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Riddle me this Athiests...

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posted on May, 21 2010 @ 06:44 AM
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reply to post by sirnex
 





The path to knowledge is not born of arrogance and pretentious bigotry of saying one has already attained knowledge. No, instead the path to knowledge is one of humility and a desire to seek out that knowledge. -Me.


I see no attempt at all at an explanation for existence. Why is that?




posted on May, 21 2010 @ 06:48 AM
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Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by sirnex
 





The path to knowledge is not born of arrogance and pretentious bigotry of saying one has already attained knowledge. No, instead the path to knowledge is one of humility and a desire to seek out that knowledge. -Me.


I see no attempt at all at an explanation for existence. Why is that?


Because I have the bravery to admit that I don't know the true answer to that question. If you would like, I could knowingly lie with arrogance of mind and bigotry of being and give you any answer that would suffice your curiosity.

Yet, that answer would be meaningless to reality as without truth, there is no answer. Lies, be they knowingly made or arrogantly assumed are still just lies. There is no path to knowledge through purposeful lying, only a path to arrogant bigotry is attained through such.

If you want to seek the answers to reality, reserve humility and understand that you don't have the answers, no matter how much you lie to yourself and those around you. You can be truly brave, or you can hypocritical call others a coward. Life is your choice, choose true knowledge over arrogant bigotry.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 06:58 AM
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reply to post by sirnex
 





If you want to seek the answers to reality, reserve humility and understand that you don't have the answers, no matter how much you lie to yourself and those around you. You can be truly brave, or you can hypocritical call others a coward. Life is your choice, choose true knowledge over arrogant bigotry


Ahhh But Sirnex you see I have never claimed to have any answers.
I just believe God does.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 07:01 AM
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Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by sirnex
 





If you want to seek the answers to reality, reserve humility and understand that you don't have the answers, no matter how much you lie to yourself and those around you. You can be truly brave, or you can hypocritical call others a coward. Life is your choice, choose true knowledge over arrogant bigotry


Ahhh But Sirnex you see I have never claimed to have any answers.
I just believe God does.


And there is the problem.


You have strayed far from the path to knowledge.


Just as you and I don't both give thanks to Ra every morning, should be the same reason we don't assume any other deity. Assumptions don't bring truths.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 07:04 AM
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reply to post by sirnex
 





Assumptions don't bring truths.


Hmm I do concur.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 07:06 AM
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This is such a fun discussion. I really want to thank the Christian representatives of Christ in this thread for completely ignoring my posts. It reminds my why your religion is sooooo appealing to begin with.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 07:14 AM
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Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by sirnex
 





Assumptions don't bring truths.


Hmm I do concur.


And yet you assume the validity of your deity as being more true than Ra or Osiris. Do you really concur, or do you dismiss according to personal opinion of how you think it ought to be?



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 07:37 AM
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reply to post by sirnex
 


Sirnex You're the one blowing the" path to knowledge "out your hole.
You tell me.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 07:58 AM
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reply to post by randyvs
 



To claim there is no God. Is claiming full knowledge of the universe. Having full knowledge of the universe would make you God. When someone says God does not exist. They are really saying. I am God.

1. Claiming no god does not mean claiming full knowledge of the universe.
2. Having full knowledge of the universe does not make you god.

So maybe you think that assuming a universal negative makes a person god? Is that it? Had I known it was that easy.

So if god is not revealed in this part of the universe and lives in another part of the universe do you want people to say, God does not exist for all practical purposes?

Atheists are cowards now? Are people that believe in god without evidence delusional? Maybe.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 08:00 AM
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Originally posted by randyvs
Or perhaps you just don't recognise. Atheists don't really have a way of explaining existence do they? No way to ridicule, or mock, or insult them is there? Yet they're always the first to insult, mock, ridicule those that at least have the guts to believe in something that does explain existence.
I think that is cowardly.



Atheists may not have any need or desire to have an explanation for existence. In my case, I'm fine with not knowing for now and hoping one day we will.

I find atheists that engage in disrespectful discourse do themselves a disservice. I'm not certain it's cowardice as much as it is arrogance. Even though you and I have differences I don't believe I've ridiculed you, and if I've insulted you it certainly wasn't intentional. It would be best if everyone here could operate in a spirit of respect for each other. After all, these are just ideas we're haggling over....



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 08:07 AM
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reply to post by novastrike81
 


I don't see the bible as being anything other than a story. It teaches morals, but sounds more like the actions of a person and not a god. There is no archaeological evidence for exodus. No evidence of huge numbers of Hebrew slaves in Egypt. No evidence of a huge number of people leaving Egypt. No evidence for a large number of people living in the Sinai. No evidence for sieges of the cities. Rather the fall of the cities appears to be due to internal strife, rather than a siege waged from outside the cities. Noah's flood is not exactly a good way to start over. You'd think a god could have come up with a better way to restart things.

I do agree that the OT covers the full range of emotions from genocidal fury to love.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 09:02 AM
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Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by sirnex
 


Sirnex You're the one blowing the" path to knowledge "out your hole.
You tell me.


Why does truth cause you to lash out with so much negativity?

You can walk down the path of knowledge with your eyes closed and see many hallucinations as being true. Following these assumed truths leads you astray, off the path to knowing reality. You follow a path of arrogant bigotry, and your reaping the reward of negativity.

You tell me you agree that assumptions don't make truths, whilst believing in an assumption born of personal opinion of how you think things ought to be.

Your walking the path with your eyes closed, tripping along the way. Cursing and insulting those trying to help you to open your eyes, to see for the first time in your life. Your not angry with me, your angry with yourself, because you fear what the path may show you.

-Don't be afraid, I'm here for you.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 09:22 AM
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Originally posted by sirnex
Your walking the path with your eyes closed, tripping along the way. Cursing and insulting those trying to help you to open your eyes, to see for the first time in your life. Your not angry with me, your angry with yourself, because you fear what the path may show you.


Certainly we can't expect an ATS conversion over to non-belief. If one wishes to confront the religious believer, the best way to approach it is by encouraging more scientific thinking. Certainly, the bible enthusiast must operate with a certain amount of cognitive dissonance, as science has disproven many biblical claims and some stories are clearly residing in fantasy and allegory. With enough scientific thinking the hardcore zealot will recognize those areas and hopefully begin approaching things differently.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 09:39 AM
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Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by sirnex
Your walking the path with your eyes closed, tripping along the way. Cursing and insulting those trying to help you to open your eyes, to see for the first time in your life. Your not angry with me, your angry with yourself, because you fear what the path may show you.


Certainly we can't expect an ATS conversion over to non-belief. If one wishes to confront the religious believer, the best way to approach it is by encouraging more scientific thinking. Certainly, the bible enthusiast must operate with a certain amount of cognitive dissonance, as science has disproven many biblical claims and some stories are clearly residing in fantasy and allegory. With enough scientific thinking the hardcore zealot will recognize those areas and hopefully begin approaching things differently.


Yet, we do this and see this many times on ATS. The religious zealots only lash back with negativity. Perhaps preaching in a way they can more easily understand is the better approach as some people fear what they can't begin to understand. Science is certainly a complex series of knowledge that is not easily comprehended by all.

Rather than saying, except this or be ignorant.... Maybe we should extend our hand, show them their hypocrisy. Break down their mental barriers with the same techniques used to build them. Makes sense to me. Fight fire with fire, right?

[edit]

Just look at how it shut him up. He can't respond because he knows I'm right.

[edit on 21-5-2010 by sirnex]



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 10:11 AM
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Originally posted by sirnex
Rather than saying, except this or be ignorant.... Maybe we should extend our hand, show them their hypocrisy. Break down their mental barriers with the same techniques used to build them. Makes sense to me. Fight fire with fire, right?


To a large extent I agree, but I believe a gentle and respectful approach achieves better outcomes. It's better to point out things such as that rainbows are not a covenant of god and that demons do not cause disease than it is to illustrate what a hypocrite someone is for their faith. It's a tedious and long process but better than creating a swamp full of muck to wade through on the journey to truth.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 10:37 AM
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Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by sirnex
Rather than saying, except this or be ignorant.... Maybe we should extend our hand, show them their hypocrisy. Break down their mental barriers with the same techniques used to build them. Makes sense to me. Fight fire with fire, right?


To a large extent I agree, but I believe a gentle and respectful approach achieves better outcomes. It's better to point out things such as that rainbows are not a covenant of god and that demons do not cause disease than it is to illustrate what a hypocrite someone is for their faith. It's a tedious and long process but better than creating a swamp full of muck to wade through on the journey to truth.


It's not so much to point out the hypocrisy, it's more like... Teaching them to think for themselves, and as you said, gently and respectfully. Without the need of saying if you don't believe in science then your an ignorant fool. Case in point, not everything science professes is true to reality, so I see no requirement to indoctrinate them into that system.

By pointing out the illogical conclusion of denouncing one deity whilst assuming another to be more valid and all without evidence, I'm hoping they will begin to think for themselves. If there is any true hypocrisy going on, it's their negativity towards those who denounce all mythology as being valid as their mythology of choice preaches the opposite of negativity.

randyvs has a lot to learn about his deity of choice. He doesn't lash out at us, he lashes out at himself.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 05:56 PM
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reply to post by sirnex
 





Why does truth cause you to lash out with so much negativity?

You can walk down the path of knowledge with your eyes closed and see many hallucinations as being true. Following these assumed truths leads you astray, off the path to knowing reality. You follow a path of arrogant bigotry, and your reaping the reward of negativity.

You tell me you agree that assumptions don't make truths, whilst believing in an assumption born of personal opinion of how you think things ought to be.

Your walking the path with your eyes closed, tripping along the way. Cursing and insulting those trying to help you to open your eyes, to see for the first time in your life. Your not angry with me, your angry with yourself, because you fear what the path may show you.

-Don't be afraid, I'm here for you.

See this is just table flipping Sirnex. You would do far more good saying all of this into a mirror.




Just look at how it shut him up. He can't respond because he knows I'm right.

You sound like some shot caller Sirnex.

You all done now? When have you ever known me as unable to respond.

You're just way down on the priority list. The only reason you get any retort at all is because you,re comical. All the bombastic bloating in the world won't make you right Sirnex. Like it or not Gods word will be with you, your whole life and long after that. The fact that Gods word is indestructible, always has been always will be, burns your britches.
Gods word will never pass away Sirnex. It will be here long after you have stopped kicking yourself for missing your chance to worship your maker.
Not Ra, but the God of the Isrealites. Ancient of Days. The one true God.
There is only one truth Sirnex.
You will remember how I did ever thing I could to makes you see with your mind not just your eyes. You will most likely hate yourself in the end.
You will know what you have missed out on and it won't be easy for you.
No I like my shoes just fine. There's to much at risk walking in your shoes.
Simply because I know I don't know it all. I look to God.

[edit on 21-5-2010 by randyvs]



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 06:06 PM
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reply to post by randyvs
 


Yet, you do nothing but prove my point. Your path of so called truth is bringing nothing but negative connotations from you. Is that what your deity of choice teaches you to do? To be rude, belittle, to insult? Why would anyone accept your "truth" or your path when negativity is all it shows?

Walking the path of knowledge with negativity is like walking in the dark with your eyes closed to reality. One can only navigate the path of knowledge with their eyes open to the positive light of reality.

Negativity brings strife and death.
Positivity brings love and life.

Do you not agree with this?



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 06:38 PM
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reply to post by sirnex
 


I'm positive there is a God. Is that what you mean sir.


You're really somethin.
you must be about warn out waiting for me all day, While I slept.

Blah blah blah the path blah of numbage.

[edit on 21-5-2010 by randyvs]



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 06:47 PM
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reply to post by randyvs
 


I don't mean positive in assumed arrogance, and you know that. Again, your negativity crops up in the discussion. Is this all you know? All you can do? Again, I have to wonder, is this what your deity of choice teaches you is the correct way to live? To always be negative towards others?



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