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Accused Illegal Immigrant Rapes 12-yr old girl - Raleigh

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posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:54 PM
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Originally posted by maria_stardust

Originally posted by Iamonlyhuman
Do you see how his illegal status could make this whole situation worse for this girl and her family? Yes, even worse than if she were raped by a legal citizen.


On the contrary. I sincerely doubt that this family is wishing that if their child was going to be raped it would be altogether better that the rapist be a legal citizen. Madness lays down that line of reasoning.

That's no different than saying that a rapist that is wealthy and comes from a good, upstanding family is worse than one who comes from a blue-collar background.

Or better yet:

The rape of this child is worse because the rapist is _________ instead of ___________.

That is just insane.


You misunderstood. My question was: Do you see how his illegal status could make this whole situation worse for this girl and her family?

With your experience working with rape victims, you must know that victims and their families agonize over what if they had done things differently. I also have worked in womens’ shelters, on phone lines, and meeting victims at hospital emergency rooms to just be there with them. The one thing that they and their family members ALL do is play the “what if” game. I know I would do it too, it’s a part of the psyche.

You must have missed my previous post so I’ll quote myself so you can see where I’m coming from:


Originally posted by Iamonlyhuman
I have a 12 year old daughter. I would be devastated for her if this happened to her. I would be devastated that this would affect her for the rest of her life. I would likely be in the "what if" mode too... what if I hadn't dropped her off, what if her brother had been with her, what if I'd have bought her mace to take with her, what if, what if, what if...

If this man is proved to be in this country illegally, and the authorities did nothing about his being here illegally, honestly, I'm not sure I could contain what little composure I would have left. It's one thing to play the what if's in your mind, as a parent, when you can't be sure that even if you HAD done all of those things, things wouldn't have turned out the same anyway. It's quite another to KNOW FOR CERTAIN that, had the authorities done their job and deported this man, your child would not have experienced this devastation.


So, yes, in my mind, it is worse to have the illegal status issue on top of the rape issue.


[edit on 23/5/2010 by Iamonlyhuman]




posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:55 PM
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Alright, Guys.

We have two very heated issues in one thread: Rape and illegal immigration.

Let's remember to focus on the discussion but not each other. Be passionate without getting personal.

Stay on topic or else it is possible the post may be removed.

Thank you.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:57 PM
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I think anyone that rapes a child should be put to death. But thats just my opinion.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:57 PM
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Originally posted by prionace glauca
Oh wait how about that individual who was DEPORTED 9 Times only to come back and rape someone in the USA & tarnish their life for ever.


Never said they would be held forever just saying that in some cases they are. This guy was deported 9 times and kept coming back true enough but it does not mean that he did not do anytime before being deported.

I have said it before none of your immigration laws is going to make a difference when it comes to real criminals because they are already standing outside the law.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:59 PM
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Originally posted by maria_stardust
It is ridiculous to consider that a rape committed by an illegal immigrant is any more heinous than a rape committed by legal citizen. The fact remains that a young girl was raped and to use her traumatic experience as an excuse to promote a political agenda is abhorrent.

Rape is not a crime committed exclusively by illegal immigrants.

This thread reeks as a pathetic excuse to bash an already demonized segment of society with impunity.


your argument is ridiculous. how could his illegal status not be relevant?

that's like saying the victim of a gun shooting shouldn't at all be concerned about where teh gun came from. or who was holding it for that matter.

it's like going to an abortion clinic to get an abortion but not taking a course of sex education to understand why pregnancy occurs.

this is totally backwards thinking, purely and emotional and sensational argument.

*Snip*

Mod Note: General ATS Discussion Etiquette – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 5/24/2010 by semperfortis]



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:03 PM
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Originally posted by prionace glauca
I still can not believe that there are individuals standing up for these criminals. Do your country a favor, drop your citizenship at your nearest consulate office and move to a country where illegal activities are promoted.


C'mon now! That is outright laughable.

I have yet to counter a single instance within this thread where anyone has condoned the actions of this rapist.


Seriously, there's no need to resort to such antics.



Originally posted by Spazzy
i think you're the one that's ridiculous. i bet you wouldn't use this pathctic argument when it comes to gun control would you? or how about abortion?

i'm sure your tune would change to suit whatever need you deem emotionally worthy for the moment. an illegal raping a child is every bit as relevent as where firearms that kill people come from.




Needlessly dragging in the issues of abortion and gun control have nothing to do with the topic at hand.

Talk about the fine art of deflection.


It's interesting to witness how some members are willing to place more emphasis on the legal status of the rapist over the fact that a young girl has been raped.

My point within this thread is that ALL rapes are abhorrent regardless of the rapist's legal status.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:05 PM
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Originally posted by Spazzy
your argument is ridiculous. how could his illegal status not be relevant?


So if a high scool drop out rapes a little girl does that make him being a high school drop out relevent?

Laws should be enacted so that no one is allowed to drop out of high school so we could stop rape?



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:07 PM
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Originally posted by maria_stardust
My point within this thread is that ALL rapes are abhorrent regardless of the rapist's legal status.


Yes, all rapes are abhorrent but the rapist's legal status does have an impact on how well all those involved (the victim and the victim's family) heal from it which is really the main issue in a rape to begin with.

[edit on 23/5/2010 by Iamonlyhuman]



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:07 PM
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reply to post by maria_stardust
 


oh, insults and accusations now huh? i'm sure your post won't be deleted though will it?

and besides, the OP never stated the crime was more violent or disturbing because it was an illegal. it was a fact of the case that is stated. apparenlty some members of tehse forums cannot handle that.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik

Originally posted by Spazzy
your argument is ridiculous. how could his illegal status not be relevant?


So if a high scool drop out rapes a little girl does that make him being a high school drop out relevent?

Laws should be enacted so that no one is allowed to drop out of high school so we could stop rape?



yes that's exactly what it means. what isn't obvious about that? of course it's relevant it's a total no brainer.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:09 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik
So if a high school drop out rapes a little girl does that make him being a high school drop out relevent?


dropping out of High School is NOT illegal
at least it's not in NC if you're over 16 yrs old.
So that example is quite moot.

Being in the country without permission
IS ILLEGAL.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:10 PM
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Originally posted by Iamonlyhuman
Yes, all rapes are abhorrent but the rapist's legal status does have an impact on how well all those involved (the victim and the victim's family) heal from it which is really the main issue in a rape to begin with.

[edit on 23/5/2010 by Iamonlyhuman]


Only if the family has issues with illegals. If they don't they probably don't care what his status is. All they'll care about is that their child heals. It's an issue here because, well, this is ATS and the members have a beef with illegal immigration.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:11 PM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


yeah but that won't stop people from making nonsensical arguments.

i could just as easily say that the "arabs" responsible for 9/11 are inconsequential. there was no need for hightened airport security or any new laws or regulations. we shoudl completely ignore any facts surrounding this and tunnel vision our way to a perceived "race friendly" solution regardless of how many other buildings are destroyed.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:12 PM
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Originally posted by Spazzy
yes that's exactly what it means. what isn't obvious about that? of course it's relevant it's a total no brainer.


But what happens when you have the same number of rape cases but know they are commited by high school graduates. Guess that would prove that being a high school drop out really was irrelevant.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:13 PM
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Originally posted by Iamonlyhuman
Do you see how his illegal status could make this whole situation worse for this girl and her family? Yes, even worse than if she were raped by a legal citizen.


TRUST me. And when I say that, I mean TRUST ME. When a young girl is raped, the legal status, race, age, intelligence, background or religion of the rapist is of NO consequence.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:13 PM
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Only if the family has issues with illegals. If they don't they probably don't care what his status is. All they'll care about is that their child heals. It's an issue here because, well, this is ATS and the members have a beef with illegal immigration.

did you really just speak for the family of a supposed rape victim and apply that to reality? do you honestly believe the status of a rapist will not be imbedded in the minds of the parents of teh LITTLE GIRL that was raped?



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by boondock-saint

Originally posted by daskakik
So if a high school drop out rapes a little girl does that make him being a high school drop out relevent?


dropping out of High School is NOT illegal
at least it's not in NC if you're over 16 yrs old.
So that example is quite moot.

Being in the country without permission
IS ILLEGAL.


It is not a question of legality but of relevance. Some posts up I offered link to a story with a legal immigrant comitted a similar crime. Cherry picking news clips can serve both sides.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:15 PM
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Originally posted by daskakik

Originally posted by Spazzy
yes that's exactly what it means. what isn't obvious about that? of course it's relevant it's a total no brainer.


But what happens when you have the same number of rape cases but know they are commited by high school graduates. Guess that would prove that being a high school drop out really was irrelevant.


again, we're having the problem distinguishing the difference between fact and fiction.

your statement that you just made is fiction.

the little girl that got raped by an illega is fact.

we see what you choose to support.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:16 PM
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Originally posted by Spazzy
did you really just speak for the family of a supposed rape victim and apply that to reality? do you honestly believe the status of a rapist will not be imbedded in the minds of the parents of teh LITTLE GIRL that was raped?


That's exactly what I'm saying. They are thinking of their LITTLE GIRL, not stupid political issues.

As for speaking for the family, are you the only one allowed to in this conversation?



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 03:17 PM
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Originally posted by Iamonlyhuman
Yes, all rapes are abhorrent but the rapist's legal status does have an impact on how well all those involved (the victim and the victim's family) heal from it which is really the main issue in a rape to begin with.


The background of a rapist will always have some kind of impact on the victim's healing process. That's a given.

However would that emphasis be greater than if the rapist was from a wealthy, well-to-do family who had the resources to potentially get off the hook? I think not.

The victim and her family will always carry the burden of animosity towards the rapist on their shoulders regardless of their personal backgrounds. It wouldn't matter whether or not if the rapist was a legal citizen or not. The animosity for the person as a whole will be there.



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