The Dishonesty & Danger Inherent In The seeingUFOsPA Hoax

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posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 09:55 PM
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reply to post by sandwiches
 


no offense sandwich but that's what this topic is pretty much about.... i'm just trying to clarify what i saw as well.....

i did see something

what it was.... i dont know...

like i mentioned before.... i wanted a certain person's opinion but i havent recieved an answer....




posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 10:04 PM
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reply to post by C-Reilly

Yep, perhaps I jumped the gun condemning the thread. It just doesn't feel like the spirit of ATS to have a thread with the sole intent of trashing someone without raising a debate at all... I mean, wtf?? Pretty low quality if you ask me.

I realize now this is in fact an excellent opportunity to talk about what I am not allowed to in my own threads. (posts analyzing seeingUFOsPA generally aren't allowed and are moved to the hoax bin - staff/owner decision)

I wasn't being sarcastic about hearing about your experience... it was cool to read.
If you're in PA you should go hook up with Alison, see it for yourself and let us know!



posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 10:05 PM
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reply to post by C-Reilly

like i mentioned before.... i wanted a certain person's opinion but i havent recieved an answer....

 


Please start a new thread for your personal story. The topic of this thread is: The Dishonesty & Danger Inherent In The seeingUFOsPA Hoax



posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 10:07 PM
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reply to post by sandwiches
 


well then thank you for your input sandwich....

i wish i could actually do that just to see if she is bull**** or not.... but the fact is.... i'm broke hahaha

couldnt travel if i wanted...

however like i said.... since i'm not well versed on her events..... which i will soon look up.... i dont want to jump the gun in either way.....

thank you


EDIT FOR MOD APOLOGY

i'm sorry i just thought that my story applied here because i am also in pennsylvania and saw an "arc" ufo.....


again... my sincere apologies

[edit on 4-6-2010 by C-Reilly]



posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 10:08 PM
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Originally posted by C-Reilly
reply to post by sandwiches
 


like i mentioned before.... i wanted a certain person's opinion but i havent recieved an answer....


C-Reilly.....

Sorry.....

I've been a little busy.

I assure you I NEVER treat posts such as yours flippantly.

If you can give me a little while, I will get back to it.....I didn't want to review your post until I could do so in detail & without distraction.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not



posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 10:10 PM
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reply to post by Maybe...maybe not
 


I appreciate that maybe.... maybe not.... however i got cut out by a mod and if you would like to discuss it further i will create a new thread.... i just wanted your opinion because like i said i see that you seem to have good opinions and are well versed...... your apology is uneccesary and i appreciate your time.... the only problem is.... i cant find anything on my experience....



posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 10:58 PM
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reply to post by KIZZZY
 


KIZZZY.....

Thanks again for putting together that terrific video!!


Just thinking....... (yeah I know, be careful in case I hurt myself)


Some of that technical info in the 1st 1/2 of your video was a little difficult to read.

Is there any chance you could post that on here?

If you would like me to assist you with any of that, please send me a U2U & I will be very pleased to oblige!

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not



posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 11:15 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 11:46 PM
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reply to post by sandwiches
 


Sandwich…..



All I see in this thread is a personal attack on Alison.


Once again your obfuscation is disingenuous.

You do see an attack on Kruse & this attack is based on Kruse’s dishonest & dangerous hoaxing.

That Kruse is not a good & decent person is self evident subsequent to the above.



As you can see in my Profile, Maybe claims seeingUFOsPA can be explained as flashlights in the bushes.


Once again your statements are completely at variance with the facts.

To exacerbate that, you KNOW your statements are at variance with the facts.



Personally, I am not in agreement, and I would be interested in talking further about this footage with anyone who can remain objective and respectful.


Please reflect on the attack you made on me that subsequently had to be removed by the mods.

Please consider if that was ”objective and respectful”.

Please reflect on the fact that I did not address any comments to you, prior to your attack.



When have you -ever- seen a plane or helicopter use a pulsing laser light?

That has been explained to me by a technical expert. I will clarify the explanation & subsequently post same.

Here is the video to which you have linked, inserted for convenient viewing of the ATS Team.





How does one explain the rapid changing of shape and light of this craft?


Good grief, Sandwich…..that’s just beyond appalling. This simply reconfirms my statements in my opening post:

It is not possible for an intelligent, rational person to keep supporting Kruse.

Here is the video to which you have linked, inserted for convenient viewing of the ATS Team.





I'd love to get to the bottom of this.


No you wouldn’t…..that is self evident from your obsessive & irrational support of Kruse, regardless of the definitive material that is presented to you.

I think there is more to your support than is immediately apparent. I am looking into that as of writing.



It remains a mystery to me.


That is another disingenuous statement. You willfully disregard all definitive material presented to you that unequivocally demonstrates that Kruse is a dishonest & dangerous hoaxer.



Yep, perhaps I jumped the gun condemning the thread.

You have only been registered as sandwich for 3 weeks. However in that time…..

You have clearly demonstrated it is your habit to ”jump the gun” about many points of discussion & information & data contained therein.

You have also clearly demonstrated your habit of ”condemning” any person who does not agree with you. You do this by various means including putting people on ignore, ignoring points of discussion, ignoring errors in your material, etc…



It just doesn't feel like the spirit of ATS to have a thread with the sole intent of trashing someone without raising a debate at all...


Notwithstanding your aforementioned habit of ”trashing” members of ATS with whom you disagree, I point out your illogical assertion this is not a debate, when you make that assertion in the MIDDLE of a debate! :shk:



I mean, wtf??


That is unpleasant, unhelpful & against the ATS T&C’s.



Pretty low quality if you ask me.


Please clarify your comment. To which content do you refer as ”pretty low quality”?



I realize now this is in fact an excellent opportunity to talk about what I am not allowed to in my own threads.


Sandwich…..you are contradicting yourself.

On the one hand you have stated this is not a debate.

On the other hand, you have now stated ”this is in fact an excellent opportunity to talk about” this topic. :shk:



I realize now this is in fact an excellent opportunity to talk about what I am not allowed to in my own threads.


That is another intentional misrepresentation of the facts.

You have NEVER been prevented from discussing Kruse.

What you HAVE been prevented from doing is promoting Kruse’s dishonest & dangerous hoaxing as something which it is not.....i.e. real.

Regards
Maybe…maybe not



[edit on 4-6-2010 by Maybe...maybe not]



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 01:32 AM
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reply to post by Maybe...maybe not
 


The information is in your hands and you have my leave to do with it whatever you are desirous of doing with it!




posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 01:58 AM
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ATS Team:

With reference to my previous post:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I am advised of the following regarding the “Kruse UFO laser video”:

1. The ”laser beam” is another sensor overload as per the video posted as per KIZZZY.

2. The ”haze” is further sensor overload that is being caused by the NV equipment being used in moonlight that is too bright for this purpose.

Here is the Kruse video & a still shot pertaining to the above:





Kind regards
Maybe…maybe not




[edit on 5-6-2010 by Maybe...maybe not]



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 03:11 AM
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Originally posted by sandwiches
All I see in this thread is a personal attack on Alison. As you can see in my Profile, Maybe claims seeingUFOsPA can be explained as flashlights in the bushes. Personally, I am not in agreement, and I would be interested in talking further about this footage with anyone who can remain objective and respectful.

When have you -ever- seen a plane or helicopter use a pulsing laser light?

How does one explain the rapid changing of shape and light of this craft?

I'd love to get to the bottom of this. It remains a mystery to me.



Nobody is attacking her on a personal level, they are discussing the data i can certainly detail how this woman is not playing with a full deck.

and i shall



Good thread YES KIZZY did an excellent job , as well as a plethora of others like Z.

Sandwiches seems to have the same lingo as the Alison Kruse nutters this is ironic , they have the same agenda it seems. Do you consider yourself a (true observer) and open to the prospect of a hoax? It certainly does not sound like it you seem to have decided it is ET. With that said That being anyone who proves them wrong is a "hater" and i noticed sandwiches and sigstarhouse are re-posting the same moot comments in the hoax section? Oh i covered that rebut. And no im not hating im just being realistic.

I think i said all there is to be said here in the hoax section
www.abovetopsecret.com...

my channel
www.youtube.com.../u

I covered alisons laser pointing incidents in this video
www.youtube.com...

she claimed it is "OK to do this" lol ummm no it is not. She has no regard for the safety and lives of other human beings.

And most recent a local resident of Alison films what she has been filming and debunks her
www.youtube.com...


This woman has lied in emails to me and i can go in to that further. She attacked me on personal levels harassing my relatives by phone after i gave her my name and credentials. I have it recorded on an answering machine. She told me she was a UFO guru before the "murraysville invasion" a "pre cursor" to her fantasy and invested thousands of dollars in to this hoax buying high end night cameras and hardware. She is a belligerent woman with delusions of grandeur that has severe mental issues and it does not take a shrink to see it. She has marketed this hoax to any UFO media outlet you can imagine. Unfortunately there are still some out there ignorant enough to look past logic and reason provided by debunkers and UFO researchers. She even attacked MUFON after they told her what she was really seeing saying they were CIA controlled blah blah blah. IT is people like her that make have made be bitter as a researcher of almost 20 years. IT is insulting to someone like myself who has seen REAL ufo's. You can read my story in the hoax section in the link provided. Again i am really finding todays UFO people disappointing in so many of these so called UFOligists and falsers i am ready to just let the leaves fall where they may. We will never get Disclosure or Forced disclosure at this rate the attention seekers derailing the data.


[edit on 5-6-2010 by Unknown Soldier]



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 04:01 AM
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Originally posted by sandwiches
Hey, I'm making a new YouTube video.

It's called "ATS: Rejecting neutral threads in favor of opinionated hate-mongering".

I'm also considering, "Alison Kruse the most hated woman on ATS"

Should be good for a chuckle or two.


I tell you what "TrutherD1".....Make a video that REFUTES my video! The

guys over at York University might get a kick out of it!

Make Videos that refutes "Z's" videos.

I was thinking you might make a video on instructions "How to be a harpy"

hmmm? Sound good to you?


I have often said this to many people, "Put up or shut up!" How's that for a

bottom line? Do you think I am wrong in asking people to PROVE IT?

You aren't neutral. Alison thanks you for all your help. So cut the bulldinky!










[edit on 5-6-2010 by KIZZZY]



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 08:26 AM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 10:45 AM
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reply to post by sandwiches
 


I have a novel idea for you sandwiches. If the content of this thread upsets you so much. How about NOT participating in it! It appears the only thing you have to offer is whining and general trolling.

I'm actually starting to wonder if you're Kruse because you appear to take the questioning of her character and motive so personally.

Me thinks thou dost protest too much!


IRM


[edit on 5/6/10 by InfaRedMan]



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 12:38 PM
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Greetings brothers and sisters. I hope that you all are enjoying this wonderful day.

Now onto the meats and potatoes of my rant.

As you all know I am no fan of Alison Kruse. Time and time again I have refuted her videos and have caught her in oh so many lies. Since November of last year I have debunked her on a continuous basis and instead of trying to refute my findings she has engaged in an agenda to bury the truth and hide my findings. Most of my videos have already fallen victim to her red flagging antics. Thankfully, YoutTube has slowed down the process of red flagging and now my recent videos have been allowed to blossom and reach the masses. She has labeled me her nemesis and for good reason. I am the exposer of her crap and she knows this and thusly has made me enemy number one. I represent a threat to her investment. Basically she is trying to make money off of her Hoax and therefore has made it her mission to have me removed from YouTube. Thankfully I am not alone and the "Z" movement has grown. You see, people have grown tired of her arrogant bullshiit and now they too have decided to refute her. The tide is turning and the people of Youtube are now questioning her videos. This is evident by looking at the comments on her videos. Most comments are erased if they do not fall in line with her general belief system. What results is that her videos look like they have no comments when in fact Alison has erased the bulk of comments that she finds negative and distasteful....LOL

I would like to give a special thanks to Appalachianhero for his wonderful work. He represents one of our greatest allies because we finally have an inside man who can film exactly what is going on over the skies of Murrysville, Pa. This sudden development has rocked teh very foundation of Alison's belief system and as a result she has basically stopped posting videos. Let us hope that she is gone away but I suspect that she has not. She is just too stupid to do so.

Funny how Alison has remained mum regarding Appalachianhero's recent video or has she? Recently the poor guy has been attacked on his channel by new posters to the Youtube community. Hmm, could this be Alison under another guise....YOU'RE DAMN RIGHT!


All I can say is .....never take anyone's evidence at face value...always do some research and keep and open mind. There are 3 sides to every story...Her side...My side ...and the truth. Do not be a sheep and explore all sides and come to your own conclusions.

Have a wonderful day, people!......Oh and always remember......"Z" lives!



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 01:08 PM
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Originally posted by Maybe...maybe not
reply to post by harleyd20
 


Maybe...maybe not, thank you for the work you did constructing this post. I hope in the future that any pro-Allison Krause threads created are closed and re-directed to this thread. You should be very proud of yourself; with one simple post, you have contributed more to Ufology than Ms. Allison, Stephen Greer and Jose Escamilla ever have. Congrats.

Harleyd20.....


Originally posted by Maybe...maybe not
I did not ”discount automatically” Moulton Howe & the MUFON investigator.

I stated the following well known facts...


Last year I had an email exchange with Ms. Howe that allowed me to see what kind of researcher and what kind of human being she is. I sent her an email pointing out that a photo she claimed was of an alien was actually from the Weekly World News. She responded to me that it was only put in the Weekly World News as disinformation and that I was spreading disinformation by referencing the tabloid the source.



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 01:31 PM
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Originally posted by sandwiches
If you're in PA you should go hook up with Alison, see it for yourself and let us know!


Have you been to PA and met with Ms. Allison?

If simply watching the videos is good enough for you, or Ms. Allison's supporters, to proclaim them as genuine shape-shifting UFOs, then it holds you can also debunk them by watching the videos.



Originally posted by sandwiches
Hey, I'm making a new YouTube video.

It's called "ATS: Rejecting neutral threads in favor of opinionated hate-mongering".

I'm also considering, "Alison Kruse the most hated woman on ATS"

Should be good for a chuckle or two.


Yes, those red-herring ad hominem appeals-to-spite should be quite funny. It will be a display of insecurity, demonstrating the paucity of substance and completely asininity of your claims.

As with Ms. Allison and her supporters, you know you have neither the facts nor a cogent argument to support your beliefs. Otherwise, you would be producing video to support your case. Instead you resort to Bulverism, not telling us why Ms. Allison's critics are wrong but telling us why you think they are bad people. It will sway no one, only making you and her other supports feel better about their ridiculous beliefs.



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 04:14 PM
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reply to post by C-Reilly
 


C-Reilly…..

Regarding your report as posted here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Regarding greeneyedleo’s request that your report should be discussed in another thread as posted here (which prevents me from discussing it here):

www.abovetopsecret.com...

I think that’s not a bad idea


If you do start a thread about that, we could look at the idea that it could have been a meteorite that with a short tail that transited the sky very quickly. I’m not saying it was that, but it’s the only thing I can think of that could somewhat be a fit with your observations. You never know…..we might find some other reports about your sighting. If you start the thread, please U2U me & let me know.

Kind regards
Maybe…maybe not



posted on Jun, 5 2010 @ 04:20 PM
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Originally posted by InfaRedMan
reply to post by sandwiches
 


I have a novel idea for you sandwiches. If the content of this thread upsets you so much. How about NOT participating in it! It appears the only thing you have to offer is whining and general trolling.

I'm actually starting to wonder if you're Kruse because you appear to take the questioning of her character and motive so personally.

Me thinks thou dost protest too much!

IRM



InfaRedMan.....

As I said before, we have been looking into the background of sandwich.

I'll soon post some more info about sandwich & his public support of Kruse.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not





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