Break Up of the US is Inevitable

Break Up of the US is Inevitable

www.newswithviews.com

In the meantime, keep talking about freedom around your coffee tables; keep writing about freedom in your books and columns; keep praying about freedom in your churches and closets; keep dreaming about freedom in your hearts and minds. Real freedom--where a man can be left alone; where a man can keep what he earns; where a man can make his own choices; where a man's property is his own; where harassing agents of an oppressive central government are nowhere to be found; where a man doesn't have to sell his soul in order to sell his wares; where a man's worship of God is not subject to politi

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While I don't agree with the everything Baldwin says or believes I thought this was a pretty good article. I personally don't feel secession is necassary because if you had enough people who would stand together you could nullify the federal government in the states. However I am not against it and it is a right that could be exercised.


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[edit on 19-5-2010 by hawkiye]

I've watched for years. The government is going to fall apart very very soon. All nations go through it. the only difference is that the US has a basic tenant of unity. While it is weaker today look around at us fine gents in places like here. The basic essence of the nation will outlast the nation and in turn reunify the nation. Personally I view a North American Union as inevitable, and its fracture just as inevitable. I have no doubt that by the decade's end there will be a new united states that stretched across the continent with a new flag but still the same old nation.

Originally posted by Gorman91
Personally I view a North American Union as inevitable, and its fracture just as inevitable. I have no doubt that by the decade's end there will be a new united states that stretched across the continent with a new flag but still the same old nation.

I hope to God your wrong. At the same time though, I believe in prophecy and many seem to indicate that path. They also indicate that path leads to certain doom.

In order to join in a union, that tends to require some give and take. I don't want to see the US give anything that we value in the constitution, which is what would happen.

To put it frankly, Mexico just doesn't have the 'right stuff' and to fold that into America only weakens it further. Just look at the news out recently about the Mexican police giving up because things were getting bad.

Canada (with the exception of Quebec) would likely blend in just fine, but I would want them to make that call individually, not government to government.

Another fine atricle and post Hawkiye. It's a good read. Scary, but may hold some truth. I too don't agree with everything the author says but the basic tenets are hard to deny given what I see in the world around us. I only hope that enough people have their eyes opened in enough time for us to maybe be capable of resurrecting our republic from the ashes that we've become.

Good responses. I could see it happening however the kind of motivation that would cause it could also be channeled into simply nullifying the federal government from acting outside thier scope of Constitutional powers as they do today.

As for expanding across the continent I don't see that happening as those countries don't have the same traditions of fighting for freedom we have however I could see British Columbia wanting to be part of a new free United States They have traditions of rugged individualism and freedom much like ours and our often at odds with the Canadian government.

[edit on 19-5-2010 by hawkiye]

I have said on my radio show several times that the southern states could repeal the Secession Prohibeted clause from their states Constitution. This would be like Flashing a loaded gun to the feds.

Its not secession its just making it an option.

reply to post by SWCCFAN


I was unaware of this clause, but I like the idea of simply repealing it.

I understand the concept of the winner makes the rules when it comes to war, but how is this clause even legitimate? I mean, is it a requirement for all states to have that in their constitutions?

reply to post by Wolf321


LOL. If it happened, I really really doubt Mexico would have much say in the matters. The nation is a mess and by the end of the decade they will be begging us for help. In the end, they will surrender a good amount of what their nation is. I personally would not be surprised to find Mexico an English speaking federal appendage of the US by 2100. But the reality is that likely this New Nation will have internal borders, or language sectors, where certain languages are official and mandatory. I'd imagine Mexico to be a Spanish sector, Quebec a French sector, and the rest an English sector. Because rest assured, this government that rises will be new and strict. They will not be as lax as the current three. It will likely be a European Union styled federal system.

I don't think we will Balkanize.

The thing with the break up of Yugoslavia and the USSR, was cultural and language division. The US for the most part doesn't have that. We are far more homogenous than most people realize.

What I do believe will happen in the next 30 to 40 years is conflict. A brutal and nasty conflict involving the US Southwest and the growing hispanic population.

I personally worry that it will turn into a war of extermination and minorities will face ethnic cleansing and possibly genocide.

A good historical example that I think we may follow is Turkey and the ethnic cleansing of the Armenians and Kurds after World War I. I think the Weimar Republic is another good example to look at as well, with the rise of the Third Reich after Germany had economically and financially collapsed.

I worry at some point, in the next 20 to 30 years, the US could find itself in the same position as Turkey and Germany after WWI. Out of the ashes of that collapse, I fear a moster will rise that will make the Third Reich pale in comparison.

reply to post by Wolf321


It was a requirement for the states that suceeded to be re-admited to the Union.

From MS Constitution:
ARTICLE 3 BILL OF RIGHTS SECTION 7. Secession prohibited.

It's that simple.

Repeal section 7 and then its on the table as an option.

But of course that is easer said then done. It would take a State Constitutional Convention. That is highly unlikely at the present time.

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by Wolf321

 

LOL. If it happened, I really really doubt Mexico would have much say in the matters. The nation is a mess and by the end of the decade they will be begging us for help. In the end, they will surrender a good amount of what their nation is. I personally would not be surprised to find Mexico an English speaking federal appendage of the US by 2100. But the reality is that likely this New Nation will have internal borders, or language sectors, where certain languages are official and mandatory. I'd imagine Mexico to be a Spanish sector, Quebec a French sector, and the rest an English sector. Because rest assured, this government that rises will be new and strict. They will not be as lax as the current three. It will likely be a European Union styled federal system.

I doubt it but either way not after a lot of blood shed. The whole reason people are considering this option is because of oppressive government. They will not tolerate a new even more oppressive government.

reply to post by SWCCFAN


Wow, this really pisses me off. At the same time, I laugh in the face of the government with regards to telling a state they cannot leave a contract.

They can write down a rule denying a states rights, but they can't stop them.

Sure hope not. Personally i like being able to hop in my car and drive to any state i please and visit and enjoy what each has to offer. It would suck to have to start viewing other states as "foreign countries"

IMHO, its exactly what they want us to believe, that we are so different that we need to separate, they fill our heads from both sides with pure lies. From the ultra left, to ultra right. They want you to think we are so different. Pure scare mongering for votes and control, with no thought of how it effects us as a people. They incite hatred, and use the fact that a good percentage of the country both right and left are blinded by their choice of media and what they think is their political ideology. There is no ideology anymore. The republicans of today are not the Abraham Lincolns and small government, conservatives they should be, and the Democrats are not the FDR's they should be. We were so much closer to each other then. What happened?

Greed. Bottom line, you do not have a party, your ideology is gone, you are being tricked and most of us are buying it hook line and sinker.

If we need to separate, its only from the true enemies here, the people who really run this country, the corporations and the banks. But we as a people are not strong enough, it is sad to say. because we want our LCD TVs and our nice cars and homes we cant afford. We are fat and lazy like a turkey on Thanksgiving. We let them incite us to argue, we spout nonsense fact back and forth to each other, because we heard it on TV or some opinion of a political pundits blog. If we want this to stop we actually have to do something about and we ALL have to not just wait for someone else. And I am sorry but the Tea party movement is their way of making you think your doing something. But in reality, the only things you can do is not buy into it and them. Buy Local, Do not use credit, grow some of your own food, educate your children correctly. We need to go back to somewhat of a small town mentality, again IMHO. But alas, there is not enough of us to fight the good fight. We are too busy worrying about the Muslims and the Mexicans, while they sit back and rape you. Are there legitimate issues there, yes. But there is were real people and state governments should be playing the main role. While I do not agree with how AZ is doing it. I applaud them for taking it into there hands and not waiting.

The bottom line is 80% of us are more towards the middle, and see things with common sense if they were presented to us with truthfulness.

FDR's inauguration speech -- Now does that sound like the democrats of today?

"Primarily this is because rulers of the exchange of mankind's goods have failed through their own stubbornness and their own incompetence, have admitted their failure, and have abdicated. Practices of the unscrupulous money changers stand indicted in the court of public opinion, rejected by the hearts and minds of men. True they have tried, but their efforts have been cast in the pattern of an outworn tradition. Faced by failure of credit they have proposed only the lending of more money. Stripped of the lure of profit by which to induce our people to follow their false leadership, they have resorted to exhortations, pleading tearfully for restored confidence....The money changers have fled from their high seats in the temple of our civilization. We may now restore that temple to the ancient truths. The measure of the restoration lies in the extent to which we apply social values more noble than mere monetary profit"

Originally posted by ShiftTrio


The bottom line is 80% of us are more towards the middle, and see things with common sense if they were presented to us with truthfulness.

Wanted to say I loved your whole post. You are very much correct. It seems like "radical" elements in both "camps" are the ones steering the debates about everything these days. Some days I feel like political discourse has become an episode of south park with copious amounts of name calling and swearing. How are we to accomplish anything in this type of environment?

I see the camps as a red herring, political theater for the masses. There will be no serious change when congress switches hands in November. It seems like people are itching for a civil war-Well, be careful what you wish for. You want to see dead Americans in the street? Would that be entertaining for you?

People need to stop buying into the rhetoric. People ultimately need to stop living in fear. You cannot make rational choices when you are living in fear. Let it go and be a proactive person.

Originally posted by antonia
It seems like people are itching for a civil war-Well, be careful what you wish for. You want to see dead Americans in the street? Would that be entertaining for you?

I don't think many want a civil war, and those who do, do not want it to see or have the killing, but because they feel that it is the only way to regain freedom and identity being lost. They are focused on the end goal and not the road to that end.

I don't see a civil war happening in that there will no clearly defined ideals, identifying characteristics or boundaries.

In the US Civil War, sides were more clearly marked and defined:
there was a boundary between the northern states and southern.
there was language characteristics that could identify a persons origin.

What is more likely, and what is seemingly being set up, is a race war. The races in the US have either by design or nature, to a great extent self-segregated and can be found clustered together in communities based on race. Likewise, they are clearly identifiable. And while blacks have been more readily integrated into what an American is, hispanics (due to illegal immigration) and other nationalities with heavy accents or cultural characteristics, are not.




[edit on 19-5-2010 by Wolf321]

Originally posted by Wolf321

I don't think many want a civil war, and those who do, do not want it to see or have the killing, but because they feel that it is the only way to regain freedom and identity being lost. They are focused on the end goal and not the road to that end.

Please, if people didn't want this they wouldn't be rising to the occasion nearly to the extent they do. You wouldn't see one state threatening to boycott another. People need to act like adults. that doesn't involve calling each other names and screaming "Liberal" or "Conservative". Furthermore, I don't care what goal they have in mind. I wouldn't trust any of these people are I don't see what they have to offer anyone. People want to scream "revolution", but they have no idea what they want.

As for race war, idiots can go on and kill each other. I'm way past caring. if someone wants to take up arms over something that stupid, I'm just going to hitch a flight out and let you guys at it. The rest of the populace that is smart enough not to get involved in such stupidity can just come back and clean up the mess.

This is why we will get nowhere. All this violence and threat of violence plays right into the hands of the controllers. It's better to stop justifying any of it and simply remove yourself from the situation.

[edit on 19-5-2010 by antonia]

Originally posted by antonia
This is why we will get nowhere. All this violence and threat of violence plays right into the hands of the controllers. It's better to stop justifying any of it and simply remove yourself from the situation.

Do you mean physically, as the example you made of yourself?

Because its hard for people to 'remove' themselves from situations that are quite real and affecting their daily and long term lives.