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California's Corrupt Unions Move to Outlaw Public Bankruptcies

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posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 09:09 AM

California's Corrupt Unions Move to Outlaw Public Bankruptcies

Bankruptcy does not cause long-term devastation. Forever increasing taxes to support union parasites does.

Given that one cannot negotiate with parasites, mosquitoes, termites or other pestilence, the only reasonable solution is to exterminate them. Public unions need to be made illegal, and every service imaginable immediately outsourced to non-union shops.

I couldn’t agree more.
(visit the link for the full news article)

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 09:09 AM
The source article also says that unions are ruining every town, county, and state in the union. The bill in question is suppose to move to protect pensions a health benefits for the workers.
It is blatantly clear that the person who wrote the article hates unions. As to weather the bill will or will not do what it is intended to do I will leave open for your opinions.
(visit the link for the full news article)

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 09:27 AM
I don't get all the union bashing.

As for the meat of the bill. I don't think they will get it through. There are too many cities in dire straits. They won't have options if they cannot declare bankruptcy.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 09:44 AM

Originally posted by antonia
I don't get all the union bashing.

Hell, all of my old timer family members say America failed when Unions got too powerful. It's one thing to join a group to help you keep your benefits. It's another thing to join a group who uses your payments to lobby the congressmen into doing whatever they see fit. At some point, which happens to be now, the unions run out of money then go back asking for a handout from the people they deemed the bad guys. And the rest of us are left shaking our head in disgust.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 09:45 AM
reply to post by newBodyoldSoul

Be that as it may the news was about Bankruptcy laws. Why all the union bashing in a news article?

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 09:55 AM
reply to post by antonia

According to the source article it was the unions who were pushing the law through to protect pensions, and benefits.
It was the person who wrote it that was doing all the union bashing.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 11:31 AM

Originally posted by RedGolem
The source article also says that unions are ruining every town, county, and state in the union. The bill in question is suppose to move to protect pensions a health benefits for the workers.

The concept of a union is a good one to protect the little guy from abuse by rich greedy corporations. If the company is making money hand over fist but only paying workers minimum wage, then why shouldn't the workers expect more compensation for the profits they are helping to create? So I don't bash all unions or say that's a bad thing.

When it becomes a bad thing, is that when the company isn't doing so well, like barely breaking even or even losing money, the unions aren't willing to negotiate accordingly. They still expect to be paid the same thing as when the company was making tons of profits.

Unions and companies or governments could work in partnership, negotiating to help share the corporate profits with employees more equitably, but it often doesn't happen that way. In some cases, the powerful unions are part of the reason the company or government is starting to have financial performance problems, with too-generous pension benefits, etc. I think that was part of the reason for the problems at GM, and is part of the reason for some of the financial problems at some cities in California, though certainly not the only reason.

So I don't say that Unions are inherently bad. It's the distortion and abuse of union power that occurs in some cases that's bad. The unions need to negotiate in a manner that accounts for the financial viability of the companies or governments that employ them, so if there's evil about unions, it would be when they forget that part of their responsibility.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 11:42 AM
The "concept" behind Union bashing is to destroy them.
While Unions certainly have the faults and drawbacks, they are the ONLY reason you don't make 2 dollars an hour and have to buy from the company store. Part of the "free market" unregulated capitalism BS is no unions. That means cheap labor. nothing more or less. Repubs don't like minimum wage, they say let the market decide. We tried that, didn't do so well for the workers did it?
Since the Reagan era there has been a concerted effort ( propaganda ) aimed at destroying Unions, many of you have fallen hook, line and sinker.
, during this same time span, the middle class has shrunk, jobs have been outsourced, and the rich have gotten a LOT richer while your real income has shrunk! Gee, what do ya know?
Put 2 and 2 together kids!

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 11:49 AM
Well this law should really provide an incentive for businesses to come to California ??? Or should I say create a mass exodus for the ones already there. Talk about trying to drive a stake in to the barely beating heart of California’s economy.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 11:52 AM
I have been in the union, and just as there is always two sides of every thing, the bylaws of the unions are good. There are good people and also phony one's in there too. However, there are unions that they don't call it union. They go by the name of cartel, such as Health Cartel or Clubs like Bilderberg, the club of elites. You know what I mean. As long they are doing things that doesn't effect the lives of others, then in my view it is OK. But if they are doing things that is effecting others then we must stand up to it and fight it. Can you fight the bankers alone or for that matter can a worker fight the in justice with the employer. You might say well take it to court. I have seen it . It is more effective through union then taking the matter to court. Unity is strength regardless which way you cut it. Please don't misunderstand me. I worked for over 40 years and my employers got away with my benefits because with the help of the Government they could (right or wrong) file for bankruptcy. Take for example GM made 56 trillion profits in china in 2009 but they could file for bankruptcy in the USA. Is this right. They can play the game with Salary retirees but not with UAW. If you still want to bash the Union. Tough luck.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 11:54 AM
Unions have become legalized extortion. Plain and simple. Take it from somebody who has been shot at and had his car firebombed by union members. As long as Obama is president, things are only going to get worse. My reason for saying this is that Obama is so firmly in the union's hip pocket, that if they fart, he gasps for air.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 12:16 PM
So pick your poison.
The second that corporate America can do away with Unions they will lower your wage and you get no insurance, no vacations, nothing. And the "free market" will say, don't like it get a different job. But, wages will drop across the board while profits go up, with MOST profit going to the biggest ( richest ) shareholders.
But hey, the "conservatives" have been quite good at convincing people to screw themselves over for years!

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 12:33 PM
reply to post by charlie0

They couldn't have made 56 trillion profit. The gross world product is only 43 trillion dollars.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 03:34 PM
I wonder what will happen when they simply squeeze the lemon dry and there is no more juice?

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 03:57 PM
Couple pf points here:

- Cities, Counties, and States are NOT Businesses. They do not operate on a "for-profit" basis. Nor should they.

Think about it for a moment. Where do government entities get their "operating capital"? From you! in the form of taxes. Their profit would be your tax dollars comming out of your pocket.

Bankruptcy is a way of protecting businesses and individuals from economic ruin, essentially by shifting the burden of their financial losses to their creditors, the people they owe money to.

If municiple entities are allowed to more easily declare bankruptcy, more of their creditors will be forced to bear their burdens.

That's US!. Because it's Our tax money that they've lost!

Second point.

- When a union negotiates a contract with a public entity, Both parties have the right to expect that the other party will Live Up to Its Contractural Obligation.

That is the very basis of contract any form.

Anything you do that ultimately weakens the principles of contract law weakens the very protections we, as a society, have come to depend upon.

At its heart, Civilization, is itself, a contract...a Social Contract.

And Sauce for the Goose is Sauce for the Gander.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 04:29 PM
What people need to grasp is that corporations are not inherently corrupt. Neither are governments, unions, etc.

The issue is one of pride and chaos.
Without structure, because of weakness in people, chaos grows.
However, when some grow strong, and do not encourage the weak to become strong as well, pride grows.

It is a silly notion for people to think that things such as this can be regulated out. It is a silly notion for people to think that any form of government is able to escape such a cycle.

These cycles of pride and chaos are the cycles of anti-christ. They are the cycles of empire.
Empire/Anti-christ/evil, comes in many forms and wears many disguises. The only solution/temperance in this world for such a thing is self-governance. As Christ advocated; Honor the Creator, and honor your neighbors as you would yourself if you were in their situation. There are no "technical" laws of God. When there were, they were used to teach mankind how to grow the hell up.

We are far too old a creature to still be rolling around in our own crap, lying to ourselves by calling it clean and yet thinking we are big boys.

Self-governance is incredibly important. If a structure of people does not support the growth of the weak and the perpetuity of all that is good/life, then it is pride. If a people are structureless in human progress, then it is chaos. Simple. Stop bitching. Grow up. Progress.

The whole point of the United States was to adhere to these general principles. They have been defiled by the prideful and chaotic. They have been since very early on. This leads me to believe that most people are little better than animals. Sheep to be exact. And many others are also little better than animals. Wolves to be exact.

Strive to be a gracious judge, a good shepherd, a godly animal. One who imitates the order which is charitably given to us all. One who imitates the charity which orders us all.

Life and life expressed.

[edit on 6/4/2010 by Dasher]

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 05:36 PM
reply to post by Dasher

thanks for your well spoken post.
I just however tend to think that the people who run the corporations are inherently corrupt. Look at what has happened to the banking industry. And now there is a more to put an exchange tax on the G20 nations just to fund the corrupt world bank. Its not to hard to think the people in those positions are corrupt.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 05:52 PM
Get off the unions good, unions bad crap. You are missing the bigger picture here.
Like usual every one is missing the whole point of the article, and that is that California wants to make it more difficult for businesses to file for bankruptcy. Bankruptcy is not always a bad thing. It can give a struggling business a chance to restructure its debt and obligations in order to stay in business rather than close it’s doors.
Keeping the doors open is usually better for the employee rather than being out of work.
If the bankruptcy laws in a particular state make doing business there to risky they will go some where else and take the jobs with them.
As far as I can tell California needs to be attracting new businesses to come into there state rather than deter them from doing so.

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 06:54 PM
I don't live in the US but as a government pee-on, my first question for the business is, if they go bankrupt, do I lose all that money that has been taken off my paycheck and put towards my own pension fund that the business administers?

That's 20 years at 300.00 a month that I put towards my own superannuation (pension). Would I lose that?

If yes.. then I as a union member would have a VERY big problem with that.. and I suspect that everyone else would..

posted on Jun, 4 2010 @ 07:21 PM
reply to post by RedGolem

I hear you for sure, but consider the ramifications of running such a position of power yourself. Could you avoid harming some with your decisions? Inherently, effecting the lives of those you do not know with the stroke of a pen in your hand is not a healthy position to hold. Even the best human will cause destruction when controlling so much power.

If you cannot look into the eyes of your master and have their ear, then you are a slave to an unknown king. Any form of government can work well, if it was run with consideration and understanding. But it cannot be so if the positions of power are upon a tower. The tower always falls.

We should return to tribes (very small/local governments and businesses), but they should be globally united in thoughtful and gentle commerce, and defense. Otherwise, I have no preferred form of governing.

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