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Poll: Should Arizona Seceede?

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posted on May, 22 2010 @ 12:20 AM
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Originally posted by SWCCFAN


... the U.S. government has "systematically failed" ...


Well I think that about sums up the situation.

The U.S. government has failed.

It's time for the North American Union to take it's place. Let the history books take notice.

[edit on 22-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]




posted on May, 22 2010 @ 01:17 AM
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Obama is a criminal his commanders should relieve him of command Conduct unbecoming, Repel the invasion and hold new elections nuff said.



posted on May, 22 2010 @ 01:34 AM
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I dont know about succession or not. As another poster said one page 1, "Arizona is waking some other states up". With the newest development that the Fed has openly said they will not enforce the law, it should wake even more people up to what is going on. It is common knowledge to just about anyone over the age of 35 that the Feds are breaking the law themselves by saying they will not enforce the law. I realize they have broken the law before, but for the Average Joe, this is as blatant as it gets. Anyone with a brain cell left can clearly see that:

1) The Feds are no longer working for the States.
2) The Fed is openly declaring themselves the top Authority over the States
3) Tax money paid to ICE is wasted money, they wont do their job.
4) Tax money paid the government is wasted since they care not what the people want.
5) I lost my whole train of thought lol

I'm so sick of this issue. This whole thing pisses me off to no end! I don't care what Government Agency is reading this thread looking for threats. I can honestly say I would love nothing more than to walk right into the White House and kick the crap out of Obama and every white collar wuss in his cabinet! Then walk over to Congress, and start beating the crap out of just about every out of touch politician who have not done an honest days work since forever!

I do not know everything, but I do know this.... when you beat the crap out of someone it has an amazing way of changing their behavior when they know you can come back and do it again when they step out of line.



posted on May, 22 2010 @ 03:06 AM
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Well I don't believe any state will ever be able to leave this Union .. we will all die together, or live in hell together.. but the beast will never let a state leave her grasp.

But if they decided they had no other way, as the Feds are nothing more than a vacuum of wealth strangling the states.. I'd go down and help those lads out.

People are waking up to this fact: The FEDERAL government does NOT create wealth. At all. It spends every penny and trillions more that the states give it.. it's the STATES that generate the wealth.

So why in the hell are we funneling our money into the federal government which wastes it generating pointless bureaucracies, then bureaucracies to govern bureaucracies. And when the States finally need this pointless beast.. it turns its back on them.

Federalism is a cancer on our society.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 07:29 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


Since the states are the ones that generate wealth. Allow the citizens in each state keep the money they would send to the feds in the form of an income tax. That money will be spent most likley in the state and result in the states prosperity.

The state would have to provide protection from the IRS though.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 09:09 AM
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reply to post by SWCCFAN
 


Median salary of Arizona $47,750 from here-*

Population of Arizona-6,595,778 from here-*


Alright, let us just use some simple math.

12% SS tax 25% income tax

If above taxes were given directly to Arizona that would come to-Median wages x population x50% x 37% = $57 billion

Now, if Arizona was to take the federal sales taxes on things like fuel, tobacco and the like I am sure that number would be up to $100 billion

Take that $100 billion divide that up by the number of people of say 7 million, for convenience we get-$14,000 per citizen.

Just some numbers on your supposition.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 09:25 AM
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reply to post by endisnighe
 


And don't forget the Federal Corporate and Small Business income taxes.


Just imagine the hospitals and schools Arizona could build with that money.. instead we will fund the massive corrupt Federal Government and her many frivolous exploits.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 09:27 AM
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I never thought I would see the day where I thought secession could happen in the US again. If the decision is made to seceede it will have to be at the will of the citizens, given the responses here I believe it can happen. If it does happen I think Texas and the rest of the south will quickly follow. As far as the US military response, who do you think the soldiers, airmen, sailors, and Marines will side with, their home state or the Federal government who treats them like pawns?



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 09:43 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 


Yeah, I was just bringing individual income taxes into it. A lot of people think that is all there is. I have done breakdowns on effective tax rates before. I estimated that effective tax rates, including such things as inflation also, people and businesses are taxed at anywhere from 30% to 80% depending on income.

Hell, if Arizona was to just eliminate all federal taxation and just continue with their existing taxes, the state would become so rich that the rest of the states would follow like dominoes. Imagine infusing 30-50% more funds into the pockets of the people and businesses.

The state would flourish. Reducing federal taxation increases revenue for the state by the very increase in the economy.

It is business calculus 101. By determining the min and max of a given set of parameters, you can determine the maximum revenue a tax will bring in. I would posit that it would be a very low number.

I find it funny that many complained about Reagan's tax cuts for the wealthy. They never bring up the fact that after they were instated that the revenue went up.

Of course I believe that individuals should not be taxed at all on their labor or property. That taxation of such things as profits from business, capital gains, tariffs, sales, and other things are enough to sustain a limited and lean government. Which caters to protecting the rights of the citizens alone and not a frelling nanny state.

But, with this model education of the masses must be maintained to a high degree and personal savings for lean times is necessary. The debt and credit lifestyle of modern day cannot be the rule of the day. Everyone must realize that savings and self reliance is a must in self governance.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 10:38 AM
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reply to post by SWCCFAN
 



If the Federal Government ever attacked a state with the Military. There would be no federal government.

The Hundreds of millions of gun owners would whipe them out in just a few days.


Come on...hunting rifles against stealth bombers...yeah you really have the upper hand.


Remeber the Phrase: Don't Tread on Me?


Yes...it is a phrase people like to use when they have no other argument. Explain to me how the federal government would be treading on American citizens by attacking a state that seceded (who's residents are no longer American citizens by the fact that they seceded)????


Well I can tell you that there are millions of Milita in this country and they will rise up and water that tree of liberty should the Feds try somthing that stupid.


It's not stupid to attack a group of people who are trying to break up the country. If Arizona would do this...they would of been making the stupid move...the Feds would just be responding.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by sdcigarpig
There is one other thing about the state of Arizona that not many people realize, it has alot of natural resorces at its disposal, from copper, tin and the one metal that everyone tends to want, gold. And some of those metals are just on the surface of the ground, and people go out with metal detectors to just pick it up.



And are they going to eat this metal?

Or will they be trading with America's enemies (because America's allies will join the US and not trade with them)???


People just don't think things through...it's funny.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 02:10 PM
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Arizona will not succeed, it relies too heavily on federal money.



posted on May, 23 2010 @ 06:47 PM
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reply to post by endisnighe
 


And just imagine the tax load of mega states like California.. hell just off their Corporate Federal Income they could support the entire states. It's a damn shame the states is filled to the brim with ignorant Progressives.. their state is bankrupt and yet they still move money into the Federal Government by the truck load.. let them keep their money, and they could afford to be the communist paradise they so want to be. ultimately, they are our Greece.. unable to control their monetary future, they are destined for bankruptcy or severe austerity.




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