I don't understand the need for revenge.

Think back to when you were a kid. If you did something wrong your parents/guardians would beat you with a belt. This instilled fear into you and you wouldn't repeat said act. Now imagine this, they just forgave you every time you did something wrong. You would never develop fear of being punished and would continue to act wrong. Being an adult is no different. There are rules to abide by. If you break a rule and are punished for it "properly", you (most likely) would not repeat it. If someone just forgave you every time, then you would repeat the process.

Originally posted by Donnie Darko
I don't understand the need for revenge.

and it shouldn't be a thing that is required. hope you never encounter that kind of rage, but if you want to know a little taste of it...

.... I mean, I think they should go punished and the person should be reformed to society, ...

-Donnie

society?

examples of revenge:

and what are the number of laws (societies' mandatory requirements) necessary in order for me to conform to what you would consider a good neighbor?

if i moved into the house next door to you, how many laws do i have to comply with in order to conform to your societys' expectations of what a good citizen should be?

if i were a "FREEDOM LOVING" American, how many laws would govern over my actions and behaviors??

there is what some level of revenge could look like, without nuking another country who has the same ideals, systems with endless laws, while the sheeple pay them more money to make more laws that no one can possibly live long enough to learn anyway??

maybe not a fair comparison by acts of war but...

lets sit a bunch of toddlers who are 2 to 3 months old, and make them play monopoly. let's slap them everytime they break a rule (instead of killing them in their homes overseas)

fair analogy, yes or no?

things we think about when "revenge" enters into one's agenda and priorities...

thanks for making me think,
ET

reply to post by Donnie Darko


Thats why we only have two cheeks to turn. when you run out of cheeks, you run out of options. sure, give peace a chance. i'm down with that.

the first offense may have been a mistake, an accident. easily forgiven. the second, repetition of the same offence, would be deliberate, spiteful, and worthy of reply.

and then there is: "fool me once, shame on you. fool me twice, shame on me."

in YOUR case it seems that your brother was being intolerant and cruel, as children are apt to be. were you being the same way toward him?

the things you said, were they your true thoughts? is it how you genuinely felt or feel? if so, then perhaps it was the only way for him to reciprocate the feeling. to make you hurt on the outside the way those words hurt him on the inside. is your relationship with him still the same?

from what i understand, Asperger's is a childhood disorder for most, and is more just a difference in cognitive processing.

there is a lot of ambiguity here. "revenge" calls for specifics.

ETA: quotation marks.


[edit on 20/6/2010 by gravykraken]

reply to post by Donnie Darko


All conflicts etc. are a perfect example what happens when revenge takes over.. (look at Middle East ffs). People just are so emotionally responsive. They react to everything so strongly. That, combined with no sense of humor is disastrous. This whole thing happens because people act on the emotional level, without the capability to view things objectively.

You can imagine it's hard to forgive someone who just raided your home and shot half of your family. They go out for revenge, and it won't stop until either (or both) sides are dead.

Yeah, it's part of the human nature. Think what people would be like if we wouldn't response to these stimuluses? In the end, we just need to rise above, as individuals. It's a pretty simple theory, if you think of it.

Imo revenge is a neccesity. don't get me wrong, I don't mean revenge as a tool to get your kicks.I mean revenge to administer justice. 99% of the time the courts give pathetic little sentences for serious crimes(you may not agree but if anyone touched my family two things could happen,I'd go to prison or I wouldn't get caught).Not that I'm a violent person, but the U.K court system is a joke when it comes to punishment.On a smaller scale revenge is also good,when I was about 9 or 10 I got bullied, teachers didn't help, my parents going in didn't help it carried on(I wasn't the only one).Finally my father told me to deal with it properly,and so I did.I fought back and I fought back sneaky and dirtyhell yeah I did it when his back was turned, I was only young and he'd made my life miserable! I tell you this, the bulling stopped, not just for me but for my friends as well, why? because they took the opportunity to fight back once he was down.revenge for all. remember, revenge is NEVER brave....it is a resort you fall back to when all else fails or you know nothing else will administer the correct justice YOU feel is required by the situation.
It would be a great world if we all forgave and forgot but that simply wont happen because that is just an invitation to the scum out there to do what they want with minimal consequences.
I applaud the ops beliefs, but until the world is big enough to punish correctly and not confuse punishment with rehabilitation then revenge will be a part of most peoples lives.I'm not that big enough yet either I'm afraid,sorry.

reply to post by consulmac


Stopping them should be about control, not revenge. Stopping the "scum" without dropping into their level.

Also, death is no punishment. For some of these SOB criminals it's a liberation from their miserable existence. But locking up these problem cases is very expensive, so it's a difficult subject. Maybe people should figure out a different way to deal with them.

[edit on 20/6/2010 by Tryptych]

reply to post by Tryptych


It's not necessarily about punishment. People are usually given a death sentence after it becomes obvious they are without conscience, and therefore, without the ability to be rehabilitated; properly punished.

reply to post by unityemissions


True, true.. so it's more like elimination, not actually about revenge. It does save lives and money, if you think about it.

So maybe it necessary. Pretty heavy, still.

Not everything that is thought by some to be revenge is revenge.

How would one feel if they let someone walk only to hear they did it again to someone down the road?

reply to post by Tryptych


I do agree, but sometimes to get the job done you have to step down a level in order to make an impact on some people.Also, I said nothing about death.

Revenge upon the guilty is not even the worst of it. What about those that seek revenge and do so regardless that doing so might and does often kill or maim or hurt the innocent. Take soldiers for example. They blindly drop bombs safely from above like the cowards they are, seeking revenge upon their enemy, but in the process murder innocent women and children. THOSE are the creeps that will be spending eternity burning in hell, those on both sides that kill the innocent.

Anyhow, revenge is necessary. Actions without consequences can not be allowed. Golden rule! Kill the terrorists, the murderers, the rapists, etc., but if you also kill the innocent in doing so, then your now the terrorists too, and thus your innocent women and children deserve to be killed for revenge. Revenge is fine and necessary when dealing with evil, but you cross a line and become a POS yourself when your revenge kills the innocent too. Be careful with revenge, otherwise you'll be just as bad and deserve just as bad!

Explanation: Its called Tit for Tat AND it is quite rational! Here is why...

Tit for Tat [wiki]

... which is based on the applied mathematics of...

Game Theory [wiki]

Personal Disclosure: So yes there is a rational and scientific reason for revenge... but best practice still requires it to be served cold OK!

I, for one, believe there is almost always an alternative to revenge. I wouldn't suggest hugging your attacker, but you can still show people the errors of their ways without repeating their misdeed. Revenge brings consolidation, but it is all too often the easiest method.

There are three theories of crime and punishment.
1. "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" Biblical
2. Deterrence
3. Rehabilitation.

Deterrence works for 98% of society.
An eye for an eye works for the rest.

Criminals are criminals because they chose to break laws in spite of overwhelming social pressure to follow the rules of society.

None of this "mommy sat me on the potty crooked" excuses.
Consciense is written on everyones soul and heart.
Criminals choose to harden their heart and ignore the truth.

Originally posted by PirateShark
... but you can still show people the errors of their ways without repeating their misdeed.

LOL, if that were true, organizations such a PETA would have been able to get their message across to flesh and blood thirsty vampires. If that were true, people wouldn't be driving their cars a few blocks to pick up a pack of smokes and case of beer or buying unnecessary crap made from plastic that nobody really needs to survive on Earth. If that were true, prisons would be empty. If that were true, there wouldn't be a need for armies. If that were true, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.

[edit on 20-6-2010 by Divinorumus]

concerning many things, i do not fully understand the need to be passive.

at some point "revenge" becomes "justice".

Originally posted by slugger9787
Criminals are criminals because they chose to break laws in spite of overwhelming social pressure to follow the rules of society.

I have never committed any crime and the police have spent 18 years trying to destroy my life.

Police are all criminals just desperate to destroy people for there friends, and this is a fact.

You people talking about crimes, what about the police?

Revenge ceases to feel necessary when we have entirely understood the person who wronged us, from his conscious perspective. Those who have never achieved this sort of understanding will disagree with me, especially if they think they have. It is extremely difficult.

reply to post by NewlyAwakened

Na i think the best way is to let the world have as much scum as it wants.

The police are scum, and the criminals are scum.

Enough said, let them have the world they want, and there is scum for the lot of you.

reply to post by Donnie Darko


explain to me why a lion who had a traumatic event from hyenas grew up to be a hyena killer dotn belive me at some point they had it on tv dont remember if it was discovery or animal planet but a lion grew up and basically would find a hyena den and sleep in there face as if saying come get me...

animals to hold grudges abuse a puppy for awhiel then let it go to a good home and come see it and see if it wants to see you!