Human animal hybridization, are the risks worth the possible gains?

reply to post by Raist


It was called Eugenics back then.
Link.

That they are further ahead then they tell would be nice in line with the speculative idea that technology as a whole is 15 to 30 years more advanced then we are told.

I think that anything that is allowed creates a new limit. This limit will eventually become the next step.

reply to post by Sinter Klaas


15-30 years? Wow, I was thinking only 10-15 years ahead. If they are truly that far ahead, we might have more in places of power using this stuff than I first thought. At the same time maybe they are not having complete success until more recent years. Maybe the “aliens” people see are really hybrids doing work so that they are not caught. I think some of the vaccines might contain something that can be passed on to the next generations. Things that might keep society in its place would be easy to inoculate into an unsuspecting public. Of course all of this is speculation, but we have had documents of the past reach us showing the government has strange plans that do not have our best interests in mind.

I touched lightly on eugenics some posts back. I am hoping to cover all the areas this technology can lead to. I laid the topics down in the OP and am sort of touching on each little by little . In the end, I could have a book worth of posts littered with information. Sadly, though due to my work hours I have to spend days doing research that could be done in a few hours. My posts will also not be as well organized as a book either. I might post some in one area one day only to post another area the next and come back around as my research takes me from one place to another. I am doing my best to not duplicate a link or article though in my postings, this only lengthens my research.

Raist

Hello Raist,

I was wondering if you could give your scholarly take on the development and widespread use of "recombinant" haemophilia medications derived from mammal protein such as BeneFIX, Helixate, Kogenate, Recombinate, ReFacto, Xyntha, and Advate. Approximately 50% of hemophiliacs depend upon these IV meds to prevent or repair internal bleeding episodes. The alternative is human derived clotting factors. However, (in the past) there were risks in using human albumin based clotting factor due to blood borne disease transmission (though modern filtration techniques have all but eliminated the risk) and there are also limited supplies of human clotting factor. Each injection of human based factor requires 500-1500 pints/units of donor blood to be processed. Some haemophiliacs depend upon an injection every 2 days.

Sri Oracle

reply to post by Sri Oracle


Hello and thanks for visiting, I sort of fell away from this thread (got very elsewhere in life and just did random posting at ATS) but I was in the middle of other research for it, it is not dead yet.

I am not familiar with that at this time. I will have to look into how exactly it is produced. From the sounds of what you describe I cannot say that I would be against it, though I might still worry about disease jumping from species to species. It sounds similar to the using mice to grow ears but some research will provide a better idea, I might be completely off on that guess.

I might not get back with you tonight on that but it will be within the first part of the week.

Raist

reply to post by Raist


No , it's an Abbomination in the Eyes of God .

reply to post by Zanti Misfit


In my faith, I completely agree with you. I fully understand that stance. Not everyone will understand that though and they will simply scoff at that idea. Trust me though I do get what you are saying.

I hope though to use less religious based facts and thoughts thought to get the points across simply because I know that just using my faith alone will not be an acceptable way to lay out reasons this is wrong.

Raist

reply to post by Raist


Technology , plied in the Right Hands , could turn this Planet into a Paradise . In the Wrong Hands , a Living Hell .................Who amoung us Controls those " Hands " ?

reply to post by Zanti Misfit


If man could ever make this world a paradise it would have already been so.

As for who controls the hands? In the human sense those with the money and the power of course. What does this mean for the rest of the world? Nothing good in my mind.

Man will do nothing to make this place a paradise, because we always seek to control and destroy those weaker than us. Sadly, I along with a majority of the planet are seen as the weaker, dispensable, and irrelevant bunch.

Raist

reply to post by Sri Oracle


From this source (I must admit that its reading seems almost legalistic in a way and I must sadly admit a bit confusing at first) it seems many of the recombinant drugs on the market do pose, even if slight, a risk of disease being spread.

Also from this source it seems as if this type has found a way to bypass human or animal proteins therefore completely removing such a risk altogether. This is the type of research and technology I can certainly stand behind, if that truly is the case.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Baxter Healthcare is developing a next-generation recombinant factor VIII for the treatment of haemophilia A that is produced using a totally protein-free manufacturing process. By excluding proteins or raw materials derived from human or animal sources in the final product, the risk of transmission of potentially infectious agents is removed.

I realize this is just an abstract, but it gets the point across fairly quickly. I would like to see the full article though.

From this source I take it that the recombinant drug is produced using mice or hamsters because of this quote.
www.advate.com...

You should not use ADVATE if you are allergic to mice or hamsters or any ingredients in ADVATE

www.drugs.com...
At this link they again tell you not to use if…

you are allergic to any ingredient in Antihemophilic Factor (Recombinant), including mouse, hamster, or bovine proteins

After some more reading from further links, I see finally how these recombinant proteins are made. I will admit that I was not really aware of this, I would surely have came across it eventually though. As much as I hate to use it as a source I did go to Wikipedia. It does seem to be an altering of DNA resulting in a chimeric DNA. As with any alteration like this there are risks involved.
en.wikipedia.org...

In the production of chimeric(from chimera) plasmids, the processes involved can be somewhat uncertain[1], as the intended outcome of the addition of foreign DNA may not always be achieved and may result in the formation of unusable plasmids.

(again please excuse the use of Wikipedia)

From my understanding the recombinant drugs used for this are similar to the vaccines and anti-venoms created with horses and chicken embryos (though I could be wrong). As an example of what I am talking about I pose this source and a quote from it.
rpi.edu...

Transformation
The first step in transformation is to select a piece of DNA to be inserted
into a vector. The second step is to cut that piece of DNA with a restriction
enzyme and then ligate the DNA insert into the vector with DNA Ligase. The insert contains a selectable
marker which allows for identification of recombinant molecules. An antibiotic
marker is often used so a host cell without a vector dies when exposed to a certain
antibiotic, and the host with the vector will live because it is resistant.

The vector is inserted into a host cell, in a process called transformation. One
example of a possible host cell is E. Coli. The host cells must be specially
prepared to take up the foreign DNA.

Selectable markers can be for antibiotic resistance, color changes, or any other
characteristic which can distinguish transformed hosts from untransformed hosts.
Different vectors have different properties to make them suitable to different
applications. Some properties can include symmetrical cloning sites, size, and
high copy number.

I could be wrong but this sounds very similar to that.

As I mentioned above there are risks involved of disease jumping from species to species either directly or through mutations. In the case of my feelings toward such a end through a means I admittedly am on the fence. I would prefer to see a less risky way like that are talking about in the first link (though again I must admit I am not fully aware of how they get to that point). Certainly finding a way to not intermingle species would be the best route to go.


While I sit on the fence with this I will say in this sort of case I lean more toward the technology part of it because the risks are low compared to more radical combing that has and could take place. You raised an interesting thought though with that question. I will have to check into it some more.

Raist

reply to post by Raist


"Man will do nothing to make this place a paradise, because we always seek to control and destroy those weaker than us. Sadly, I along with a majority of the planet are seen as the weaker, dispensable, and irrelevant bunch. "

Well , take Heart then . In Death , we Become Free from this Man Made Tyranny . See you on the Other Side when Our Times come Brother ! ..........

reply to post by Zanti Misfit


There are days when I welcome that time sooner than later.

When the time comes I will be looking for you.

Raist

reply to post by Zanti Misfit
I'm a newcomer but i read through all the posts. We already know that research (african bees) and exotic pets (not just Florida, the "big cats" of the U.K.) get loose, and breed, and disrupt ecosystems. So it's a sure bet that hybrids will eventually exist outside the lab. We already know that money talks, and wealthy individuals are not limited to the U.S.A. I bet that some where someone has already cloned themselves, and someone else has designer babies. Historically humans have not been able to limit the spread of technology -nearly any country could make an atomic bomb these days! I am frightened. Not only could the "100 year" world wide flu happen every few years, but any excuse to subjugate/use/throw away people has always been used. Remember, in South America earliest colonists rendered native humans for candle fat because they "didn't have souls". This is a very slippery slope. So,since the Pandoras' box is already open, do we have any choice besides vigilance in defence of "rights"?

reply to post by oldnnrbroke


Seriously ? They killed natives for that ? Freaking horrific !

I do agree that Pandora's box has already been opened. However...
There is another option. We could close the box. Remember.... There is always hope.When we lose hope, we lose everything.

First let me say I am sorry I have not added to this thread in some time. I get time to get on ATS but my research time has been hampered with things happening in daily life. I am hoping that soon I can get back to adding some information to this thread. I have found some recent articles thanks to posts on here and have a few saved back already. Keep an eye out though because more is to come as time permits.

reply to post by oldnnrbroke


I fully agree that Pandora’s box has been opened. The questions are though is it all the way open or just a slight amount and does that even matter at all.

I agree I believe there are cloned people somewhere in the world. Whether or not those clones live free or as slaves though is a guess that can only be made. I believe that the clones as also designer as well. So that there might be a slight difference only in “better” ways. For instance they could make a Steven Hawking that would never develop the problems the original did, or even a blond, blue eyed Hitler.


reply to post by Sinter Klaas



I am not sure the box can be closed or even if it can be that it would matter any longer. Once the effects are out there they cannot be reversed I am sure. I am not sure how much of the box has been opened up or even if that matters though.

Raist

reply to post by Raist


No really when the box is empty there is just one thing left. A tiny little spark of hope with the capability to spark a fire of hope beyond imagination.

I hope so I'm definitely sure.

reply to post by Sinter Klaas


My problem is that even a small pebble when tossed into a still pond creates multiple waves. Wave that always appear tiny at first but grow a bit larger as they spread. It is true that one small pebble tossed into a pond does not create a large amount of disturbance however if many pebbles and a few boulders are tossed in the disturbance becomes greater.

I fear that we as humans are tossing more than just one small pebble into a pond when it comes to such genetic experimentation.

Things will forever be changed and the results of that could be very devastating to mankind as we know it.

Raist

reply to post by Raist


Now consider that pebble is hope

Makes it all a little brighter doesn't it

reply to post by Sinter Klaas




Sorry, the pessimist in me has trouble with viewing it any other way.

My hurtle is mankind, I know in the spiritual realm anything is possible. However, the overall heart of mankind is darkened with greed, envy, and hatred.

Raist