The Attack on the Terrorist Flotilla

reply to post by NoamC


Thanks for your response, it's appreciated. However I don't think many will believe much of what idf has to say on the matter.

Lets wait till the journalists on board are release and they can tell what really happened.

Whats the betting it doesn't tie up with mr idf ?

reply to post by NoamC


Hmmm, They looks completely right to me. The ship was in international waters, and what Israel did was an act of piracy, you know the same things that's happening off the coast of Somalia. I just got done watching an interview of an American that just got released from this event and the anchor treated this witness very badly but I feel she got her message of what really happened, even though the anchor went on to say CNN has not independently confirmed what happen.

Jeez you just had an AMERICAN tell you she was TERRORIZED and DETAINED and brought to ISRAEL from INTERNATIONAL WATERS this isn't right, and before I go I would like to say they could of water until the ship got to the block aid and then boarded in Territorial waters so don't buy their self defense claim because they boarded a ship illegally that's synonymous to a robber killing the victim during the crime because the victim decided to fight place. Please Deny Ignorance.

Edit* The American Flotilla members name is Huwaida Arraf, and was interviewed within the hour on The News Room which is a CNN program.

[edit on 1-6-2010 by spmc215]

Man I love Comcast DVR, also CNN is very arrogant to her, sad


[edit on 1-6-2010 by spmc215]

They're boarding a boat illegally in international waters while armed with weapons, and then they cry about being pushed by civillians? Pathetic...

It's like robbing a house, shooting the inhabitants when they resist and then complaining that they pushed you.

reply to post by airspoon


They are there most likely for the self defence purpose. You can't call them terrorists. They did not initiate the attack. You are blind.

Unless you are a jew yourself, I don't think you believe you are making sense yourself on this. You will say anything to justify your stance. False propaganda, trying to mitigate the Isralei crime.

Time to condemn arrogant, out of hand, rogue Israel.

ROGUE ISRAEL !!!

Iran would never do this kind of crime on the other hand.

Time to investigate Israeli nuclear stock pile of nuclear weapons. The WMD.

WMD is in Israel, nowhere else in the Middle East.

All these times, they have been searching wrong places.

Lets take a look at this, as a security issue as it was to the Israeli's.

This ship was intending to break the blockade. So the Israeli Government, knew ahead of time where this ship had said specifically they where going to break the law. Why not board it outside of their territorial waters before they have an opportunity to do something stupid. Sounds like a great tactical/security opportunity to me.

I would say any country who knew a ship was going to break the law would do the same.

reply to post by little_green_man


I drew the same thing from Israels claim of self defense in the event where they were the criminal in that the victim fights back and the criminal claims self defense this is so sad and sucks MSM here in the states are so far up Israels butt they cant see or report whats really going on. Glad to see more people see whats really going on.

Open Ya Eyes Fools!

Read The Allegory of the Cave by Plato if you think Israel was in the right.

Also Little_green_man sorry for the U2U to you, I started wanting to send this to you but then decide to post here so others may drawl upon. STAR!

So the consensus here is that the flotilla should have been escorted into the port and boarded peacefully at that point? Sounds like a great way to get a nuclear device into harbor for those individuals without the means to launch it. Do you think any other country would have acted differently after 5 of 6 complied with requests to inspect?

Let's imagine an Iranian tanker heading to NYC without a manifest. Do any of you really believe the US wouldn't have dropped commandos on it 100's of miles from the nearest landmass?

Maritime blockades are a legitimate and recognized measure under international law, and may be implemented as part of an armed conflict at sea [which presently exists between Israel and Hamas].
Under international maritime law, when a maritime blockade is in effect, no vessels can enter the blockaded area. That includes both civilian vessels and enemy vessels. Any vessel that violates or attempts to violate the maritime blockade may be captured or even attacked.

Various naval manuals, including the naval manuals of the US and UK, recognize the maritime blockade as an effective naval measure that can be implemented in times of armed conflict. And those manuals give various criteria for making a blockade valid, including the requirement to give due notice of the blockade. Israel, in accordance with the requirements of international law, has publicized the existence of the blockade currently in effect, and has published the exact coordinates of the blockade via the accepted international professional maritime channels.

Yaaaawwwnn.. Yet another failed attempt to justify cold-blooded murder.. No matter how you spin it murder is murder end of.

They had already shot and killed one person and injured many more before even boarding, then when a scared group of people who have just witnessed this then see these same soldiers boarding the vessel what the hell do you think they are going to do but defend themselves? As for weapons, there were no fire arms on board, turkey inspected the cargo.

reply to post by Doodie

A 150 KM block-aid off the coast of Gaza is a pretty big block-aid (sarcasm)..
.. In relation to the size of the country..

Im not an expert.. just an observer..

I've seen some wild comments in this thread...

I have heard that the Israelis shot out the engines of the other vessels, but did not do so to this one, as it was a large cruise ship, with lots of passengers. That is probably just a cover story to cover the fact that they wanted to do this no matter the cost...they probably had intelligence that some serious weaponry was on board.

The Israelis were not armed with assault rifles. They were armed with paintball guns, and pistols. I did not believe this at first, but in the very video in this thread you can see one of the commandos with such a gun, firing at those beating another downed commando. He seems to be firing at them in the face, to blind them. You can plainly see this at the 43 second mark.

After the occupants of the vessel would not stop, when fired upon by paintball guns, pistols were used. This is what caused the fatalities, not assault rifles or anything else.

If the boat was in international waters, then yeah, they should have waited. But, let's be honest here people. Most of the people on that boat were obviously extremely violent. What aid vessel has all of these metal poles lying around to use? Think about that...it was a cruise ship, which was being used as an aid vessel. Why were so many crude weapons available?

Honestly, the attack was poorly planned. Whoever was in command should be demoted at least, or kicked out of the military altogether. You never expect civilians to cower and run. You always give your enemy the full respect they deserve, and this commander did not. He had the tables turned on his soldiers, and the result is chaos.

Where are the flashbangs, smoke grenades, tasers, etc.? If I was sent in as a commando with a paintball gun as my main weapon, I would resign before ever boarding a helicopter.

Both sides are not innocent. Both sides did some very stupid things, and just shows how much they mistrust each other. And, sadly, the reasons are all too obvious in the video.

A major change needs to happen to resolve the violence from both sides. We cannot continue as we do on this planet, beating, maiming, murdering, and killing each other. And, I honestly don't know what could stop all the violence...but I am personally sick of it.

International Waters + Boarding = Piracy

Opening Fire before boarding = Terrorism

Gaza "Security Wall" = Ghettoization

Embargo = Collective Punishment

Flotilla Raid = Murder

reply to post by Peruvianmonk
[more
The Isrealis boarded the ship showing no Hostile intent these were special forces if they wished to show hostility,I am sure their training would leave no doubt .You are trying to convince the world that this ships crew where tree hugging ,Free love hippies come on this crew were armed ,positioned and probably trained for conflict that is what they desired and that is what they got. The soldiers fell into an instant riot and showed great restraint under the circumstances Automatic weapons at that range could have caused more fatalities than what was caused

Originally posted by Yog-Sothoth
I've seen some wild comments in this thread...

I have heard that the Israelis shot out the engines of the other vessels, but did not do so to this one, as it was a large cruise ship, with lots of passengers. That is probably just a cover story to cover the fact that they wanted to do this no matter the cost...they probably had intelligence that some serious weaponry was on board.

The Israelis were not armed with assault rifles. They were armed with paintball guns, and pistols. I did not believe this at first, but in the very video in this thread you can see one of the commandos with such a gun, firing at those beating another downed commando. He seems to be firing at them in the face, to blind them. You can plainly see this at the 43 second mark.

After the occupants of the vessel would not stop, when fired upon by paintball guns, pistols were used. This is what caused the fatalities, not assault rifles or anything else.

If the boat was in international waters, then yeah, they should have waited. But, let's be honest here people. Most of the people on that boat were obviously extremely violent. What aid vessel has all of these metal poles lying around to use? Think about that...it was a cruise ship, which was being used as an aid vessel. Why were so many crude weapons available?

Honestly, the attack was poorly planned. Whoever was in command should be demoted at least, or kicked out of the military altogether. You never expect civilians to cower and run. You always give your enemy the full respect they deserve, and this commander did not. He had the tables turned on his soldiers, and the result is chaos.

Where are the flashbangs, smoke grenades, tasers, etc.? If I was sent in as a commando with a paintball gun as my main weapon, I would resign before ever boarding a helicopter.

Both sides are not innocent. Both sides did some very stupid things, and just shows how much they mistrust each other. And, sadly, the reasons are all too obvious in the video.

A major change needs to happen to resolve the violence from both sides. We cannot continue as we do on this planet, beating, maiming, murdering, and killing each other. And, I honestly don't know what could stop all the violence...but I am personally sick of it.

Did you actually see the picture of the "weapons" or are you just a JIDF agent? Among 700 "terrorists", they found "knives and clubs(obviously raided the kitchen and broke off table legs), enough to barely cover a blanket.

[edit on 1-6-2010 by The Anti-Anti-Christ]

reply to post by john124


And it's these corrupt laws that allow ships with ACTUAL weapons to get passed around the world. I don't know much about trade or the ship routes, but I do know that someone could easily smuggle a nuke into a ship, use the law to prevent themselves from being searched, and bam ... delivery is an easy success. One more country with potential to destroy thousands if not millions. I know this isn't the case for now, but some people are so blindly sticking to THE LAW like it's so pure and mighty.

The law was made a certain way so that the bad people have a way with getting out of certain jams. If any of you deny this then I would find it extremely comical. In the US, there are clear examples of people committing murders, rapes, kidnapping ... etc that have nothing to show for it as far THE LAW goes.

[edit on 1-6-2010 by Simply J]

reply to post by benadrit


Piracy is what happens around Somalia, What happened here was a country trying to stop TERRORISTS importing arms and the materials of conflict into there country.Why dont you speak out about Hamas firing indiscriminate rockets into Israel killing INNOCENT civilians. But Israelis are not people to you are they!!

Originally posted by Magic Bullet
reply to post by benadrit

 

Piracy is what happens around Somalia, What happened here was a country trying to stop TERRORISTS importing arms and the materials of conflict into there country.Why dont you speak out about Hamas firing indiscriminate rockets into Israel killing INNOCENT civilians. But Israelis are not people to you are they!!

Yes because they found weapons and explosives on the floatilla right? OH WAIT LOL

Originally posted by notsoperfect
reply to post by airspoon

 

They are there most likely for the self defence purpose. You can't call them terrorists. They did not initiate the attack. You are blind.

Unless you are a jew yourself, I don't think you believe you are making sense yourself on this. You will say anything to justify your stance. False propaganda, trying to mitigate the Isralei crime.

Time to condemn arrogant, out of hand, rogue Israel.

ROGUE ISRAEL !!!

Iran would never do this kind of crime on the other hand.

Time to investigate Israeli nuclear stock pile of nuclear weapons. The WMD.

WMD is in Israel, nowhere else in the Middle East.

All these times, they have been searching wrong places.

First of all, I am Jewish but secondly and most important, you are not really making sense. My stance on this is that Israel was wrong. Never once have I suggested that the flotilla was full of terrorists nor have I ever suggested than anyone other than Israel initiated this attack. Get your replies in order! Oh and just a note, I'm not blind either though it looks like you certainly are. Again, get your replies in order and if you are going to throw insults, at least know what you are throwing them for.

--airspoon

Originally posted by TSawyer
What were the Khazar pirates ("IDF soldiers") doing on the flippant boat? Do you treat people who intrude your private properly with hospitality? I am going to ask my Jewish friend to rob your house. If you call the police me and him will you call you an anti-Semite and ask the police to arrest you for being a terrorist.

[edit on 31-5-2010 by TSawyer]

Let's say the situation is: you buy guns and store it in your house to attack me later. Some your friends deals the guns to you.

My actions: I inspect your friends. I don't care to whom the territory belongs where they stand. If they refuse to be inspected - I would use any means possible. Then I come to your house and beat the hell out of you and confiscate the guns.

Why? To protect myself. Inspection and preemptive strike if necessarily. And I don't care how sad you will cry to the world.