PM
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I have been warning many of my friends about this for a little over two years now...They, of course, think I'm nuts...But what the hell can you do when you give people unsavory information.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 10:14 PM
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Economics live and die by bell curves. It's economics 101 and corporations pay good money for people to research what the optimal amount is that they can charge for products.

The same goes for collecting taxes.

While politicians are masters of spin and rhetoric, they fail to grasp that there is a finite amount of money they can extract out of a society without it collapsing. YOU CAN NOT SQUEEZE BLOOD OUT OF A STONE. Yet this is the stance government on a state and federal level take. They simply think that they can demand more and more out of their tax payers with no consequences.

Government has become so disconnected from the average American that they have fallen into the Marie Antoinette Syndrome. They have no idea of the plight 90% of this country is in, nor do they care.

We all remember how the system fixed itself in Marie Antoinette's day. History will repeat else all hope is gone. One way or another all these politicians will have to be replaced with those more in tune with the masses.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 10:46 PM
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What happens to California happens to all of you!

If you read ATS you should know that the 2 party system is to keep us divided. TPTB must just laugh at every get-together on how they manipulated the masses this week.

PS: I am a native Californian and I've NEVER voted for most every money grubbing expenditure that has happened in my state. I have voted Republican, Democrat and Independent. I have flip-flopped a lot hoping someone will make things better and right....but NONE have.

Stop calling names....I am not a socialist, nor is ANYONE I know here in California.

Its ruination has been a long road of bureaucratic crapola that any law abiding, hard working citizen has found abhorrent.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 12:02 AM
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Originally posted by brainwrek
Damn glad to see those socialistic scumbags in CA are about to reap what they sow.

They deserve each and every ounce of pain they are about to experience.

California, along with other heavily democratic, and union influenced state governments, are finaly being forced to face the music. it won't be a nice tune.

In these states, no one wants to give up their program, or any of its funding. Some common sense first steps would be an across the board hiring freeze, followed by an immediate 10% reduction in current employees.There is always extra waste around, and everyone knows it. When people quit or retire, you simply don't replace them. That's a start, but certainly could be combined with other ideas. Trouble is, no one has the guts to be the ax man.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 12:52 AM
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The hate on this thread is astounding. All of these posters calling for California to fail seem to have no idea of what effect it will have on the rest of the US and the world.

I would like to see for the current system (not just in California or the US, but the world) to be done with. The insane amount of greed and lack of compassion that seems to rule the world. I think if we were able to do away with that, the world would be a better place. I don't see it happening any time soon though, especially with people acting like they are enjoying the collapse of a state.

My heart weeps for all of the families that will be effected by this. I guess what you could call your middle class family that worked their ass off everyday to just try and scrap by. The family that only has the hope that things will get better, that has no one to bail them out because they are neither poor nor rich enough. That's the family I worry the most about.

I have family that live in California. I'm actually really glad that my brother and his wife work at a private university. Hopefully their jobs will last a little bit longer since their paycheck doesn't come from the state. Even if I didn't have family in California, I would still be worried about everyone living there, though.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 02:22 AM
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Clueless? Wow, an ad hominem attack, and you received lots of stars for it. What that tells me is that we're not dealing with an intelligent, logical crowd here. You didn't bother to retort because everything I said was absolutely true. What's amusing is that people think they know more about this state than the people who live here. I learned more about California in preschool than you will ever know in your entire life. So get well over yourself. I can assure you that I'm not impressed with you in the least. If you think it's funny that we should require assistance, oh well. We DO pay more into the system than we take out. Look it up. And the Federal government is fighting anti-illegal-immigration reforms. Look it up, too. According to Sec. of State Hillary Clinton, they will be suing Arizona for its new law. We've been bailing out states all these years. Now you're going to bail us out. Funny how we poured billions into Louisiana and accepted its refugees, but when we have a natural disaster, such as major fires or flooding, we receive not a single dime from the Federal government. I bet some of the food you ate tonight came from California. California is home to the richest agriculture county in the country. Stop taking advantage of Californians. Pay up! I don't want to hear any whining. If you want a state that has actually damaged this country, look at Texas and its many scandals. How many times have we bailed them out? But some of you come on here and brag about living in Texas. Texas is the most corrupt state in the union. People will always hate California because let's face it, it's one of the nicest places to live in the entire world. You bash it, but you come here for vacations, don't you? Yes, you do. And you worship the celebs that live here, don't you? I bet you're glued to American Idol and Jay Leno. I used to go all over the country, and I heard all the people bad mouthing California. All it is is jealousy...plain and simple. If you could live here, if you could afford it, which you can't because you're unskilled and uneducated, then you would. You'd be living in a mansion on the beach too. Enough of your nonsense.

[edit on 20-6-2010 by Incubus]



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 03:45 AM
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reply to post by Incubus
 


California is not the only state that has tax payers Incubus. Bailouts are doing more harm than good. Has jobs really grown that much after the bailouts happened? Ask anyone here, how jobs have grown in their areas after all of the bailouts went through. Why add more of this to the load the taxpayers already have? They can only afford to give so much. And with the number of people out of work that we now have who can`t pay any taxes, you want to force those who still have a job to pay the brunt of it? Do that, and the people will revolt. Nothing like breaking the backs of those who still are able to pay income tax.

This country is already teetering on the edge of collapse because of over spending, and now you want to push it on over with more bailouts? That`s well thought out, isn`t it?

Then again, maybe a fresh start wouldn`t be all that bad.



[edit on 20-6-2010 by FiatLux]



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 09:58 AM
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I don't think the bailouts were really meant to create new jobs. All they were meant for is to stimulate the economy by increasing spending so the rich corporations would make more money. That's all that was for.



Originally posted by FiatLux
reply to post by Incubus
 


California is not the only state that has tax payers Incubus. Bailouts are doing more harm than good. Has jobs really grown that much after the bailouts happened? Ask anyone here, how jobs have grown in their areas after all of the bailouts went through. Why add more of this to the load the taxpayers already have? They can only afford to give so much. And with the number of people out of work that we now have who can`t pay any taxes, you want to force those who still have a job to pay the brunt of it? Do that, and the people will revolt. Nothing like breaking the backs of those who still are able to pay income tax.

This country is already teetering on the edge of collapse because of over spending, and now you want to push it on over with more bailouts? That`s well thought out, isn`t it?

Then again, maybe a fresh start wouldn`t be all that bad.



[edit on 20-6-2010 by FiatLux]



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 10:38 AM
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reply to post by LooseLipsSinkShips
 


It really doesn`t matter what any of the bailouts were for. Show me one thing that has improved at all from any of it. There is one thing that did improve, and that is the amount of money the banks have. Yea, they sure helped out the people didn`t they?



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 11:14 AM
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You know....personally, Id love to live in a post-apocalyptic anarachic world.
Not that I hate being lied to by our government, or denied the whole truth...but I just dont particularly sit well with all these laws and rules and such.
Haha.



posted on Jun, 20 2010 @ 03:40 PM
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Originally posted by dolphinfan
reply to post by Incubus
 


That is a very common misconception.

www.census.gov...

Review the actiual governmental statistics and you will find that once you normalize the numbers (taking out major oil producing states and tiny states like Wyoming) California takes in slightly more than they send back to Washington.

California is a victim of their own shoddy policies and liberal nonsense. Lets just wait for all of the illegals move west out of Arizona. I'm sure that, as California lawmakers suggest and that illegals are great for the economy, those folks will pull California out of trouble in short order.


Looking at your link only seems to show the Federal grants and payments made to the state but doesn't have data about tax collections.

While California will always show up pretty high on a list like this due to its size, all the data I have seen shows California paying slightly more to the feds than they receive.

Take a look at this report that covers close to the timeframe of the report you linked to, Tax burdens and expenditures by state

Looks like California was getting back $.79 back for every dollar sent to the feds.



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