Poverty and the recession

reply to post by brilab45


Honestly I have never seen that. What I have seen are people so poor they go fish in a public lake for food. I have seen people without any type of phone at all.
I lived next to couple when I lived in a studio; that had no furniture, all they had was clothes, bread and peanut butter. I have seen 4 people living in a studio apartment. I never said anything but they were kicked for having more than 2.
I have seen 8 people living in a 3 bedroom house. I have seen people who live in houses that look like they are falling down. I have seen homeless on the streets who are pushed around and beat up.
The people I have who live in poverty had nothing nice but they were the nicest people you would ever meet.

reply to post by dreamseeker

What are your thoughts on poverty in general?

I think it really really sucks.

Is it caused by the indivual , the government or both?

It depends as there are as many causes as there are people, the increasing prevalence though, I think is a direct result of banks and government and corportions.

When you think of disablity,welfare,unemployment and food stamps what comes to mind.

Disabled people should be taken care of by their direct family, it never fails to astonish me that nobody cares for family anymore. welfare is a waste of our tax dollars and our resources, it should be limited to those citizens who have worked, paid in and who find themselves stuck in a position they could not have controlled, it should be very very much limited & capped, and that's the plain truth, same goes for food stamps, and I am on them, however I have worked since 16 and paid into it, I now can't find a job, but I AM attending school, so maybe I can find a better career. Unemployment should definately be given to everyone who has worked regardless of the circumstances surrounding the loss of work, we should not have to keep working at an evil conglomorate like WAL MART just because we fear not finding other work. Suck that, it should be based on all jobs ever and be a pool like Social Security and disability, it should be the same across the board no matter how long you worked within the year, but how long you worked in your life, period!!!!

How has poverty been worsened by the recession?

I think it has sent a lot of people to the streets without a home, because of foreclosures, and I beleive it will be harder for those displaced to find jobs, and I think that because of the recession, many have found themselves ina position where they can't keep their homes.

Have your veiws on poverty changed since the recession and how?

No, I pretty much hold the same view about it as always. That every situation of poverty is different, some people refuse to work and they cause it themselves, some live above their means and lose everything, and even some go to jail for fraud and everything gets taken siezed by the government and ends up the remaining family outside of jail gets left impoverished.
And I always thought that it must really suck for those in poverty.

I think I should add that I have seen both sides of the coin firsthand. I know a very near and dear friend of mine that worked her tush off to get ahead, now has real bad health issues and cannot make it she cannot work. She also recieves SSI but cannot get food stamps, welfare, but they do get medicaid her spouse got injured on the job and the company had no workmens comp and he pays CS also, and they still cannot work he cannot get unemployment I think he's on SSI, whatever, but that is not enough to barely make it. The family gave her a Mobile home on their property. But when the owner dies it will likely be taken away from her. I have also worked at Wal Mart, and been treated like crap by both illegals who are customers talking crap in their tongue, unbeknownst to them I KNOW SPANISH!!!! Especially the derogatory terms and I have seen them pay with food stamps and welfare cash as well as whip out fat wads of cash to pay after they have expended all the welfare and food stamp money on the card as well I was being treated like a POS by the management of the Wal mart. And I was the HARDEST worker they had never got below 90 percent and most of the time above on performance. But they cut my hours just short of recieving my Healthcare and stuff as well as being not very nice to work with, actually downright hostile to work with, IMO. So This is why I say there are a lot of circumstances to consider. I don't know how anyone can lump them ALL together.

[edit on 12-6-2010 by ldyserenity]

One thing that bemuses me about poverty is that some people nowadays (I hate saying nowadays cos it makes me sound old ) seem to have a completely different view of what poverty is, compared to a few decades ago.

What I mean is this. (Can I first of all state that, as unbelievable as the following may sound to some of you, I swear hand on heart all this is true and not eggagerated in any way).

When I was a child my parents were out of work (I won't go into the reasons why - too complicated) but basically we lived off benefits, in a council house.

We had no central heating, no fitted carpets (a few well placed rugs or offcuts, is all), and never had brand new clothes - all clothes were bought from charity shops. We had a black and white TV until I was about maybe fourteen, but even when we got a colour one it was rented from a TV rental company - we didn't own it outright. (And yes, colour TV's were available long before I was fourteen - I'm really not that old ) Video recorder? Not until I'd left school and got a job.

We didn't have a fridge (we used a reasonably cold cupboard in the kitchen for milk and cheese etc), didn't have an automatic washing machine, didn't have a telephone and didn't have a car.

But we were reasonably happy - we weren't in debt or anything, we just had very little to live on and we muddled through. Funny thing is, I don't remember ever thinking that I wished we had more. We were never hungry or cold (well not too cold), we had a roof over our heads and food to eat.

Now, though, there are kids who think poverty means not having the latest iPhone or Playstation or whatever. They probably can't even contemplate growing up the way I (and probably thousands more) did. That's why I put the disclaimer at the top - because I know some people will simply not believe that my family lived like that.

So I guess what my long rambling is trying to say, is that the word 'poverty' probably conjures up different things depending on a person's background and experiences and expectations.

As for my childhood? I guess some would call it living in poverty but you know what? I don't. Not really. Because as I said above, we had everything we needed.

Poverty, to me, is about not having the things you need. It's not about not having the things you want.

reply to post by tappy


I completely agree, that's what poverty is to me, not having the things you need, not want. You must be around my age 30 something? Well anyway, I would not consider your family impoverished, I consider those homeless or hungry impoverished, those who have worn tattered and stained clothing until they can no longer wear it, those who have shoes with holes and no winter jackets, those are impoverished, and that is why I don't consider myself in poverty, we have a roof over our heads, we have food and clothing, although the food is thanks to food stamps, however don't think it pays for all our food, hardly, we gotta still shell out money for that at the end of the month still because it isn't a whole lot a food stanmps for five people, it's 367 for three kids and 2 adults, the adults are not eligable, I am not because I won lottery last year, my Spouse isn't cause his boss refuses to send them a statement of his wages and one kid I can't get her SS# because I can't find her BC. Anyway, that's besides the point, I still without the stamps would find a way to get them food, if it meant me working the fields, which I even consider being on the stamps, except I ahve no car makes it kind of hard to even find a job. Yet I still do not consider myself in poverty. Always we have found a way no matter what and let me tell you we even had to fish and what not to get fod before, when we have be denied help in the past. That's why in some regards I do a lot of times come off as arrogant to some because it just irritates me seeing how some do bilke the system!!! I want to take a friggin rolling pin to their heads, lol. It is very subjective though. Maybe all those illegals that have those escalades and all teh wads of cash while on assistance are really really ill, and sell drugs to get their cash which is untaxable anyway unless they pass it into law to legalize and tax it. Though I really doubt this is the case. I think that more people on assistance truly are fraudulent, I think like only 10 percent on it really need it, and probably 50 percent of those that really need it are denied more times than not.

Originally posted by dreamseeker
What are your thoughts on poverty in general?

A sad and seemingly eternal aspect of human life; a tragedy on every level known by the majority of humans in most times and places. This doesn't mean we can cease our unending battle against it, of course. History has also known strong, well-functioning societies where all classes were relatively happy.

Is it caused by the indivual , the government or both?

It is too complex to reduce to a small set of causes. As noted above it occurs in different times, degrees, conditions, etc. Among the other many causes are:
-Natural causes, such as famines, events like the dust bowl era, poor harvests, life in areas in which human needs outstrip the available resources, etc.
-Snarlups in the general products/goods distribution system (i.e., the way wealth is allocated in any society)
-Deliberate savaging of the above distribution system by the elite to further fill their own coffers or strengthen their positions. Or, conversely, destruction of the mechanism through haphazard short-term mass demands of people at lower levels of society can have the same effect.
-Macroeconomic factors, such as the way the business cycle works, and responses to it (inflation, deflation, interest rate policy, the explosion of debt on all levels of the economy, and so on)
-The long-term ramifications of bad polices, practices, and behaviors that were adopted some decades ago. ("chikens coming home to roost"). This can be seen on individual, social, cultual, governmental, and financial levels

How has poverty been worsened by the recession?

Absolutely.



[edit on 6/12/10 by silent thunder]

reply to post by ldyserenity

Hi

Yeah, I'm about your age I guess, I'm 36

Good to hear that you're keeping a positive attitude and managing to 'stay afloat' as it were, despite not being in the best of circumstances.

I agree, people who cheat the system anger me too, because it gives the people genuinely in need a bad name.

I can't think of poverty without the realization that it is not the cause of the workers, but the cause of the engineers of the economic system. The workers don't know enough about how the system works to be blamed for its collapse. Collectively, humanity is not stupid enough to ruin it's own livelihood this way...

Knowing first that all of our money comes into existence as loans from a banking system, and that that system only creates the principal, but not the interest, and finally that interest is an exponential function that increases to the point that the interest due on all the money loaned to us inevitably becomes larger than the GDP of the nation....

The exponential growth REQUIRED to keep payments of interest coming to the financiers and bankers is impossible. Eventually the numbers become so large, and the burden on the public so great that we cannot bear it any longer, and the system collapses.

"Anyone who believes exponential growth can go on forever in a finite world is either a madman, or an economist." - Kenneth Boulding

...Considering all those facts, you realize that economic catastrophe is unavoidable, and NOT OUR FAULT.

Yet, the law will try to enforce debts, the rich will blame the poor, crime will become common and human suffering and misery will be the norm.

If there's any reason we deserve this, it's our ignorance about the workings of our monetary system, and/or our complacency.



[edit on 12-6-2010 by 30_seconds]