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the abortion issue

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arc

posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 11:22 AM
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Since I've joined this board I have noticed in quite a few threads that some people have mentioned in passing the issue of abortion. Usually to blame the fact that it is legal for most of modern society's problems. Can any of you who feel this way please elaborate on how exactly you think it affects society?

btw I am pro-choice but I'm not trying to inflict my view on anyone else. I totally respect those who feel abortion is wrong for themselves or their partner, but who don't judge those who do agree with abortion. This thread is for looking at the wider effect on general society.




posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 11:27 AM
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Well, arc I disagree. I belive that abortion is murder that you are taking the life of something that can live. I feel that when you get pregnate it is your fault for sleeping with whomever and you must know take that child. Or send him/her to an adoption center. Be interesting if you made this a poll too arc.


arc

posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 11:46 AM
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JM I didn't make this a poll as I didn't set this up to be an 'abortion - right or wrong?' thing. I know what I think on the issue and accept that it is only my view and others will have theirs.

What I'm after is how people think abortion affects a whole society

[Edited on 9-3-2003 by arc]



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 12:04 PM
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Just my thoughts ... I think by terminating pregnancies perhaps we miss out on valuable lives that we could have known and loved and possibly made a wonderful impact on this world, then again it could go the other way to so..personally I don't agree or disagree, but im more so in favour of pro-choice since many women have many different reasons for choosing to abord.



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 12:14 PM
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Interesting that the woman at the heart of the Roe vrs Wade case has become anti abortion and said she lied about how she got pregant to further the case.

She said how shocked she was at realising that her case had become an excuse for people to kill their kids and carry on living selfishly

.... not that I am venturing an opinion just repeating the comments.


arc

posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 12:25 PM
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I hadn't heard of the case you mention but I will go hunt down some information on it. From your comment I am guessing it involved the public condoning of abortion.

I'm not sure if something like that would exactly encourage anyone to have an abortion though. The decision to have a pregnancy terminated is generally not one a woman would take lightly, the choice is a deeply personal and difficult one and has consequences either way. Public opinion of abortion is not exactly the major concern when someone is going through an unplanned pregnancy


arc

posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 12:42 PM
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well I found this www.roevwade.org... and understand a little more about why that case existed. Although the site itself is totally anti-abortion.

Some very interesting opinions and information on there but doesn't really answer any questions about society in general.



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 01:28 PM
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Just a thought... if we could've terminated the birth of Hitler through abortion, then would you support it?


I feel that when you get pregnate it is your fault for sleeping with whomever and you must know take that child.


well, what happens if the mother was raped and as a result she got pregnant, would that be her fault too? A woman long time ago was raped but due to her religious beliefs she gave birth to her son. Her son was Bob Marley.

My opinion is I'm totally against abortion. Only time I might support an abortion is if the mother may be subject to harm because of a pregnancy or if the mother was raped, but even then I still might say go ahead and have the baby. Only a few times will I support an abortion.



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 01:28 PM
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Originally posted by arc

What I'm after is how people think abortion affects a whole society

[Edited on 9-3-2003 by arc]


It doesn't effect all of society. And even though I am against abortion, i still say that. Why?

Quite simply, it is a personal choice. You can't go to some hobo out on the street and say "hey should I abort" cause a) hoboes would have no idea what you're talking about
and b) it is your child, not his, so it is your choice. I can't see how people can blame "society's problems" on abortion cause there's no connection.

Signing off,
HLW



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 03:12 PM
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There are some women who use abortions, as a means of birth control. I've heard excuses such as, "Oh it wasn't the right sex." or " It was a Downs Syndrome so I decided to terminate"
"How will abortion affect a whole society?"
I believe in the future you will not see deformed, ill, or the mentally retarded, due do selective abortions. Societies misfits will be elminated. Where will the line be drawn?
Who decides and what's next? How about the couple who can't afford a baby? Should they be allowed to have one? When will Big Brother intervene?
I have many reasons for being against it, but on the other hand in some cases I'm for it.



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 04:52 PM
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Good point mountain star, you only need to look to India and China to see the extreme outcome of selective culling the unborn.

They are heading for social meltdown as their males have few wives owing to abortion of the baby girls.



[Edited on 9-3-2003 by Netchicken]


arc

posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 04:57 PM
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it's not just abortion in those countries - many baby girls are killed just after birth. It happens because sons have always been more valuble, not because abortion is legal



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 05:10 PM
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Illmatic for once I agree with you on something
Actually, legend has it that both Saddam's and Hitler's mothers were going to have an abortion... but were both talked out of it by 'jewish' women. Sounds skeptical to me... don't know where I heard that from though. It sounds like another anti-semetic ploy though. I used to be indifferent to abortion till I was face to face with complete ignorance. Met a girl at a party, things were heating up... she wanted sex but I had no condom... so she says "So I'll get an abortion" That discusted me to no end.
Women are supposed to be the more caring of the two sexes, in some ways they are... but in the long run they are the more selfish. That's exactly what 99.9% of abortions are. Selfish. It's women's responsibilty to not get pregnant. Men's too, I'm not saying men are innocent.. but when it comes down to it the women should be responsible for her own body.
If a woman get's raped.. then take the morning after pill immediately after. Why wait till the baby is developed? But still ban abortion. If they ban abortion for everything but rape then think about it.... If a women is selfish enough to kill an innocent baby to cover her mistake... then she will sure as hell be selfish enough to say that the father raped her... even if he didn't. So the baby dies, and an innocent man goes to jail. If I meet a girl and she says she is pro-choice... I automatically scratch her off the list... how can somebody so selfish to kill a babt possibly be a good wife or mother for my kids


arc

posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 05:22 PM
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I can see why the attitude of that girl disgusted you - it makes me feel the same way. Not for being pro-choice but for being so irresponsible! If she'd ever had an abortion she'd never willingly put herself through another.

grunt from what you say are you implying that society has become selfish and no longer values life, because abortion is legal?



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 06:22 PM
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It's strange... society today values life more than ever it seems... but the life that it values is backwards. It's a screwed up society that believes that Mass Murderers should be allowed to live... while innocent babies are slaughtered in the millions. That some people value the life of a rat over the scientific cures for diseases. That some people think it's noble to kill hunters and offroaders, for the sake of saving a tree or a deer. That when people go fishing for enjoyment or to feed their families, they get rocks thrown at them and their children for the life of a fish.
It seems this society values every kind of life but human life... Abortion did not create this society, but this society legalizes abortion.


AF1

posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 06:23 PM
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I recently read an article about how a young girl in Latin America was raped. She was 9 years old and got pregnant. In all honesty how is she supposed to support this child. You wanna know why she didnt want to have the kid: She was too worried about sharing her toys!

I don't like abortion, but in the end their are some cases where it is the only option. Using abortion as a form of birth control is horrible. I heard about a hooker who was upset because they told her she could have no more abortions. She wanted to have her ninth one!



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by MountainStar
Who decides and what's next?


Unfortunately, MS, there is one thing that stops this: no one has the right to play "God." No one has the right to take a life just because a child who has no control over his or her life directly after birth has MS. I mean, when it comes down to it, that's just plain sick. To have an innocent human being die because the parents or maybe just mother decides that the child is "defective." In order to root out all the physical and mental defects that take hold before and after birth, you'd need to expirament with human DNA. Which is also wrong.

I agree with you on everything else except on this one point. Abortion to do such a thing is evil. Even if the choice is made by a good person.

Signing off,
HLW



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 09:53 PM
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High_Lord_Warrior say's

"Unfortunately, MS, there is one thing that stops this: no one has the right to play "God." No one has the right to take a life just because a child who has no control over his or her life directly after birth has MS. I mean, when it comes down to it, that's just plain sick. To have an innocent human being die because the parents or maybe just mother decides that the child is "defective." In order to root out all the physical and mental defects that take hold before and after birth, you'd need to expirament with human DNA. Which is also wrong.

I agree with you on everything else except on this one point. Abortion to do such a thing is evil. Even if the choice is made by a good person. "

Signing off,
HLW
__________________________________________

The baby has no voice, in this matter
The mother does and possibily the father.

arc say's
"I can see why the attitude of that girl disgusted you - it makes me feel the same way. Not for being pro-choice but for being so irresponsible! If she'd ever had an abortion she'd never willingly put herself through another."
___________________________________________
I've know of women who have used abortions as a means of birth control. Therefore willingly putting themselves through another. I had to take care of them, after their abortions. The babies or (products of conception) were tossed out like yesterdays garbage.
A woman and her husband decided to have an abortion, because the third child she was carrying was another girl. They wanted a son.
You're right High_Lord_Warrior it is just plain sick. But the sorry thing is......... they can play God. As I understand it.. you are either for or against abortions. There's no in- between. There's where I have a problem. One case I remember well delt with incest. The mother/child was pregnant by her real father.
She was 12 years old. She had the baby and gave it up. The baby remained in the hospital for a month, until he went into a foster home.
The baby was born with multiple deformities. Including a small brain. The baby could not suck and had the cry of a cat.

Should this baby have been born? The 12 year old mom had no say. It was forced upon her. An abortion was warranted here, in my opinion. I heard the baby only lived another month, in the foster home. Dear old dad was sentenced to jail.
Now the government is talking cutting social security or extending the age limit. By what's next I meant. It's just a matter of time before they decide what baby should live or not. Especially if the government has to pay for it. Do you really think welfare will continue paying for premature care or really sick babies? Abortions are the future......... It's just plain cheaper like it or not!



posted on Mar, 9 2003 @ 10:19 PM
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Yeah but that's saying just because there are thieves and murderers, we should forget about them and accept it. No way.

One proposal I have actually takes aways people's freedoms a little. But people are irresponsible with these freedoms anyway. When a girl is going through adolesence implant some kind of device that does no damage to her in anyway, and will let her grow up healthy with no adverse effects. This device will prevent her from getting pregnant. When she is properly married, and can prove that her and the husband can properly provide support and love for the child, then the government will remove the implant, free of charge. This isn't imposing on one's freedoms too much because they can still have a child, but must fit the requirements needed to have that baby. Such a device maybe impossible to make, but who knows



posted on Mar, 10 2003 @ 08:56 AM
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OK so a woman finds she is carrying a profoundly handicapped child that will need constant, intensive care for the rest of it's life and will totally alter this woman and her whole families lives, she wants an abortion, who has the right to judge her! It's all very well proclaiming it's right to life no matter what it's condition but who among the pro lifers would be willing to give up their lives to help this woman care for the child twenty-four seven. Not half as many as are willing to condemn her for having an abortion I'd guess.
I'm certainly against abortion as a means of birth control and some excuses that women have been known to give seem far more based on selfish desire and lack of responsability but at the same time there is a huge grey area where the situation can only be judged on it's own merits.



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