Reports: Israeli ships attack aid flotilla

They mean cement and other thing similarly absurdly designated contraband by Israel.

Originally posted by D.E.M.
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

Oh, I definitely agree with all of your points. We're walking a razors edge right most certainly.

Have you seen this new news:
Egypt opens border with Gaza

I wonder how this is going to effect the situation, given the already tense relationships between Israel and Egypt going back years.

Yes I mentioned that Egypt reopened one of the border crossings for humanitarian purposes a few pages back.

What is important is that Egypt is responding as much to internal pressure as it is trying to snub Israel here.

It's important to note, that population wise, the majority of Egyptians would prefer the border crossing open.

Propaganda wise though Israel and the Israeli Internet Defence Forces like to make a lot of hay against the Palestinians when the border is closed, and promoting the idea that the Egyptians do not like the Palestinians any more than the Israelis do.

Yet the truth is that the 42 year long Presidency of Mubarak is not a real reflection of the people of Egypts sentiments.

The border crossing was opened back up to keep the actual people of Egypt's sentiments in check.

So the fable of Egyptians not supporting Palestinians is dead for the propagandists now.

This is a major event in that Israel is not going to be able to easily keep enforcing it's illegal blockade of Gaza now.

International borders with Egypt are being open, the population of Egypt is already outraged and that outrage will only continue to grow with any kind of Israeli strike against that border.

The Flotilla has in fact succeeded in lifting the blockade!

Originally posted by DangerDeath

Originally posted by D.E.M.
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

Oh, I definitely agree with all of your points. We're walking a razors edge right most certainly.

Have you seen this new news:
Egypt opens border with Gaza

I wonder how this is going to effect the situation, given the already tense relationships between Israel and Egypt going back years.

They are trying to help Israel. They want to lure convoy to Egypt and reach Gaza from there, thus prevent another conflict at sea.

No they aren't they are trying to help themselves stay in power by not risking the popular will of the Egyptian people.

Israel could open borders itself to Gaza it doesn't need Egypt to open the smallest geographical area border as help.

This is a huge blow to Israel, the blockade has been lifted as a result of Egypt's actions not Israel's actions.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

This is a major event in that Israel is not going to be able to easily keep enforcing it's illegal blockade of Gaza now.

International borders with Egypt are being open, the population of Egypt is already outraged and that outrage will only continue to grow with any kind of Israeli strike against that border.

The Flotilla has in fact succeeded in lifting the blockade!

From that aspect, yes. On the other hand, flotilla may have wanted direct confrontation with Israel, given the possible Turkish agenda.

It will be a relief for Gazans for sure.

And Turkey has already lowered its voice during the UN session.

For Israel, this is a compromise solution which they didn't want.

Just wanted to add a small update from witnessGAZA.com.

1:14pm EST

Once soldiers were on the boat, they beated the passengers, a cloth sack was put over their heads and they were handcuffed

1:15pm EST

Once in ashdod, they were asked to sign some statement in hebrew, anne refused - like many others - and then was taken to be'ersheba

2:16pm EST

Current situation in prison very hot, people sharing cells. waiting what Israel does Anne still not willing to sign anything nor be deported

The "Anne" they are referring to is retired US Colonel Anne Wright.

I have to say that she has a serious set of brass on her. A credit to the honorable men and women of the US military.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

No they aren't they are trying to help themselves stay in power by not risking the popular will of the Egyptian people.

Obviously, Mubarak tried to avoid conflict with Israel, but seems to be more afraid of radical elements in Egypt and among Palestinians.

A status quo in Egypt seems to have reached its expiration.

I am not good at predicting, but professor Hawass will have to hurry up with removing artifacts from under the Spinx

Again they try to play by the book of the UN and come off worse.

Any suprise when countries take the law into their own hands.

TIME TO TAKE THE NUKES BACK

Originally posted by Bugman82
ALL video evidence to date shows zero evidence of Israel firing first and much video footage shows Israelis rapelling and instantly being attacked on the deck.

"earlier reports" don't hold weight in the face of video evidence. I'm sorry I have to point out the obvious in the face of the all too common propoganda push.

Hi

I have excellent eye sight, hearing and one hell of a fantastic monotor and what i saw and heard was they were shoting at civillains long before they borded the ship.

But hey if your eyes are getting old thats OK with me so long as you don't start seeing paitball guns and think the people now taken hostage are hanging around to enjoy the night life in iserail because that would be a more serious problom.

This is interesting:

As agreement remained elusive, Israel unilaterally disengaged from Gaza in 2005, saying it was no longer the occupying power there.

The UN, Human Rights Watch and many other international bodies and NGOs still consider Israel to be the occupying power of the Gaza Strip.[4][5][6] Israel disputes this.[6]

If israel disputes that it's the occupying power in Gaza, it has no authority to blockade either Gaza OR the aid-flotilla

And as is being said all over the web, israel had no authority to go anywhere near the flotilla, let alone murder the flotilla members and kidnap the survivors


No wonder Netanyahu was sweating fear as he tried to justify israel's insane actions to the world

WH spewmaster Gibbs is towing the line, utterly sickening.

An interview on CNN with one of the Americans who was on board the challenger. She has since been released, hence the interview.

Eyewitnesses recount Israeli raid on aid flotilla

Note that the witness states that Israel was told repeatedly that the ships were full of unarmed passengers...they were told this before they were even in visual range of the flotilla.

Combine these types of accounts(which will continue) with the live video feed of the passengers waving white flags, begging for the shooting to stop and Israel's version of events doesn't sound too accurate I would say.

... so long as you don't start seeing paitball guns ...

Hey bud... this is confirmed by Israel!

www.alertnet.org...

Some of the troops wielded paintball rifles -- non-lethal weapons designed to bruise, beat back and mark suspects for later arrest, but which apparently proved of limited use against activists who had the protection of life-jackets and gas masks.

To mark the ones to be arrested? Sure Paintball is a reaaaalllly good way... LOL. Come on...

Originally posted by Skellon
If you look at all the footage released thus far you will see that the accounts of what happened actually favour the IDF reports rather than the reports of what 'allegedly' happened from the counter perspective.

The IDF have stated what happened and the footage released by both the arabic media and the IDF confirm most of their claims.

The released footage does not show passengers murdered in their sleep, shots fired before the soldiers landed or a kill list. It shows a laminated leaflet/booklet with photos and text alongside in columns. It does not however show the source to be an activist or IDF soldier, it does not also show any mention of 'kill list'.

So again, I urge posters to examine the footage that has been released rather than comment based upon their own feelings towards either side.

If footage is later released via liveleak or wikileaks of the alleged murder of sleeping passengers then I will be the first to shout 'Atrocity'.

Lets deal with the facts for now eh?


[edit on 1-6-2010 by Skellon]

So if you break into my house i have to stand still and not break your face?
The ship was in international waters they had the right to protect themselves.
I would have done the same.

anyone else watching this press conference? Gibbs: "im not an international law expert"

Originally posted by TheCoffinman
anyone else watching this press conference? Gibbs: "im not an international law expert"

Is there a link?

I am amazed at the bravery of those who decided to fight off trained commandos with chairs and poles. I am even more amazed that the activists managed to throw one of the armed pirate/soldiers overboard.

www.guardian.co.uk...
Israel should lead investigation into attack on Gaza flotilla, says US

omg!! c'mon people.. this is blatant bs here.. why the hell if you want an honest truthful investigation done would u want it done by the same people who killed the 19 flotilla people????? thats like putting the bankers who f*cked up everything in charge of un-f*cking up eveyrthing..... this is BS

reply to post by xSeraphim


Skellon obviously hasn't been keeping abreast of international news at all

If he/she had, then he/she would be aware that internationally, news sources are openly stating that Israel's accounts of the massacre are under serious doubt

and even benefit of the doubt will be stripped from israel once the ILLEGALLY detained/kidnapped survivors of the massacre begin exposing the truth to international media -- despite that to try to continue concealing the truth from the world, isreal has stolen all the laptops, cameras, phones, etc.

reply to post by DangerDeath


its on cnn right now, happening as we speak

Originally posted by TheCoffinman
www.guardian.co.uk...
Israel should lead investigation into attack on Gaza flotilla, says US

omg!!

c'mon people.. this is blatant bs here.. why the hell if you want an honest truthful investigation done would u want it done by the same people who killed the 19 flotilla people????? thats like putting the bankers who f*cked up everything in charge of un-f*cking up eveyrthing..... this is BS

You are so correct.
The lunatics are in charge of the asylum.

reply to post by Dock9


Skellon has been on here since this morning - eagerly trying to push some twisted agenda.

Even when dozens of members who SAW the original footage and first started getting the eye witness events and despite the fact that even the MSM are doubting Israel's motives and tactics , He/she is still determined to stick up for Israel.

Wonder how much he/she is getting paid?