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Why Have You Left Christianity?

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posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 11:37 PM
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I left Christianity 100,000 times for the exact same reason you stated. I just can't make the cut. I can't do what I'm asked to do. I've converted to Christianity 100,001 times however. I know that sets me up to fail one more time but I'm willing to give it a try again today. Maybe today I'll completely follow God's commands. If not, I'll try again tomorrow. I think the point is to die trying, not to actually achieve your goal of being perfect.


I've "given my life to Christ" about five times, and looking back, I feel like each time I "gave my life to Christ" I wasn't doing it for the right reasons. I gave my life to Christ once because I thought Christian Rock was really cool, but eventually I got bored of Christian Rock. I gave my life to Christ because of Young Life, to try to get my friends to experience Christ, but people that I didn't want to come started coming and ruined the experience. Anyways, what I'm trying to say is I never feel like I'm giving my life to Christ for the right reason.

It's a confusing thing, giving your life to Christ, unless you do it the right way. I've met one person in my life who I feel like really serves Christ in the true sense of the word. But I only got to talk to him a few times. Many Christians I've known have been ignorant, prideful in themselves and in their religion, stubborn, and terrible leaders. So another reason why I've left Christianity is a lack of good Christian leaders to guide me. I decided that if this Christian religion is so complicated that I need others to guide me to understand it, it is too complicated to be practical in society. There have been many misunderstandings regarding Christianity throughout history, a few too many, and I don't want to be the culprit behind another major misunderstanding.




posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 11:42 PM
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reply to post by Wang Tang
 

We're all sinners and imperfect men. Christians are like beggars leading other beggars to find bread. We still make terrible mistakes from time to time because we still have a sinful nature. Don't get discouraged when you or another Christian messes up, we won't have our sinless glorified bodies until the resurrection.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 11:58 PM
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I left Christianity about the age of 30...Im now 34.

1. I always wondered....if God was wrathful, fast to anger, jealous, and prideful....then why must we overcome such attributes. To me, if we are to over come jealousy, wrath, anger, and pride....then God is not these things ever.

2. I find the idea of blood sacrifices, the idea that there must be a death of something for the benefit of others...is nothing short of barbaric.

3. Alot of scriptures talk about God desires a Earthly land and Earthly temple to dwell in....but then other scriptures would say, sacrifice all things of Earth, live not for Earthly things...but things of Spirit. So why would God need a Earthly land or Temple. Especially if the kingdom is 'within'...in a place that 'holds life'. I understand why Jesus often taught on the road side, or under the trees. I dont think Jesus agreed with alot of the OT teachings, and this is why they killed him....for blasphemy.

4. I dont think we are to be told all the answers in a book....what understanding to we gain by being told the answers. If I give you the answer to a math formula....what good does that do you....you still dont have any clue how to solve the problem. Even in the book (I know, its ironic how often the book speaks against things it says) it says, seek and you will find. Surely this is not talking about seeking in a Earthly object, the things made of man and of Earth, the things that can be tainted and be destroyed.

5. Is the story of the flood. It says, God brought the flood to cleanse the Earth of the bad seed. Well what is weird, is that the Bible says, after the flood, the giants were still in the lands. I guess the plan didnt work so well huh?

6. The religion gives the idea that we are to place our sins onto another man. But then in a verse of Jesus...he says...pick up YOUR OWN CROSS...and follow me. I just dont think we can place our wrongs onto another person, I think this is a scapegoat, and it makes people feel better in thinking they can pass the buck onto someone else.

Something just told me, to seek deeper, within myself, to find understanding, on a personal path to Thee.

These are just the top 5....when I reread through the Bible after breaking away from a 'belief system' that told me what was right and wrong...I saw many things that just made no sense, for a perfect God.

I am now more spiritual then ever before.

Much love
LV

[edit on 17-6-2010 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 18-6-2010 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 18-6-2010 by LeoVirgo]



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 12:21 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


That is certainly your opinion and I respect that. My opinion is that the bible is a book and there are many different avenues to God.



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 07:33 AM
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Originally posted by snowflake_obsidian
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


That is certainly your opinion and I respect that. My opinion is that the bible is a book and there are many different avenues to God.
"Pluralism" is a self-defeating logical fallacy. There is only one God, and only one way to access Him. He has laid that access plan out and it's extremely simple for man to follow.



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 10:28 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Many different avenues to God is not the same things as many different Gods.

You have a narrow mind, you think God has set just one way, and that without the Earthly object of the book, no one could find God with the way you think.

But God is greater then that....and should be held in higher accounts then that.

In every single religion the Holy Spirit can be found. Before books were even created, the Holy Spirit could be found.



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by LeoVirgo
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Many different avenues to God is not the same things as many different Gods.


I never said it did, "Pluralism" has nothing to do with the number of Gods, but the idea that there are numerous paths to God.


You have a narrow mind, you think God has set just one way, and that without the Earthly object of the book, no one could find God with the way you think.


I'll take that as a compliment. There is a 'narrow' way to God, it's only through His only begotten Son, Jesus Christ.

"I am the way, the truth, and the life, NO ONE comes to the Father except through me."


But God is greater then that....and should be held in higher accounts then that.


You can't even conceive or fathom or measure God's greatness or Holiness.. stop trying, simply let God be God and you be part of His creation. Not only had god revealed Himself to mankind, He has also revealed through His Son how we are to approach His throne.


In every single religion the Holy Spirit can be found. Before books were even created, the Holy Spirit could be found.


That is wrong, as I said 'Pluralism" is a self-defeating logical fallacy, I can get into details if you will, but it's hogwash. And secondly, the Holy Spirit wasn't even given to men until 50 days after Christ's ascension into heaven, at Pentecost.



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 01:51 PM
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I feel like every thoughtful thread like this gets derailed by people who try to convert or set people "on the right track."

Its incredible the ego that must go into believing that you KNOW about everyone's immortal soul, and that the rest of us are lost, and it is up to the believers to find us.

Why can't people just respect other beliefs? By the way, part of respecting belief is not talking about your own as if it is absolute fact. You can talk about your faith, but don't act as if it is automatically the reality of others' lives.

Its unfathomably childish, the way these religion threads end up. Have a discourse, not a friggin lecture.

And stop quoting the bible. As far as non-believers go, its just a series of sensationalized fables.



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 04:03 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Your name claims....Not your Typical...but you are, very Typical. You walk the broad path, you follow the masses. Its your choice to just accept what you do.

I stand by what I say, the Holy Spirit has always been here, always been available....God is not difficult nor counts on us to believe other men. There has always been a way to find and understand God. There have been many markers placed here on Earth for the ones that are seeking a way out, rewards, and gratification.

There is much much much more to this experience here, then finding a right belief given in a object of Earth. The word is within the very life of Earth itself. The belief system you follow, is a reflection of your own inner being, and shows what you understand and what you dont....to God. Its not wrong...because it is what you are obviously in need of learning in this life.

All will find their way, and yes, there is a way to understand Gods greatness. There are ways to understand the highest vision God holds for us as a people, as a sphere of life. You feel the answers are here to lay in your lap, just given to you. This would defeat the purpose of learning and understanding. Even in the Bible, the truth lays there unfound by many. The pearls are not given to all common man for a reason. There is a reason only the milk is offered and not the food. We have to learn what the ways of man are, ways of Earth, before we can have understanding of what the ways of Spirit are, ways of heaven. The Bible offers both, but not in a way that it spells it out loud and clear. It takes discerning to see with the one eye.

Are paths are different, that is clear, but I have no ill feelings towards you, I hope you can understand that my voice comes out of love for Gods emanations, just as though you may feel your voice comes out of love just the same.

You have many that believe in the Bible....but even the Bible itself warns, only few find the way. There is a reason, for everything.

Each path offers the being something to learn of. It may be about ways of Earth, it may be about ways of Spirit, it may be both. But all paths offer equal value in that all of them offer something to learn from.

Know what is of flesh is of flesh, Know what is of Spirit is of Spirit....as I have said, there are things in the Bible that are of the heavens, but not laid out for the common man to gain understanding of.



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 10:40 PM
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Originally posted by SantaClaus
I feel like every thoughtful thread like this gets derailed by people who try to convert or set people "on the right track."
This thread is about "Christianity" it's in the title, if you don't like Christianity find another thread.


Its incredible the ego that must go into believing that you KNOW about everyone's immortal soul, and that the rest of us are lost, and it is up to the believers to find us.
I trust what GOD has to say about what will happen to man;s immortal souls, He is the judge, not me. And I don't make judgments about where people will go when they die, I cannot see the future. We are told not to judge people, however we are told to make judgments on people's FRUITS.


Why can't people just respect other beliefs?


Just like you're doing right now? lol


By the way, part of respecting belief is not talking about your own as if it is absolute fact.


Wrong, there is true and there is false, there is no "true for you but not true for me", that's a logical fallacy. Maybe teenagers rationalize in this manner, not I.


You can talk about your faith, but don't act as if it is automatically the reality of others' lives.
Reality is reality, truth is truth no matter who says it. Truth is NOT relative, sorry.


Its unfathomably childish, the way these religion threads end up. Have a discourse, not a friggin lecture.


See the first reply.


And stop quoting the bible. As far as non-believers go, its just a series of sensationalized fables.


Okay, I'll stop quoting the Bible to present my Biblical worldview, if you quote the Bible to present your secular worldview. Deal?



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 02:03 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


This thread is asking why people left Christianity...not about others trying to prove Christianity as the only way.

Many NDE shows people being given choices still...after death. And many, dont experience a 'outer' judgment. They are shown their lives through a divine eye...and they see what they had understanding in and what they did not.

My mothers NDE showed her that her mother who has passed, still had things to learn and that she was reincarnated. My mothers NDE also showed her, that her belief in being saved by the blood, was a Earthly thought of man, and that it was not spiritual. It was the moment when Jesus left her....and she was in a field of blood, trying to clean it up. It wasnt only her there....there was so many other beings that she felt as if they were not able to be numbered. She was a strong Christian lady who accepted being saved through the blood of Christ. During her experience of cleaning up the blood, a lady on a horse came to her, the lady held a book in her hand and was writing things down as she watched mother trying to clean up the blood that seemed never ending. She also saw Jesus trying to build something, and there was no one there to help him. She said it was very sad.

I dont think people have NDE as happenstance, I think these experiences are to show them things. As she kept being shown things...she looked at me and said, this is all things I once knew....how did I ever forget.




I trust what GOD has to say about what will happen to man;s immortal souls,


You choose to believe that these things were said by God....there is not way to prove this is so.

You are a acceptor and a follower, not a seeker. But still, all paths teach us, and are markers for the Spirit to weigh and measure what our inner nature is, according to what belief was have.

Religion is of Earth, not of Spirit.

[edit on 19-6-2010 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 19-6-2010 by LeoVirgo]



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 02:40 AM
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Originally posted by LeoVirgo
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


This thread is asking why people left Christianity...not about others trying to prove Christianity as the only way.


Thanks for that tidbit of information, I'll try to remember it if I'm ever on Jeopardy someday... so, I cannot address specific statements by others to the contrary?? LOL G O T C H A.


Many NDE shows people being given choices still...after death. And many, dont experience a 'outer' judgment. They are shown their lives through a divine eye...and they see what they had understanding in and what they did not.


We're only told a person has no more choices once they are DEAD. I'm pretty sure an omniscient God knows who He'll give life back to, and whom He'll not allow to be resuscitated back to life. "To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord." Since your mother was not clinically dead, she was in the spirit world. Satan has control over that, and "Behold, he is an angel of light". Satan can counterfeit almost any "miracle" he wants to, he's a liar and the "Father of it".



My mothers NDE showed her that her mother who has passed, still had things to learn and that she was reincarnated. My mothers NDE also showed her, that her belief in being saved by the blood, was a Earthly thought of man, and that it was not spiritual.


And I can show you countless video testimonies of other NDE's who claim the exact opposite. Believe what you want to, my faith is unshakable.



It was the moment when Jesus left her....and she was in a field of blood, trying to clean it up. It wasnt only her there....there was so many other beings that she felt as if they were not able to be numbered. She was a strong Christian lady who accepted being saved through the blood of Christ. During her experience of cleaning up the blood, a lady on a horse came to her, the lady held a book in her hand and was writing things down as she watched mother trying to clean up the blood that seemed never ending. She also saw Jesus trying to build something, and there was no one there to help him. She said it was very sad.


Completely arbitrary statement.



You choose to believe that these things were said by God....there is not way to prove this is so.


To ME there is, that is the accuracy of prophecy, to which no other religious book has. It's so utterly accurate that skeptics for centuries claimed these prophecies were written years after the events. But ooooops, we found copies of all books of the OT except for Ester in the Dead Sea scrolls in Jerusalem and shattered the skeptics propaganda. It's impossible for a man to have this knowledge unless given to him by an omniscient deity who "declares the end from the beginning". To me that certifies it's supernatural authorship. If you're assuming my faith is "blind", you're SADLY mistaken.


You are a acceptor and a follower, not a seeker.


As IF I never began my journey years ago as a 'seeker'. lol


But still, all paths teach us, and are markers for the Spirit to weigh and measure what our inner nature is, according to what belief was have.


"I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life, no one comes to the father except through Me." ~ Jesus Christ


Religion is of Earth, not of Spirit.


I agree, not a single soul has been saved by "religion", in fact Jesus condemned the Pharisees for that idea. Man needs a savior, not a checklist of Do's on Dont's.

You're parroting the New Age religion mantra, yet there is NOTHING "new" about it whatsoever, it's the same religion of Babylon, and even the same idea that satan told Eve in the garden. You're a "Pluralist", and pluralism is a self-defeating fallacy of logic. YOU need a savior, I need a savior, I suggest you build a relationship with Him because the time of the end is rapidly approaching.



[edit on 19-6-2010 by NOTurTypical]



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 02:59 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 





You're parroting the New Age religion mantra, yet there is NOTHING "new" about it whatsoever, it's the same religion of Babylon, and even the same idea that satan told Eve in the garden. You're a "Pluralist", and pluralism is a self-defeating fallacy of logic. YOU need a savior, I need a savior, I suggest you build a relationship with Him because the time of the end is rapidly approaching.


You want to label me because you dont understand that a being can learn things on a personal path with God. I find truth in many beliefs and thoughts of man. There is much I dont agree with in the new age thoughts.

Actually, the new age thought of ascension is no different then the path of self salvation....they are both a path of service to self and not paths of service to others. Our souls purpose is to offer back to the Spirit, so we can be of service to the ones still in need of learning.

No one needs a savior...we are weighed by our inner nature, not our belief. You only speak of things you read, you dont show any personal path of learning through the Holy Spirit.

Jesus did not come here to be a savior...he said, you must carry our own cross.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 12:49 PM
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Originally posted by LeoVirgo
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 





You're parroting the New Age religion mantra, yet there is NOTHING "new" about it whatsoever, it's the same religion of Babylon, and even the same idea that satan told Eve in the garden. You're a "Pluralist", and pluralism is a self-defeating fallacy of logic. YOU need a savior, I need a savior, I suggest you build a relationship with Him because the time of the end is rapidly approaching.



Actually, the new age thought of ascension is no different then the path of self salvation....they are both a path of service to self and not paths of service to others. Our souls purpose is to offer back to the Spirit, so we can be of service to the ones still in need of learning.

No one needs a savior...we are weighed by our inner nature, not our belief. You only speak of things you read, you dont show any personal path of learning through the Holy Spirit.

Excuse me, "self-salvation"?? I'm no savior, nor can I save myself. I'm saved NOT by my works which God sees as "filthy rags" but by the redemptive work Christ has already done for me on the cross. My efforts are futile, and I have NOTHING to offer God. I'm saved solely by the work of Christ, nothing I've done on my own. Salvation is by the grace of God through faith, not of works lest any man should boast.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 01:04 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


What I mean about self salvation is that one seeks a path for only themselves...and not all others.

It is no different then the new age belief in ascension...which is also a path of self.

The most divine path of the soul, is to learn to be service, to all of the other selves, that hold the Spirit. In Spirit, we are ONE.

The most divine path of the soul, is to learn to offer itself back to aid in the others still in need of learning and awakening to what we are. The ones that are seeking to 'leave earth' are going to find out they are still missing something in Spirit, which is all the other beings who are still learning.

And even though the path of 'salvation and ascension' are a path of seeking for self....they are valid paths for they all offer to us what we are in need of.

Can you explain to me, what Jesus meant, when he said...pick up your own cross and follow me? Do you understand that the idea of a scapegoat is a person not carrying their own wrongs....and they are only passing the buck. You are perfectly capable of carrying your own cross and having to stand up for your own wrongs....no one can save you from having to do that. On the path of self, this is necessary for all to do.

As a spiritual being, what do you learn, by placing your sins onto another? The fact that you believe someone had to die....reflects the nature of your own inner being. Your belief in the nature of God...reflects your own inner being as well. This is a marker, for where your growth as a spiritual being is.

The fact that many still believe that someone or something ever had to die as a part of Gods plan...shows where the inner nature on average is, in humanity. Still very primal.

And you do have something to offer God...you have the Spirit which gives you life to offer back to Thee...you have honest, to offer Thee in true seeking...you have humility, to offer before Thee.

[edit on 19-6-2010 by LeoVirgo]



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by LeoVirgo
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


What I mean about self salvation is that one seeks a path for only themselves...and not all others.

It is no different then the new age belief in ascension...which is also a path of self.

The most divine path of the soul, is to learn to be service, to all of the other selves, that hold the Spirit. In Spirit, we are ONE.

We finally agree on something. The greatest commandment Jesus gave was to love others as you'd love yourself, and the greatest form of love is to serve others. We are NOT called to convert or "save" others, but to 'always be ready to give an answer to anyone who asks you about the hope you have within you".. (1 Peter 2:15). We are NOT called to save others nor can we save ourselves. The Spirit leads men to repentance unto salvation, the Spirit convicts man of his sins and the need for Christ. And we are saved not by our works, but by the work Christ has already done.

The central tenant of Christianity is service to others, and not our friends, but service and love to our enemies. I'm not quite sure you even understand the faith you are criticizing.


Can you explain to me, what Jesus meant, when he said...pick up your own cross and follow me?
That simply means to "kill" our flesh, to remove ourselves from the throne of our lives and put Him there, He is Lord. When we gratify our flesh, and do as we please for our lives that's idolatry before God. When we do not honor the creator as both Lord and Father. To 'pick up or crosses' means to kill the flesh, kill our desires and self-righteousness. And to let Christ lead us, to follow Him.

[edit on 19-6-2010 by NOTurTypical]



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 04:39 PM
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Originally posted by Wang Tang
I am wondering, if you are like me and was a Christian and then left it, why is it that you left?


Simply, it didn't make logical sense. Over the years, all my logical questions went unanswered. I was given answers like "It's God's will" or "He works in mysterious ways" or some other such answer, meant to shut me up and stop my thinking processes.

It just got to the point that I realized that Christianity, religion and belief in God made no logical sense at ALL. I could no longer pretend to believe in something when all signals pointed to me being wrong.

Since unloading my life of everything having to do with religion, life makes so much more sense to me. I don't feel all the attachments that I used to feel with religion. I feel really free.

Like the OP, I don't need religion to know that being a good person is the right thing to do. I know that generosity, kindness, open-mindedness and honesty are traits that I want to have. Not because someone tells me to or because I read it in a book, but because I WANT to and it feels right.

I don't need the fear, threats, insecurity and dogma that comes with religion.

[edit on 6/19/2010 by Benevolent Heretic]



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 05:06 PM
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Since unloading my life of everything having to do with religion, life makes so much more sense to me. I don't feel all the attachments that I used to feel with religion. I feel really free.



I know exactly how you feel. At a point in life I realized that what I really wanted was inner peace, and by being a Christian I wasn't getting inner peace. Yes, I was troubled by the lack of evidence in my life of Christianity actually working, and yes I was troubled by the answers about God and Jesus that just couldn't be answered, but I was most troubled by my inability to find inner peace through Christianity. And by leaving Christianity I feel really free to be me, and I am starting to feel much more at peace with myself and with the world.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 05:21 PM
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The central tenant of Christianity is service to others, and not our friends, but service and love to our enemies. I'm not quite sure you even understand the faith you are criticizing.



Service and love to our enemies. It sounds good, and Jesus made it work, but people are imperfect followers of Jesus, and they often manage to twist service and love.

What I see is the reason why Christians love their enemies is to convert them to Christianity in a peaceful way. Christians are obliged to bring people to Christ, to spread the word and love of God. But when Christians cannot convert others peacefully, they resort to verbal or physical attacks to prove the dominance of Christianity. You see, in the end, religion for the masses just becomes a game of power; who can get the most converts? This is what happened during the Crusades, and this is what still happens today. I knew a Christian leader who was friendly with every new person he met, but when he got to know them better he would start arguing and attacking them over any disagreement. He would attack Christians for not trying hard enough to bring others to Christ, and he would attack non-Christians for being wrong.

Now I know not all Christians are confrontational like this, but there are many Christians that are. Even if they aren't blatant about it, I see that Christians are always somehow trying to prove that Christianity is the greatest and only true religion, and I say to myself, isn't that prideful? Isn't that ignorant?

And as for the blatantly confrontational Christians, they don't help at all. In tennis, you are only as good as your worst shot, because if your opponent discovers your worst shot, he can keep on attacking that one shot. Christianity is the same way, it's only as good as it's worst followers, and there are lots of followers that either don't care at all or are overly confrontational.



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 06:43 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Hello again

Service to others is more then service here on Earth, in the flesh. It is the offering of self, back to being of use, for all to find the way. This can even mean, offering back the soul/spirit to incarnate as a part of a persons karma that they are in need of, such as being a victim. It can go very deep, but once the soul understands that there is no rest, until all awake to the Spirit that they are of...once we understand that anyone still in need of learning is another part of us (because we are all of Spirit, One)...then the offering is not hard, but it is the only natural thing to do. When I talk about being of service, Im not just talking about answering questions, giving hope, helping others....Im talking about literal service, setting the 'self' aside completely, and be willing to be what ever the Divine needs for us to be.




The Spirit leads men to repentance unto salvation, the Spirit convicts man of his sins and the need for Christ. And we are saved not by our works, but by the work Christ has already done.


I just wholeheartedly disagree....not that it should matter what I think for your path...but it is very far from what I understand of Spiritual things.

The Spirit leads us in awakening to what we are, which is of Thee. The SPirit does not convict man, for when man can see through the Divine Eye, the soul/spirit of that body complex convicts theeself, there is no denying what things still need to be learned. There is a need for the Spirit to be awakened with in every single soul.

It is not about being saved at all...for God is so great, Thee has made a way for all to return. We dont have a free pass...we do have to work at it, and it takes time. The reason we all have our own bodies is because we all have to carry our own cross.

It is our nature within us that gets sifted, weighed, and measured, so yes, works will come into much account. Jesus offered his Earthly body back to Earth...and truly lived for the life of Spirit. This is what makes him a great teacher and guide. He reminded us of the true offering of self, something we all must do.

Our ideas of being of service, are different. You seek salvation...you seek to leave here and not concern yourself with the ones still learning...this is a path of self, no different then the ones that seek ascension from here, for their self. These paths are not wrong...for they show what these souls are in need of learning, and that they are still in need of learning, about themselves. We are starting to see a shift though, and this shift is happening because there are more awakening to the understanding of offering the self back to Spirit, becoming one with the Spirit, and being of Service of the Spirit. There will be more souls being born then ever before with the humble nature and vibration of natural love and offering.

All my best
LV


[edit on 19-6-2010 by LeoVirgo]



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