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Hit us where it hurts!

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posted on Jun, 10 2004 @ 10:33 AM
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If a terrorist wanted to cripple America on every level (economy, defense, human life) why wouldn't they find a way to destroy the internet here? I have no idea if it's even possible or not, but if it is then why hasn't it been done? It would be the blow that would put us back centuries. I know that it would also affect basically the rest of the world, but what do they care?




posted on Jun, 10 2004 @ 12:16 PM
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The government does take precautions against viruses and hackers. They are aware of the potential for terrorist attacks via the internet. It would be almost impossible to take down the entire internet due to its size and the very nature of it.

A more dangerous threat would be hackers using the net to attack financial and government servers. The important stuff isn't on the net anyway, well, just ATS.



posted on Jun, 10 2004 @ 12:20 PM
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Well, I'd have no problem if they could hack into the major credit card companies and destroy thier records.



posted on Jun, 10 2004 @ 12:40 PM
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You are correct, destruction of the internet would set the world back a very long time.

Physical destruction of the internet is almost impossible, because the internet is not simply 'stored' in one city, or even a hundred different cities. That is, there is no single place at which the internet exists. If you visit a website--Google.com, for instance--, the page is sent to you by Google's web servers in Mountain View, California. If a nuclear bomb was detonated in Mountain View, then you would be unable to visit Google. The internet consists of millions of websites, 'stored' in thousands of different cities.

It is much more likely, however, that the internet is destroyed virtually, by viruses. If an efficient virus was written that would compromise every system on which it was run, after propagating itself in the most efficient way possible, it could easily incapacitate a majority of 'the internet' in a matter of days.

El_Topo is right, nothing deemed extremely important available on the internet. No internet hacker would be able to access today's nuclear launch codes, for instance. Even though the codes could be controlled by computers, the computers never connect to the internet.




posted on Jun, 10 2004 @ 09:05 PM
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Originally posted by el_topo
The government does take precautions against viruses and hackers. .


They want a *good* precaution? Crack down on Hackers and these pigs that make the viruses!



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 08:00 AM
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i thought the internet was originally built by the us army in the 50's (i think)to act as a self rerouting communication network in case of nuclear war with the soviets.



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 08:02 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
Well, I'd have no problem if they could hack into the major credit card companies and destroy thier records.


lol I have no problem with that either. If they could just fry all the debt databases that would make my life so much easier.



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 10:13 AM
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Originally posted by bestax1
i thought the internet was originally built by the us army in the 50's (i think)to act as a self rerouting communication network in case of nuclear war with the soviets.


That's correct. The internet does have a few points of centralization, which opens it up for an attack: the TLD name servers, for example.

Even given a successful attack against one of the centralized points, however, the Internet should be able to absorb the disruption and return to working condition in a matter of days or weeks. It would be a serious disruption, both for communications and business, but it wouldn't be the much prophesied End-Of-The-Internet.



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 10:17 AM
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what if all of the "centralized points" where hit at once? Would the recovery be as quick and easy?



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 10:32 AM
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The biggest impact would be that you would have millions of socially stunted teens who usually play Everquest or play some First-Person Shooters online BORED, WITH ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO.

Now THAT is frightening. The consequences are too terrible to imagine.



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 11:50 AM
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The root name servers are considered a vulnerability -- this is why there are a bunch, all geographically spread out. Besides, I tend to agree with Jakomo -- the dependency on the internet is not widespread. Just because we're all here doesn't mean *everybody* is here.

The Virus stuff is totally overblown. They are primarily a Windoze problem, and no one runs Windoze at the level needed to "take down the internet." That's all Unix. Also, the internet is a distributed system with no single point of failure. This is the same idea deployed by Al Qaeda, which is why they are hard to catch!

Hitting us where it hurts would involve coming up with something to keep people from spending money. Consumer spending is the basis of our economy. A drop in the GDP would cause enormous harm, and without the consumer, that would happen. This suggests that "hitting us where it hurts" would involve frightening people away from malls with some kind of simultaneous attack. We are watching for big attacks in showcase locations -- a dirty bomb in Washington, for instance. What about all the small vulnerabilities? Are Americans, three years later, really keeping their eyes open for suspicious stuff? I'm not so sure.

It gives me the willies to even talk about this, frankly.



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 11:52 AM
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Originally posted by mpeake
what if all of the "centralized points" where hit at once? Would the recovery be as quick and easy?


First of all most the terrorist are terrorist because they are for the most part ignorant. Athough 911 shows there are a few more educated among them, taking down the internet is beyond their reach. You cannot blow up the internet. The internet was designed to withstand a major war, thus it's core servers are spread out over several locations. If the internet was blown out of operation - I'm afraid there wouldn't be anyone around looking to use it anyway. Although there was a time when all locations were public info, many have been moved and the locations are undisclosed for obvious reasons.

The denial-of-service attacks are probably about the closest anyone can come to taking down the internet. If somone was smart enough, maybe they could come up with another flaw in the system maybe some exploitation of the TCP/IP protocal. Problem for the terrorist is you can't learn much when you spend most your time worshipping your mythical god and cleaning your weapons. Unless some smart kid gets hit in the . and decides to convert into a loser and join them they will never take down the internet.

[edit on 11-6-2004 by outsider]



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 11:54 AM
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No one owns the internet, there are certain "watchers", and regulators to certain website (secure). It is the tree of knowlege and everyone has taken a bite. (apple logo)



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 12:39 PM
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[edit on 13-6-2004 by Mspc]



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 12:45 PM
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with so much connected to the internet, my initial thought was that if it were cut, or shut down, several other entities would be lost also, such as electricity. But, lets say that if it were cut for even a short period of time, aren't there severl things that would be affected during that short period of time that would be catastrophic? Like Aiport controls going out, or subway systems going out, or traffic lights going out...all forms of public transportation going into dissaray at the same time would lead to thousands of deaths...Would any of that be possible?



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 12:49 PM
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The internet is data information not controll of electricity or airports. There is no way one could shut down the internet unless they had some kinda of virus that when you first start your provider service up, that it would permantly erase all of your internet files and .exe programs. The internet will last forever untill their is no one online.



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 12:55 PM
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Originally posted by kaoscreator


lol I have no problem with that either. If they could just fry all the debt databases that would make my life so much easier.

Hmmmm, now if they hacked and erased all the files for trans union, experian and equafax would that make them terrorists or freedom fighters?



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 02:03 PM
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A team of 10 professional hackers can take control on every large ISP in the USA and several government networks including backup networks.

Nothing important on the internet? Well, maybe not directly but it is accessible deep down in government and corporate networks.

Being evil, 10 highly skilled people and you can take out the internet in it's full presence for a couple of weeks and destroy information systems vital for homeland security, management and troop support.

As a matter of fact terrorists, at least of eastern origin, know jack about the internet or even have 10% of the skills needed.
But what they could possibly do is bombing 2-3 Internet Exchanges. So in NYC, Vienna(USA) and Atlanta.
Doing it right won't render the internet useless but give heavy damage for a couple of weeks to the US economy.

There was a student from the USA, I think he was studying at Washington University - he wrote his final work and the plot was: Analysis of the US information networks(telephone & internet) and their vulnerability to terrorist attacks.
The work is classified!



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by mpeake
what if all of the "centralized points" where hit at once? Would the recovery be as quick and easy?


Obviously not, but it would still not be insurmountable. Your own PC at home has on it everything that's needed to reestablish an internet. The basic protocols are a part of all modern operating systems, and would not need to be reinvented. The ability to translate human-usable machine addresses (such as www.yahoo.com) into the numeric IP addresses exists on most machines too. At the very least there is a text file (hosts. or .hosts, depending on your OS) that will allow you to manually recreate the translation tables. This would be inconvenient, and above the .s of your average home PC user, but it is not impossible. The ability to communicate between the multiple private networks would still exist.

Now, this is not to say that after a hypothetical attack of this nature the Internet would be the same. At the very least the security holes exploited would be plugged and a plethora of new legislation would be enacted to "fix the grevious security risk posed by an unregulated Internet"



posted on Jun, 11 2004 @ 05:04 PM
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File replication and cross loading prevent a physical attack from taking out the internet. There is far too many resources spread over a HUGE geographical landscape that would make attacking the "internet" a waste of manpower and resources. Okay "some" people may be denied the ability to get on or see certain sites. And there would be some causualties of web sites that are not hosted on a data reduandant ISP. But for the most part it would be almost impossible to destory the entire "internet" to the point that order could not be restored within a matter of a day or two or simply a few hours.

The only way is to EMP the entire hemisphere or more. Causing the loss of all IC related circuit boards. Cars, phones, computers, microwaves, tv's, gas stations, cable tv, automatic doors, cash registers, atm's, banks, all current POS systems, credit card machines, GPS units, radar, traffic lights, power genertation, water (due to the computerized pumping stations reuired to maintain operating pressure). So if you were to knock at all that, I think we would have bigger problems then trying to access our favorite web site. Oh and since your PC and all the replacement motherboards, harddrives, cdrom drives, RAM modules etc would be defective, there would be no sense trying to rebuild one, as they would have to manufacture new boards starting from the bare silcon dies again. Oh by the way since the die forming equipment is CNC controlled it would need to be repaired as well. So the only hope would be that the boards and all the sensitive IC cards for the manufacturing equipment were stored somewhere safe from EMP affects.




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