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Why doesn't God intervene? A question to the religious among you..

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posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by Mykahel
reply to post by wavemaker
 


Oh, so this life is like a game being controlled by some other "true me" in another "true reality."

If I play a game and use a character that goes around as a thief and assassinates the rich just cause I want to see if I can get away with it, it has absolutely NO similarity to REAL LIFE. Video game characters don't actually feel. They don't have life experiences. Killing them doesn't matter because they don't actually exist.

What you are suggesting is more like a game where I could place a mind control device on a person, make them do my bidding, including rape, murder, and then skydive without a parachute, just because I wanted the experience. Never mind that it was a real person with feelings. Never mind that he actually felt pain while I controlled him.

Completely different than a game.


If you start believing that we have souls who are truly loved by the Creator (as opposed to the vengeful God), then it will not be difficult for you to understand that life in third density is not our real life. After we are done in this third density life, we will go home to 5th density where only higher vibrations of love and happiness can exist.

We are created perfectly and you will surely agree with me that life in third density is far from perfect. That is because this is not our real home. We are here for the experience only and we are pretty much done by now.

You have laid out your plan for this lifetime and if diving without a parachute is one of them, then that will be done.




posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 10:28 AM
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What is the entire universe made of? Matter. What is matter made of? Energy. Energy cannot be created or destroyed, but only change molecular structure...Physics 101. Energy is everywhere, in all things, has always been, will always be. Energy= God. To get closer to the point...intelligent energy=God.

So, if everything in the universe is made of "God" ...aka energy. We collectively are God. We are all One. Thereby, God doesn't interfere because "he" would be only interfering with himself.

You can also look at this way. There is nothing in this life here on Earth that can happen to you that is "bad". Why? Because nothing that happens can harm you..the true you... the SELF made of energy. Energy can't be created or destroyed. When you "die" your energy (soul) is still there, not harmed...everything happening in your life while you incarnated is but to experience that which you already know. Those "children" are small new bodies, but the energy inside (soul) is as ancient as the cosmos and has lived many lives and experienced many "bad" things. When go back home (die) its really birth back into your real world. Here on earth...incarnating is the illusion. So there nothing for God to intervene with...when nothing truly hurts you.

[edit on 17-6-2010 by ptmckiou]



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 10:39 AM
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This is one of the most difficult questions in all of theology. God is eternal, infinite, omniscient, omnipresent, and omnipotent. Why should human beings (not eternal, infinite, omniscient, omnipresent, or omnipotent) expect to be able to fully understand God’s ways? The book of Job deals with this issue. God had allowed Satan to do everything he wanted to Job except kill him. What was Job’s reaction? “Though he slay me, yet will I hope in him” (Job 13:15). “The LORD gave and the LORD has taken away; may the name of the LORD be praised” (Job 1:21). Job did not understand why God had allowed the things He did, but he knew God was good and therefore continued to trust in Him. Ultimately, that should be our reaction as well.

Why do bad things happen to good people? The biblical answer is there are no “good” people. The Bible makes it abundantly clear that all of us are tainted by and infected with sin (Ecclesiastes 7:20; Romans 6:23; 1 John 1:8). Romans 3:10-18 could not be clearer about the non-existence of “good” people: “There is no one righteous, not even one; there is no one who understands, no one who seeks God. All have turned away, they have together become worthless; there is no one who does good, not even one. Their throats are open graves; their tongues practice deceit. The poison of vipers is on their lips. Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness. Their feet are swift to shed blood; ruin and misery mark their ways, and the way of peace they do not know. There is no fear of God before their eyes.” Every human being on this planet deserves to be thrown into hell at this very moment. Every second we spend alive is only by the grace and mercy of God. Even the most terrible misery we could experience on this planet is merciful compared to what we deserve, eternal hell in the lake of fire.

A better question would be “Why does God allow good things to happen to bad people?” Romans 5:8 declares, “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” Despite the evil, wicked, sinful nature of the people of this world, God still loves us. He loved us enough to die to take the penalty for our sins (Romans 6:23). If we receive Jesus Christ as Savior (John 3:16; Romans 10:9), we will be forgiven and promised an eternal home in heaven (Romans 8:1). What we deserve is hell. What we are given is eternal life in heaven if we come to Christ in faith.

Yes, sometimes bad things happen to people who seem undeserving of them. But God allows things to happen for His reasons, whether or not we understand them. Above all, however, we must remember that God is good, just, loving, and merciful. Often things happen to us that we simply cannot understand. However, instead of doubting God's goodness, our reaction should be to trust Him. ”Trust in the LORD with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge Him, and He will make your paths straight” (Proverbs 3:5-6).

www.gotquestions.org...



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 12:39 PM
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It is as simple as this O.P. If there is such thing as a god, then we as humans can not possibly be able to understand why he does things. Certain people must die so that others can live. Stories about babies being burned have to be heard, so that it doesn't happen to other babies.

And well, if there is no such thing as god, then it comes down to the sick depravity of man, and his need to dominate and assert his power over anyone or anything. People are #ed up in the head. Its not all their fault, we are living in a time that is completely different then any other time in earths billion(+) year history. It is hard for people to cope with the stress of this busy capitalist world. Still that is no excuse for burning babies, but I hope you can see my point.

Either way, its best to not ask these questions that have no real answer. Or better yet, start with smaller questions and work your way up to the big questions.The one's that require alot more in depth personal soul searching to answer.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 01:05 PM
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reply to post by kiwifoot
 

I'm not exactly religious, but I do recognize an Omnipotent Creator.

Answer:
It's because all of experience is experienced by contract.

Rihanna knew before her incarnation what said incarnation would entail, down to the manner and time of her death.

She came to experience that, specifically.

To paraphrase Jerry Garcia, If you only choose to experience good, you're missing half of what life has to offer.

Since we are here to gather experience for the One Infinite Creator, we do all sorts of things that aren't soft and cushy. But our inner selves are never surprised when it happens.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 02:24 PM
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Originally posted by kiwifoot

Originally posted by TheUltimateEnd
Not everything is God's Fault, Get your crap right.

-Don't make my waste my post again, but then again It would be a waste of my powers to NOT tell you to get your things right before posting.

[edit on 13-6-2010 by TheUltimateEnd]


Sir, take a second to READ before MOUTHING OFF. (IF you can)

I never said these accidents were God's fault.

I said he didn't use his all powerful abilities to stop a baby from dying a bloody painful death.

You're angry because it's true...you know it ...





[edit on 13-6-2010 by kiwifoot]


It is called population control. It is a cruel thing, but life is a bitch. How come GOD doesn't intervene with so much corruption and evil in this world? I mean they get rewarded while the good people suffer.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 06:21 PM
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Originally posted by Pentothal

Originally posted by Hellas

Originally posted by Pentothal

Originally posted by Hellas
because that would be against the "free will" he gave mankind.


Free will?

Would that be the free will that says: love and obey me, meaning; do exactly as my earthly representatives say (and interpret writings) from a selection of old texts, edited and collated by many different people, each with their own agenda over a period of hundreds of years.

Or

Spend an eternity in pain, misery, burning, torture and tormented in a place called hell.

You choose.

Yes... free will.



If you wanna live in my House you gotta play by my rules! It's that simple

If you think you can be an "outlaw" you have to pay the price.

So it's your FREE WILL to decide where you want to spend eternity

[edit on 13-6-2010 by Hellas]



So the 'choice' is:

Do as the people who say they are Gods representatives say (the ones who decide what scriptures to teach you from when you are a child)

Or

Suffer unimaginably for eternity.

What a loving caring proposition!

Bare in mind that the information on which you base this decision is and has been controlled, edited and delivered in such a way as to get the desired outcome.

Put the money in the bag or I will blow your head off. The choice is yours. If you give me the money, you will not suffer. It is an armed robbery.

So, God created us to love and serve him?

The trouble is, all we have to go on are some very old texts that actually contradict themselves (and plagiarise a story told many times before in many cultures).

So we are not only presented with this very civilised choice of 'serve or be tortured for infinity', but we are informed about this very important of choices in the most vague and unreliable way. The message being relayed through a myriad of liars and swindlers (and worse in some cases (see recent abuse cases)).

Surely the all powerful could at least give us the information required for us to make this most important of decisions in an unambiguous and verifiable way? But no... We must believe the word of people. Come on!

The fact that an all powerful, ever present, alpha and omega God should require little us to tell him just how great he is and show just how afraid we are of him (otherwise he will torture and burn and kill all those who do not) seems like a ruse to make people compliant to me.

The concept of servitude actually benefits man. In this case it benefits Gods earthly representatives who are paid good money by followers and told to keep coming back under threat of eternal torture.

If you think that in all the eternal universe we are here to massage the ego of a character indicated in some ancient texts, then I do not know what to say.

Why do the 'scriptures' the the west mostly follow differ from the far eastern philosophies? Did God mean it that way? Did he let us find the 'truth' and let them over there find mere stories? I mean, if that is the case it is down right cruel considering what is at stake.

When the choice provided AND the information on which you base your decision is controlled and delivered to you, there is NO choice involved.


[edit on 13-6-2010 by Pentothal]


Responding to the free will debate of the "house rules".

First off. You are attempting to use the word "outlaw" as a dysphemism for something bad, for a person who is known for not following authority. It has nothing to do with anything bad. Unless you think that following authority is what everyone should do? but what about tyranny? What about when it just feels unfair?

The analogy of someone getting kicked out because of "house rules" is the same as a Father to offspring family - go off on your own into the world, it is your choice, but to live among a God you must follow my rules.

Outcasting the son/daughter could be considered punishment, but God goes the extra mile by condemning them to eternal suffering. This isn't the same as the analogy. When you get kicked out, it is your choice from there on that punishes you, not the choice itself.

Those who follow a simple couple of rules have been doing these very wicked things but are forgiven if they follow those simple couple rules, less be overwhelmed with enough guilt to actually change their ways. So why is it that an "outlaw" who can follow many if not most of all the rules except the simple couple. Why is he so harshly punished? Which is fair?

And if you reply - "It is up to God in the end" then why even mention not believing is punishable? And we are talking about plausibility of existence here according to man, no teachings or anything else.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 06:30 PM
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Because God is each of the chess pieces, each of the players and he is the board on which the pieces move. God is the game itself.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 07:26 PM
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reply to post by kiwifoot
 


The permission of evil is the most important aspect of the plan of God. It is a difficult and harsh experience, but one which will have eternal benefits. I have a link that I could share with you to read a detailed explanation which will answer your question to your complete satisfaction, if you are interested.



posted on Jun, 17 2010 @ 09:59 PM
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Interesting thread, with some very well thought out responses. S+F from me.


I think it's pretty awesome that as a species we haven't outgrown the need for imaginary friends and security blankets. As much as I feel a majority of religious people are naive, stupid, ignorant etc... I can't help but think there's a benefit to all of it somehow. Like that belief - that "fear of God" and repercussions for our actions may keep us in the dark ages technologically, but in the same respect, it probably keeps us from destroying ourselves because we lack the ability to generate discretion at the same rate in which we wield power.

It's a two edged sword, and the edge we're walking is just razor thin.

Also, an old obligatory for anyone that hasn't read it: The 1966 Time press "Is God Dead?" was about 6 years ahead of my time, but has always been an illuminating read (my mom kept a copy of this in the living room magazine rack until my parents died in 96).

www.time.com...



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 01:34 AM
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reply to post by kiwifoot
 


Nature has provoked many grand descriptives from awe struck witnesses but it is also said that beauty is only skin deep. Below the surface is a world that has been described as a place where it is the survival of the fittest and as far as humans go it has been described as a dog eat dog world. Multitudes of living things are constantly being killed or maimed every day all day long and this has been going on for a very long time. Most of humans ignore the suffering that goes on for a variety of reasons. Some of us though are saddened by it and it is a constant ache.

There is a story of a man that our family admires. He helped alleviate many peoples suffering, he also fed them, and taught them. He was able to do this because as he said he only did and said what his father told him to do and say. He was willing to come to that point so he could help others. How many would be willing to do that? As the story goes even though he was willing to heal them they tortured and killed him instead. Our family likes what this man stood for, what he did, and what he had to say. So much so we call him our God. We look forward to someday meeting others who feel the same way and even moreso we look forward to meeting him.

Truth



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 05:05 AM
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reply to post by orionthehunter
 





I believe God has intervened many times when I ask for something simple like a change in the weather. I believe God will intervene when large groups of people pray for a change.


Amazing ! your god will change the weather for you but won't do sod all about a hurricane heading toward a heavily populated area with thousands praying their asses off.

Seems like this god character is always up for the simple things like back ache and boils but when it comes to regenerating a limb or ending the suffering of cancer the dude is positively indolent.

A rational intelligent human being will observe that the merciful god is synonymous with coincidence and placebo effect.

[edit on 18-6-2010 by piedsniper]



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 10:36 PM
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It takes a christian to understand God. I'm not going to explain it to you if you are just going to argue his existence.



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 10:49 PM
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reply to post by kiwifoot
 
Quote : "Thank you for that reply, quite beautiful. But my main gripe still holds true, surely God shouldn't have allowed this poor baby to go in such a horrific manner. Especially if it was the work of the devil!!" --- It's apparent you don't believe in the least there is a God. So why are you 'pretending' to want someone to prove his existence to you? After reading your posts it seems you think you know better how to run the world than GOD. Well, maybe then we should believe that you are the real GOD??? So, big man... errr, God, why did you let that baby or any other suffer?



posted on Jun, 18 2010 @ 10:55 PM
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reply to post by KrispyB
 


I second that notion.

You can lead a horse to water...



posted on Jun, 19 2010 @ 03:14 AM
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Originally posted by KrispyB
It takes a christian to understand God. I'm not going to explain it to you if you are just going to argue his existence.


Funny...because all the Christians I converse with do not understand God...they are the followers of another man, they follow the masses, this is not the narrow road that few find the way.

God needs no blood or deaths to occur for sins. God only needs a honest heart that is open to be guided by the Spirit.

There is a reason for this....there are many markers on Earth that show God, what a persons nature is. Accepting the Christian faith is one of those markers to show God the inner nature of that person, which is still a very primal nature with much to still learn of things of Spirit.

Its not that any path is wrong...for the path shows God what the being is still in need of learning.

Example, to believe God is wrathful and jealous...shows that the person has a inner nature of jealousy and wrath. To believe that someone must die and sins can be placed onto another being, shows God that this being is still very primal in their heart.

The belief in blood sacrifice, is very primal. This belief is not of Spirit.



posted on Jun, 21 2010 @ 09:30 PM
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I was just making the point that he (HE) was not a christian and therefore had no chance at all of understanding such things. Not that all christians understand either, but it sure helps in thinking in the right direction.



posted on Jun, 22 2010 @ 12:39 AM
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I think the simplest thing to say is....why look towards god, when MAN can easily make these changes. Those who seek god, to make all the changes THEY can in this world, is a weak man. If i was god i would ignore you too.



posted on Jun, 22 2010 @ 01:05 AM
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posted on Jun, 24 2010 @ 10:56 AM
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Originally posted by KrispyB
It takes a christian to understand God. I'm not going to explain it to you if you are just going to argue his existence.


Can you show me a Christian who understands God and can you tell him to contact me, i want to know more about that "person".

Also I would like from all those who speak abut the devil, Satan, Hell and so on to give me an idea of what that could be.

I am a curious being, there are some things that escape to me and here some people seem to know.





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