It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

warning this can offend law abiding citizens - Which I'm not one of.

page: 13
113
<< 10  11  12    14  15  16 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:13 AM
link   
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 


Do I really have to hit the ignore button? I feel that is such a last resort and does nothing to help anything but you seem to be begging me to. Now you are calling me a liar all while hiding behind false statements about me you refuse to back up or admit fault with. You are a joke and the reason good Christians get a bad name. I would ask you to quote one single lie I have told but you are above that right?

I can quote you lying about me.

Can you do the same?




posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:15 AM
link   
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


There was a thread here on a city fining people for holding Church meetings in a private home.

I will add it to this comment if I can find it.

The encroachment of government in everyone's everyday lives is insidious. This is how they approach it. Make everything part of government and that is how they place control.

Imagine this, if we completely went to a socialist society where even the right to say a home or residence, could they then say because it is owned or supplied by the government, then they have the right to say what goes on in that very residence?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:16 AM
link   
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


I do not care if you hit the ignore button or not, I won't because you are a tyrant and seek to oppress others, and as long as you do, I will be ready to challenge this tyranny and fight for freedom. Your petty insults don't harm me in the least, but your advocacy of tyranny harms everyone.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:18 AM
link   

Originally posted by endisnighe
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


There was a thread here on a city fining people for holding Church meetings in a private home.

I will add it to this comment if I can find it.


Unfortunately, I can believe that. I would like to see it though. Was it because it was a large gathering in a private home or because it was religious?


The encroachment of government in everyone's everyday lives is insidious. This is how they approach it. Make everything part of government and that is how they place control.


I do not disagree but I do not feel that using a public school to "preach" about homosexuals and condom use is not exactly a productive or appropriate response. Do you?


Imagine this, if we completely went to a socialist society where even the right to say a home or residence, could they then say because it is owned or supplied by the government, then they have the right to say what goes on in that very residence?


Imagine this, if Lurr from Omachron Persei 8 decides to destroy all brown haired people, I might get a pass. It is fun to imagine, isn't it?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:22 AM
link   
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 


Lies in the name of Jesus!!!!

If Jesus was having a discussion and felt cornered what would he do?

Make up quotes and respond to them, of course.

You are purposely lying to defend Christianity. You have to answer to your god about that. I fortunately have no such preclusion and yet I still managed to engage without having to make up things you said. Amazing how that worked out huh?

I honestly feel like we could have had an interesting and fun conversation if you could have stuck to the truth. Unfortunately, you had to lie in order to defend Jesus.

Did I mention yet that you are telling lies in the name of Jesus? I just want to make sure I point that out. You can not even admit that you just simply might have been wrong about what you thought you read? After all this, you can not simply concede maybe at least a few of your points were mistaken?

Well, you go tell your god you had to lie to a Satanist today to defend him. From what I read, he will be sending you to my church to see if anyone there wants you.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:22 AM
link   
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


As if teaching homosexuality and condom use in any school, let alone public schools is appropriate. Please. Let's just do away with the damn public schools, and then people can send their kids to whatever school best suits their ideology.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:25 AM
link   
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


The argument was that people were using the home as a Church gathering, so it was not zoned for it. Also because people were using PUBLIC parking areas. See how that works?

Me using the the analogy at the end was to SHOW EXACTLY what has happened with schools.

Because government takes so much money from us, property taxes for the purpose of schools, we do not have enough money to send our children to schools of our choice. This in and of itself creates the VERY restrictions of our rights of Freedom of Religion.

Do you not understand that? It is not Freedom from Religion, it is Freedom of Religion.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:26 AM
link   

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


As if teaching homosexuality and condom use in any school, let alone public schools is appropriate. Please. Let's just do away with the damn public schools, and then people can send their kids to whatever school best suits their ideology.



LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Holy crap this is funny funny stuff. Nothing I say is worth quoting, got it.

Nothing I say is worth getting right, got that.

You do not care if I put you on ignore because of how insignificant my posts are.

You jump onto my response to someone else just for more attention.

Found those quotes of me saying any of the things you claim I said yet?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:30 AM
link   
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 



The Bill of Rights, nor any provision in the Tennessee constitution doesn't prohibit that principal from praying, of which that principal didn't do anyway. The complexity you attempted to add to the First Amendment is only your opinion and not a point of law.


Your right, in a private capacity he has every right to worship his deity of choice/indoctrination. In a public government paid job, he has no right by law to blast his religious convictions.


The reason God figures so prominently is to remind everyone that rights are not government granted but come from a higher authority and are Inalienable and no human has the authority to grant or disparage another persons rights.


That's cockamamie BS my friend.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights ...."

No where does it give a specific deity of choice/indoctrination. The wording is vague on who the Creator is as no religion can be sanctioned by the United States Government by law.

Adding 'In god we trust' and other such Christian nonsense is a violation of that constitutional law as it depicts *ONE* deity of choice as if the government is sanctioning that one deity of choice over all others.

It is against the law, not something to remind us of a purposefully vague statement in the constitution.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:30 AM
link   
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


You keep bringing Jesus into this and I don't understand why, until you started calling me a liar for Jesus, I never even mentioned his name. Why do you think this "Christian" baiting is working out for you? Do you honestly believe that if you keep doing the same thing over and over you will finally get a different result? You can lecture me about Christianity and God all you want, it doesn't change in the least your tyranny. I gave you the opportunity to simply take a stand for freedom and declare all people have the right to worship freely without any government intrusion, and I told you if you did, I would give you your apology. You have refused. Why have you? From the beginning I have maintained the same stance, that people are free to worship whomever they want in public. You clearly disagree, but refuse to admit this, why?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:31 AM
link   

Originally posted by endisnighe
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


The argument was that people were using the home as a Church gathering, so it was not zoned for it. Also because people were using PUBLIC parking areas. See how that works?


So it was not about it being a church, it was about the amount of people frequenting a private home. There is a difference. Show me the law that says I can not hold church in my home. No one else needs to come to my church. I do not need a permit for the number of people and my parking is still my parking. Can you show me the law that prevents me from doing so?


Me using the the analogy at the end was to SHOW EXACTLY what has happened with schools.

Because government takes so much money from us, property taxes for the purpose of schools, we do not have enough money to send our children to schools of our choice. This in and of itself creates the VERY restrictions of our rights of Freedom of Religion.


So private schools are closing down all over the country due to lack of attendance? Can you show me that?


Could you provide me with some numbers? My school taxes do not prevent me from still sending my children to private school. Perhaps you can show me some statistics?


Do you not understand that? It is not Freedom from Religion, it is Freedom of Religion.


I guess I do not understand because I do not see how anyone's private religious beliefs and practices are being infringed upon. All I see is people trying to use my tax dollars and a public forum to push their religion.

Defending that and defending freedom are two different things to me. Let me know when you find any instance of the government not allowing people to practice Christianity in private.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:32 AM
link   
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 


You keep refusing to admit you made mistakes when responding to me and misconstrued everything I said to the point of blatantly making up what I said. How is that working for you?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:33 AM
link   
reply to post by endisnighe
 


Took over education? What kind of drugs do you take, seriously?

You are not required to send your children to government run public schools. You have the option to home-school or pay for private school. Or pay someone to home-school your child instead of you.

What freedoms are you being limited from? Jesus Christ, where do some of you folks come from?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:37 AM
link   
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 




I do not disagree but I do not feel that using a public school to "preach" about homosexuals and condom use is not exactly a productive or appropriate response. Do you?


I would say...... yes. Because those are not religious at all .. he can rant and rave all he wants to about those topics, the only person who can do anything about that is the superintendent. The only thing he's prohibited from doing under Federal Law is praying over the loud speaker, or forcing anyone to partake in said prayer.

Which I agree with.

If you want prayer in your childs life, send them to private schools.

But the Principle was RIGHT ON when it comes to appropriate and inappropriate morality issues.. as a Deist, I find praying to children, whether it be Christian, Jewish or Islam or whatever, far less offensive and inappropriate to be talking about how right homosexuality is, or condom usage, or any other moral, ethical dilemma. THOSE should be left at home for the parent to decide. And yet, regardless of how many are offended, it is encouraged..

That, I believe, was his message.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:38 AM
link   
reply to post by sirnex
 





Your right, in a private capacity he has every right to worship his deity of choice/indoctrination. In a public government paid job, he has no right by law to blast his religious convictions.


You have clearly not read the Tennessee constitution, for if you had, you would know that Article IX, Section 2 prohibits atheists from holding any government office. This principal is angry because a federal government has ignored the 10th Amendment, the First Amendment and used a reference Thomas Jefferson wrote in a letter to the Danbury Baptists to justify their tyranny. All people have the right to worship in public.

There is nothing vague at all about what is meant by Creator, and it sure as hell wasn't talking about King George, my friend. Too many people have attempted to frame our Inalienable rights as government granted rights, and now they call them civil rights, regardless, this sort of shenanigans is what is B.S., and I don't care if it is Creator or God who is used, as long as it is understood that rights come from a higher authority, if you insist on calling Creator too vague, then I suppose you will argue the same about the 9th Amendment.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:41 AM
link   
reply to post by K J Gunderson
 


You keep attempting to derail this thread, and make this about you. This thread isn't about you, it is about the freedom to worship, and the clear prohibitions placed on government to stop the freedom of worship. No matter how hard you try to derail this thread, I will continue to maintain this position. All people are free to worship in public and government has no legal authority to stop it.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:45 AM
link   

Originally posted by sirnex
reply to post by endisnighe
 


Took over education? What kind of drugs do you take, seriously?

You are not required to send your children to government run public schools. You have the option to home-school or pay for private school. Or pay someone to home-school your child instead of you.

What freedoms are you being limited from? Jesus Christ, where do some of you folks come from?


First off, I noticed you did not give any reference to the Constitution on where the federal government can "takeover" schools. Still waiting for that power granted to them by the Constitution.

Forced property taxes to pay for "public" schools is EXACTLY the problem and the implementation of control and takeover of our children's schooling. Would not want the children to learn this country was founded on Natural Law and everything that comes with that. Including that rights are endowed by our creator and CANNOT be abrogated or derogated.

As for allowed to home school or send your child to private school. You have got to be kidding me. Do you not know the hoops you have to do to home school nowadays? As for private schools, hmmmm, I wonder if they have to be licensed, inspected, regulated and have their curriculum's mandated by the government?

Emotional rhetoric will get you no where. How bout you using some logical reasoning behind your arguments?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:46 AM
link   

Originally posted by Rockpuck

I would say...... yes. Because those are not religious at all .. he can rant and rave all he wants to about those topics, the only person who can do anything about that is the superintendent.


I guess you missed the part where what he was addressing were his CHRISTIAN VALUES toward said topics?


The only thing he's prohibited from doing under Federal Law is praying over the loud speaker, or forcing anyone to partake in said prayer.

Which I agree with.

If you want prayer in your childs life, send them to private schools.


No disagreement but...

What if he was a radical muslim and wanted to take that time to point out how he is not allowed to call all others infidels? What if he took that time to point out that he can talk about things his religions does not have positive views of? There is a difference. This man did not teach anything valuable about condoms or homosexuality. He simply pointed out that he is allowed to talk about those types of "perversions" if he wanted. He brought his religious views into the discussion.



But the Principle was RIGHT ON when it comes to appropriate and inappropriate morality issues.. as a Deist, I find praying to children, whether it be Christian, Jewish or Islam or whatever, far less offensive and inappropriate to be talking about how right homosexuality is, or condom usage, or any other moral, ethical dilemma. THOSE should be left at home for the parent to decide. And yet, regardless of how many are offended, it is encouraged..


What about those of us that would like both to remain at home? If I take my 5 year old to watch her big brother play, she should have to hear that condoms are a perversion because the principal cannot pray? That is ok with you? Football games are not age specific, classes are.


That, I believe, was his message.


I believe his message was that since he is not allowed to pray out loud in front of everyone so everyone can see him worship his god, he is going to point out that his religion has intolerant views of homosexuality instead. Not appropriate for a FAMILY event held at a public school on my tax dime.

He did not say one valuable thing about the topics he mentioned. He pointed out that although his RELIGION is against them, he can talk about them if he wants.

As a Christian, why would he want to talk to a crowd of all ages about homosexuality and condom use in any capacity at a football game for the general public?



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:48 AM
link   
reply to post by sirnex
 


Yet sadly.. so many hard working people cannot afford to send their children to private schools.. because when you do, you pay for private school AND public school.

Now if there was a private school tax rebate.. I'd agree that moral and ethical issues can be dictated by the state, because you have the complete power to remove your family, personally and financially, from the school system.



posted on May, 26 2010 @ 06:48 AM
link   
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux
 


You keep trying to talk to me after I quite clearly stated you will get no relevant response from me until you admit your mistake, back it up, or confess it was a lie. I am having a fine time talking about the thread topic with other people who have not resorted to lying about what I say to make points. Hopefully you can rest and pray and learn from this.

Next time you want to talk with someone, be honest with them about the things they themselves say.

Admit it when you make a mistake.

Stop responding to me for no good reason when I have not responded to the content of your posts for quite some time now. You told me I did not matter. Go away then.



new topics

top topics



 
113
<< 10  11  12    14  15  16 >>

log in

join