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US has no debt if you think about it

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posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:13 PM
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Feel free to rip this economist a new one and show why he is so wrong on so many levels.

I'm tired and ready for bed, so I'll leave this one to you guys.


US has no debt if you think about it - American economist

Asked about America’s national debt, Michael Norman acknowledged that “this is not really even a debt if you think about it.”

“Why do you have to borrow what you can create without limit? When you get in trouble, in debt is when you borrow in somebody else’s money. A nation that issues its own currency floats freely and is not convertible to any sort of default or anything of that nature. It is just inapplicable,” he said.

Read more: RT



It looks like any idiot can claim to be an economist these days.




Edit to add: I hope this guy doesn't work for the government.






Edit to add again: Hey, at least it's not ANOTHER oil spill thread.


[edit on 6/15/10 by FortAnthem]




posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:26 PM
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Why would Russia Today even post this.... It's sad to say, but RT is usually the better news source. What a stupid statement, We have been printing all the money out of thin air, and that is the problem.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:28 PM
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reply to post by FortAnthem
 


Ok well if he's right then. And debt isn't an issue and they can create unlimited amounts of debt. Why are you still paying taxes?

Why pay taxes at all if debt is unlimited and everything can be funded by debt?



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:32 PM
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Well, your money is worthless. What gives it value? You do. You are the debt. Have fun working it off.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:32 PM
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The American people have no debt.
The Federal Reserve Board does, though.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:35 PM
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I think what he is saying is that if the need be, we can actually print the money and pay off the debt. First thought is that it would be inflationary, but if you take all that debt out of the equation, you would also have some inverse leverage working against the money supply so in the end maybe not so much.

Another thing to consider is that we likely owe much of the money directly to the federal reserve who is likely straw buying a good deal of the treasuries that are being issued. I think this portion will just be eliminated when the time comes.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:36 PM
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Originally posted by abecedarian
The American people have no debt.
The Federal Reserve Board does, though.


No, your person is responsible for all the debt. The money was borrowed in your name.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:36 PM
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Originally posted by abecedarian
The American people have no debt.
The Federal Reserve Board does, though.


No, your person is responsible for all the debt. The money was borrowed in your person's name.

[edit on 15-6-2010 by purplemonkeydishwasher]



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:38 PM
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Originally posted by purplemonkeydishwasher
No, your person is responsible for all the debt. The money was borrowed in your person's name.

[edit on 15-6-2010 by purplemonkeydishwasher]

By whom?



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:45 PM
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Originally posted by abecedarian

Originally posted by purplemonkeydishwasher
No, your person is responsible for all the debt. The money was borrowed in your person's name.

[edit on 15-6-2010 by purplemonkeydishwasher]

By whom?

Whomever is holding your trust, the acting fiduciary, as you're considered a ward/infant of the state. Infant coming from the Latin root infans meaning 'unable to speak'.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 10:51 PM
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reply to post by abecedarian
 


I believe they are talking about the tax payers. We can thank our wonderful government for bailing out everyone, but the middle and low income families.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:05 PM
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Does it exist?

THAT is the question.

Our bankster crooks, backs by the government, backed by us supposedly writes worthless checks or debts.

I have a question, who actually holds the debt? Who actually created it? Does anyone actually think that the people did? What is the dollar?

Is it a basis of actual exchange or just a promise to pay? Hey, I have some monopoly money, DO YOU WANT SOME?




posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:05 PM
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reply to post by FiatLux
 


I have had "taxes" witheld from every paycheck since 1992, in accordance with my "bracket" and never a return has been issued.
Do I owe anything?



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:05 PM
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Sorry, duplicate post.

[edit on 6/15/2010 by abecedarian]



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:22 PM
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Break down money owed to other countries first and foremost. The US owes China a shade under 1 trillion I think, and Japan close to the same. I think in all about 4 trillion is owed to foreign governments. The rest I think is calculated to be owed to other stuff like social security and stuff like that. Bonds and all that.

Where does that leave us? Well if the US had to pay back money owed. Let's face it, if the US started over domestically most will be given a
and told to get in line. However looking at actual debt owed to other governments looks alot more manageable.

4 trillion is still alot, but if you take into account the US GDP it's really got some leeway under that.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:36 PM
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Originally posted by belial259
reply to post by FortAnthem
 

Why pay taxes at all if debt is unlimited and everything can be funded by debt?


I agree. Government economics (progressive economics) is a farce. There should be no taxes if government spending is not tied to tax revenue and it clearly has not been for a very long time. The fact that we piled on 4 trillion in *funded* spending more than we took in with revenue in the past 1.5 years means we are entirely unhinged.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:42 PM
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At this point taxes are nothing more than an inflation curb.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:46 PM
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reply to post by Judohawk
 


US Public debt is at 13.7 trillion.

Public, private and sovereign debt are 397% of GDP of the USA.

Derivatives on that debt have been quoted from many sources as "USD 1.144 Quadrillion" or thereabouts. It goes higher every day.


The population of the whole planet is about 6 billion people. So the derivatives market alone represents about USD 190,000 per person on the planet.


siliconvalleywatcher

So what you need to do when working out debt per capita is add Public debt, private debt and sovereign debt to reach the final number, which is around $350,000 per person just to hazard a guess.

You're trying to work out debt in very simplistic terms, ie how much is owed to other countries via treasury bonds. But the fact is the debt burden on the USA and the world has reached the point where it is mathematically impossible to pay it off.

All the Fed or any central bank can do is print its way out of trouble, and hope they can print enough money to counteract contractions in credit liquidity.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:49 PM
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Originally posted by abecedarian
reply to post by FiatLux
 


I have had "taxes" witheld from every paycheck since 1992, in accordance with my "bracket" and never a return has been issued.
Do I owe anything?



More than likely they owe you a refund. If they didn't, they would have been bugging you for more money long ago. If you can find your old w-2's i would take a look at them for you and see where you would come out. Feel free to U2U me.



posted on Jun, 15 2010 @ 11:57 PM
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reply to post by belial259
 


I'm just talking about treasuries that the US owes to foreign governments.

Nvm, reread your post you're right.

I know the US debt is more than just foreign treasury holdings, however alot of the debt is public and private debt, isn't it? I mean what are US citizens going to do when the US can't repay them? There really isn't much, so it's not like the US is in a rush to repay those debts.



[edit on 15-6-2010 by Judohawk]

[edit on 16-6-2010 by Judohawk]



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