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God and Satan.. Who is the good guy?

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posted on May, 30 2010 @ 06:16 AM
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I've been speculating the differences between those 2..

So lets see
- God creates Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden
- God did not intend to create us (us being other than adam and eve), it was only because Eve sinned that they were cast out from the garden which led to kids and more kids. (gods plan?)
- God killed millions in the bible
- God punishes targets by punishing their kids, or punishes other people that is not the target. Punishes descendants.
- God apparently states that homosexuality is a sin against god next to murder. This is a bit beyond me, but I don't understand why he judges his creations in such a way.
- When God discovered they were building the Tower of Babel to reach the heavens, he came down and confused their languages and scattered the people throughout the earth. This ultimately led to racism and war.

So in summary here, god is to blame for war, poverty, discrimination, hatred, guilt, and maybe some other things.. He has divided us against each other and we are victims to his destruction.

SATAN
- Satan disagrees with god and tries to overthrow him in heaven (understandable considering the actions god has done on Earth)
- Snake / Satan convinces Eve to eat the fruit of knowledge. So, the snake wanted Eve to have knowledge, where god wanted them to stay dumb and blissful and stay in the safety of Earth, don't worry about knowledge, don't worry about the stars.
- Satan as far as I know only wants people to have knowledge. To question. He does not judge gay people, or the victims of this rotten society. (we're all victims, even murderers and rapists etc. There's a whole lot of back stories that led to those most unfortunate)
-(it's hard to gather info about Satan, but I feel we are only getting one side of the story - isn't that interesting?)

One last note. Religions seem to want to limit people to earth and keep their mind closed to existence. Satan encourages people to make the most of their wordly time - especially to enjoy pleasure and to live in the now. It was Satan's actions that helped mankind first taste knowledge, the greatest aspect that separates us from other animals.

(The more I see about the bible.. The more it seems like God is extraterrestrial / alien species)




posted on May, 30 2010 @ 06:41 AM
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Originally posted by nightrun
I've been speculating the differences between those 2..

So lets see
- God creates Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden
- God did not intend to create us (us being other than adam and eve), it was only because Eve sinned that they were cast out from the garden which led to kids and more kids. (gods plan?)
- God killed millions in the bible
- God punishes targets by punishing their kids, or punishes other people that is not the target. Punishes descendants.
- God apparently states that homosexuality is a sin against god next to murder. This is a bit beyond me, but I don't understand why he judges his creations in such a way.
- When God discovered they were building the Tower of Babel to reach the heavens, he came down and confused their languages and scattered the people throughout the earth. This ultimately led to racism and war.

So in summary here, god is to blame for war, poverty, discrimination, hatred, guilt, and maybe some other things.. He has divided us against each other and we are victims to his destruction.

SATAN
- Satan disagrees with god and tries to overthrow him in heaven (understandable considering the actions god has done on Earth)
- Snake / Satan convinces Eve to eat the fruit of knowledge. So, the snake wanted Eve to have knowledge, where god wanted them to stay dumb and blissful and stay in the safety of Earth, don't worry about knowledge, don't worry about the stars.
- Satan as far as I know only wants people to have knowledge. To question. He does not judge gay people, or the victims of this rotten society. (we're all victims, even murderers and rapists etc. There's a whole lot of back stories that led to those most unfortunate)
-(it's hard to gather info about Satan, but I feel we are only getting one side of the story - isn't that interesting?)

One last note. Religions seem to want to limit people to earth and keep their mind closed to existence. Satan encourages people to make the most of their wordly time - especially to enjoy pleasure and to live in the now. It was Satan's actions that helped mankind first taste knowledge, the greatest aspect that separates us from other animals.

(The more I see about the bible.. The more it seems like God is extraterrestrial / alien species)

Gods actions on earth ? What were those exactly ? What had he done to adam and eve that it was right for satan to tempt them ? Think about that. By the way who's to say adam and eve were dumb ? You ? Maybe if they had rejected satan. They would have had a higher knowledge.



posted on May, 30 2010 @ 06:48 AM
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Gods actions on earth ? What were those exactly ?

The actions written in the bible.


What had he done to adam and eve that it was right for satan to tempt them ? Think about that. By the way who's to say adam and eve were dumb ? You ? Maybe if they had rejected satan. They would have had a higher knowledge.


I did not say they were dumb



posted on May, 30 2010 @ 07:08 AM
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in my opinion god has the power-monopoly over peoples destinies. god has no compassion nor is fair. (e.g. 25000 under five year old children die everyday, without doing anything wrong). i am asking myself if switching this power-monopoly to another non-human entity (e.g. satan) would be wise or bring "better" results for us creatures.
i recommend to research "god" in a scientific way, maybe one day humans are able to defend themselfes from "acts of god", like earthquakes, plane crashs etc. the question is how does god work, what is god made of ? ectoplasm ? aether ?
or where is god ? in heaven ? in every living being and matter ? is god the energy that is running everything in the universe.
if you hurt yourself, like bumping with your head to something, while you get up out of a chair, some people say god did it. my persoal experience is, that humans move in a special way, for example walking down the streets, but god "decides" if you stumble over a road hole. but how ? influencing the length of steps you are taking ? by destracting your mind, immidiately before you reach the road hole ?
questions over questions, human kind should look for these powers and research them, maybe one day god is under control and wont harm anymore.



posted on May, 30 2010 @ 02:10 PM
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But you see the OP is contradictory to itself IMO>

" God and Satan who is the good guy "

Considering God created us not Satan and placed the ability to love in our hearts means ofcourse Gods the good one.

Even the concept of (good) is from God since he placed that emotion in our heart.

What Satan does is to try and trick souls by lying which is what he does best and causes multitudes without understanding to lose faith and rebel.



God = creator

Satan = created

which means common sense says, for Satan to be good yet the one who made him not good is ridiculous and impossible. Why would God make love in the first place.

goodness starts with God.


peace op!



[edit on 30-5-2010 by JesusisTruth]



posted on May, 30 2010 @ 05:21 PM
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Originally posted by JesusisTruth
But you see the OP is contradictory to itself IMO>

" God and Satan who is the good guy "

Considering God created us not Satan and placed the ability to love in our hearts means ofcourse Gods the good one.

Even the concept of (good) is from God since he placed that emotion in our heart.

What Satan does is to try and trick souls by lying which is what he does best and causes multitudes without understanding to lose faith and rebel.



God = creator

Satan = created

which means common sense says, for Satan to be good yet the one who made him not good is ridiculous and impossible. Why would God make love in the first place.

goodness starts with God.


peace op!


** CAUTION**

Razor sharp logic above, proceed with extreme caution.



posted on May, 30 2010 @ 05:23 PM
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My $.02


The OP is virtually all arbitrary opinions and straw man arguments, how could one possibly even make a honest attempt at providing counter-points with any degree of logic????

[edit on 30-5-2010 by NOTurTypical]



posted on May, 30 2010 @ 08:41 PM
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No notyourtypical.

It's not straw man arguments. It's his observations which stem from his lack of understanding which is as you should know a grace from God.

I'm trying to allow him to find understanding of what the meaning of God is.


But I appretiate your 2 cents.




posted on May, 30 2010 @ 11:39 PM
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Originally posted by JesusisTruth
No notyourtypical.

It's not straw man arguments. It's his observations which stem from his lack of understanding which is as you should know a grace from God.

I'm trying to allow him to find understanding of what the meaning of God is.


But I appretiate your 2 cents.

He's cherrypicking random ideas about what he thinks God is/has done.

Sorry man, but a person cannot create their own version of God and shoot down that version as illogical that they created to begin with.



posted on May, 31 2010 @ 12:18 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm picking the bad things out of the bible. Very few of them though. It's not about me or what I believe, it's a "hey guys god isn't exactly good" argument....



posted on May, 31 2010 @ 08:11 AM
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Originally posted by nightrun
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm picking the bad things out of the bible. Very few of them though. It's not about me or what I believe, it's a "hey guys god isn't exactly good" argument....
When you state: "I am picking the bad things out of the Bible.." that is EXACTLY what the term 'cherry-picking' means. You're selecting a sliver of the pie of the presented attributes of God that supports your illogical point and passing them off as the accurate totality of God's attributes. That's cherry-picking.

God is infinitely good man, this thread is BS. You speak of God's judgment side, but yet refuse to say ANYTHING about how ridiculously long God has patience for with man to repent and turn from wickedness. You say nothing about God's extreme mercy, or his forgiveness, or his infinite love.

It's cherrypicking and straw man arguments, both are logical fallacies. You're presenting a distorted view of the almighty and attacking this distorted view as if you attacked the accurate picture the Bible presents us of God. How can anyone who has read the entire Bible come away with anything other than God is supremely good and Lucifer is the father of everything evil and cursed???


[edit on 31-5-2010 by NOTurTypical]



posted on May, 31 2010 @ 01:10 PM
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Notyourtypical I think you confused his intentions. By reading the OP I see alot of lack of understanding. Not done out of his stance that God (is) the bad one.

he's searching for understanding. I was trying to supply it.

But again, I don't know what's in the OPs heart, so I could be wrong.

peace.



posted on May, 31 2010 @ 10:00 PM
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reply to post by JesusisTruth
 
I'm taking exception to what was stated for God in the OP, anyone who has read the scriptures many times will say that those arbitrary statements are extremely cherry-picked.



posted on Jun, 1 2010 @ 08:05 PM
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So lets see
- God creates Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden
- God did not intend to create us (us being other than adam and eve), it was only because Eve sinned that they were cast out from the garden which led to kids and more kids. (gods plan?)


You seem to be forgetting that God told them to be fruitful and multiply.



- God killed millions in the bible
- God punishes targets by punishing their kids, or punishes other people that is not the target. Punishes descendants.


He isn't alone here, so has Satan.



- God apparently states that homosexuality is a sin against god next to murder. This is a bit beyond me, but I don't understand why he judges his creations in such a way.


Biblically speaking, sex for a purpose other than procreation is a sin. So is sodomy (remember two cities, Sodom and Gamorah?)



- When God discovered they were building the Tower of Babel to reach the heavens, he came down and confused their languages and scattered the people throughout the earth. This ultimately led to racism and war.


An interesting observation, though one could argue Satan's role in either goading them on to build, or in the punishment.



- Satan disagrees with god and tries to overthrow him in heaven (understandable considering the actions god has done on Earth)


Had nothing to do with that. It was jealousy. His kind came first, so he didn't take to God's new "pet" project well.



- Snake / Satan convinces Eve to eat the fruit of knowledge. So, the snake wanted Eve to have knowledge, where god wanted them to stay dumb and blissful and stay in the safety of Earth, don't worry about knowledge, don't worry about the stars.


Agreed here. But, this is really more a product of organized religion, and a method for establishing women as second class citizens (original sin) than anything else (in my opinion)



- Satan as far as I know only wants people to have knowledge. To question. He does not judge gay people, or the victims of this rotten society. (we're all victims, even murderers and rapists etc. There's a whole lot of back stories that led to those most unfortunate)


He can't exactly afford to be picky. Satanism isn't even a minor world religion, by the numbers.



-(it's hard to gather info about Satan, but I feel we are only getting one side of the story - isn't that interesting?)


Not really, history is written by the winners. The Christians clearly have the numerical advantage here.



One last note. Religions seem to want to limit people to earth and keep their mind closed to existence. Satan encourages people to make the most of their wordly time - especially to enjoy pleasure and to live in the now. It was Satan's actions that helped mankind first taste knowledge, the greatest aspect that separates us from other animals.


WESTERN religions do. Most Eastern religions profess expanding one's mind.

Thing is, both Satan and God have committed evil acts...and that is because those acts are described by men (who themselves contain both good and evil). A pure good being is just as boring as a pure evil one, and makes for a lousy holy book.

Those with the idea of a kind and loving god should read the Old Testament sometimes...(I think poor Lot may have something to say about God's love...)
Still though, it doesn't mean you can't take the good lessons from any religion, and apply them to your life, and Christianity has many good lessons amongst the Bible's pages.



posted on Jun, 2 2010 @ 12:10 AM
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Genesis

[27] So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
[28] And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Your belief is flawed in the opening portion of God statement,

If you read the verse 28 you will notice be fruitful and multiply commandment.

This was commanded before the sin of Eve and Adam.

So it was not Gods plan to have man disobey him.

When they did they lost the Total dominion over the planet and we now share this with the father of all lies Satan



posted on Jun, 2 2010 @ 12:24 AM
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I always find it hilarious when people talk about the "Evil" that God does here on earth..



God deals in forever.. Our lives here are less than any amount of time we could ever imagine ...

Insignificant on a GRAND scale..

Look to eternity... What happens here is nothing in comparison..



posted on Jun, 2 2010 @ 12:26 AM
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reply to post by nightrun
 


SATAN
- Satan disagrees with god and tries to overthrow him in heaven (understandable considering the actions god has done on Earth)

Ezek 28:

[13] Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
[14] Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
[15] Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee

This verse speaks of Satan before he tried to take over the throne of God.

You see the great liar was jealous of the glory that God gets and deserves as he is the Creator.



posted on Jun, 2 2010 @ 12:48 AM
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reply to post by Gazrok
 


Thanks. Points taken from everyone, cheers.
Topic has been cured!!



posted on Jun, 2 2010 @ 02:24 AM
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Originally posted by darkangel831
I always find it hilarious when people talk about the "Evil" that God does here on earth..



God deals in forever.. Our lives here are less than any amount of time we could ever imagine ...

Insignificant on a GRAND scale..

Look to eternity... What happens here is nothing in comparison..

Or they say He's evil because He wipes out certain cites or nations, but those same people don't care or ignore that God also sent those people warning after warning after warning before finally judging them for their rebellion and wickedness. He sends His angels, He sends His Word, He sends Prophets warning of doom, then finally He says enough is enough and judges them.



posted on Jun, 2 2010 @ 01:29 PM
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It's impossible for God to be evil.

God can't murder. He made life and takes it away. Nobody complains of murder from the old man dying.

It's lack of understanding inside humans that rebel.

life is a gift, not something we deserve. he can take it at his pleasing.

But notyourtypical, points taken from your reply. You have a point.


peace.



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