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Mexican Cartel Violence- Congressional Testimony

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posted on May, 17 2010 @ 10:26 PM
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The following are testimonies from “Drug Trafficking Violence in Mexico: Implications for the U.S.” that took place in Congressional hearings on Wednesday, May 5, 2010.

drugcaucus.senate.gov...

I post the following so members will get better educated how some of our top officials view and dealing with the violence along the border. I have posted some texts of interest to help show the US involvement in Mexico's war against the cartels and what they are doing along the border.

Hope members read the whole testimonies. Very eye opening IMO.


Ambassador David T. Johnson, Assistant Secretary of State


Historically, efforts to thwart the unhindered operation of criminal organizations have sometimes resulted in increased violence and brutality. This happened in Italy when the government went full force after the Italian mafia in the 1980s and 1990s, as well as in Medellin, Colombia in the 1990’s. The U.S. and Mexico both consider the current unstable situation urgent and critical and both our governments are taking significant measures to counter the threat together in Mexico.



The strategy that we are pushing with the Government of Mexico is an effective long-term program, but it is not a temporary “quick-fix”. It is an ambitious effort that will address long-lasting problems. Since the advent of the Merida Initiative in 2007, the U.S.-Mexican relationship has developed, matured and evolved. We have moved away from strict deliveries of equipment and have moved more into institution and capacity building. As partners we have developed a framework for our cooperation that has four key objectives.


drugcaucus.senate.gov...

Donald L. Reay
Executive Director
Texas Border Sheriff’s Coalition


I would submit to you that the highly visible, patrol centric activities
combined with a mobile enforcement team in the United States has been a
visible deterrent to containing the majority of the violence at our border.
Further, I would submit to you that the violators of that gruesome violence
in Mexico know that the resistance by law enforcement in the United States
is much different than what they encounter in Mexico.



The list for asylum victims grows as people flee the violence in Mexico; this
too has an impact on our nation as we extend our sympathy to those in need.
However, our system is not designed to handle the volume of cases that
grows day by day.



There need not be blood in the streets of America for us to take a proactive
stance against the threat of violence. I would submit that cross border
violence is limited because law enforcement has taken that stance and their
increased, highly visible presence, has kept that cross border violence in
check.



The Texas Border Sheriffs in consensus, but not unanimity, objected to the Merida Initiative because there were no sanctions for money that was not used for which it was intended. This was confirmed in a conference call with Department of
State and Department of Homeland Security representatives. Therefore, our
recommendation is to contain violence at our border first and then carefully
administer monetary aid while a nation works to change works to change
this institutionalized corruption.


drugcaucus.senate.gov...



Anthony P. Placido
Assistant Administrator for Intelligence
Drug Enforcement Administration

Kevin L. Perkins
Assistant Director, Criminal Investigative Division
Federal Bureau of Investigation


The vast majority of bulk currency interdicted within the U.S. is derived from
drug trafficking activities. It is estimated that approximately 18-39 billion dollars annually is moved from the interior of the U.S. to the Southwest Border on behalf of Mexican and Colombian DTOs. Thus, billions of U.S. dollars are sent back to Mexico annually. From the Mexican perspective, the flow of vast sums of money engenders corruption.



For all of these reasons, the U.S. and Mexican governments share the responsibility to defeat the threat of drug-trafficking.



While it may seem counterintuitive, the extraordinary level of violence in Mexico is another signpost of successful law-and-order campaigns by military and law enforcement officials in Mexico.



Much of the risk of spillover violence is posed by younger-generation traffickers whose approach to the drug trade is less rational and profit-minded than that of their “elders,” or by multi-national street and prison gangs working in concert with Mexican cartels as enforcers and street-level drug distributors.



It is imperative that we sustain the positive momentum by
supporting President Calderon’s heroic efforts against organized crime. We must also manage expectations, as we anticipate that the gruesome violence in Mexico may get worse before it gets better. We must recognize that we are witnessing acts of true desperation: the actions of wounded, vulnerable, and dangerous criminal organizations.


drugcaucus.senate.gov...

Leonard Miranda, Captain
Chula Vista Police Department


Region-wide, our analysis tells us that because of the stepped up drug enforcement, on both sides of the border, and the resulting difficulty in moving narcotics across the border, many criminal organizations have shifted their focus to the lucrative trade of kidnapping and extortion as another source of income. Intelligence data reveals that the majority of kidnap incidents go unreported.7 The reluctance to report kidnappings and extortion is because of the fear of retaliation by the kidnap cells and a culturally ingrained distrust of law enforcement; making it
difficult for law enforcement to gauge the full magnitude of the problem and the profits gained by the cartels to fund their operations.



While the continued violence in Mexico is understandably troubling and often
disheartening it should not be a surprise. Recent, comprehensive reviews of studies indicate that the increased violence is a predictable outcome when government and law enforcement crack down on organized crime “drug-related violence and high homicide rates are likely a natural consequence.”8 The grip of the cartels is loosening on the government and country of Mexico. As powerful and successful bosses are taken out, it is common for brutal, less sophisticated criminal to fill the void.


drugcaucus.senate.gov...

Janice Ayala- ICE Testimony

Sorry, unable to copy text.




posted on May, 17 2010 @ 10:37 PM
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Thank you for this informative post. S & F

Will be reading in more detail. Thanks for helping to

deny ignorance!



posted on May, 17 2010 @ 10:52 PM
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so basically what Ambassador Johnson
is saying is that they are afraid of tackling
the border drug problem cause it might
include reprisals from the Mexican Cartels
and they cited the Italian Mafia of the 80's and 90's
as an example.

Since when has an American alphabet soup
agency wet their pants in fright from a
drug kingpin???



posted on May, 17 2010 @ 10:56 PM
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reply to post by boondock-saint
 


--------------------------------------------

Maybe he's heard about "El Chapo's reputation for dealing with
uncontrollable politicians and law enforcement which is for them to either accept "a bribe or a bullet".

El Chapo's profile at Wikipedia:

en.wikipedia.org...


There is a discussion of him on ATS here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...









[edit on 17-5-2010 by manta78]



posted on May, 17 2010 @ 11:00 PM
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Another hearing to keep an eye on.


U.S.-Mexico Security Cooperation:
Next Steps for the Merida Initiative
Thursday, May 27, 2010


Manta- Thank you.

Boondock- OK, that's one interpretation. Realistically, do you really believe this problem is confined to the border?



posted on May, 17 2010 @ 11:33 PM
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Originally posted by manta78
Maybe he's heard about "El Chapo's reputation for dealing with
uncontrollable politicians and law enforcement which is for them to either accept "a bribe or a bullet".

well do what they did with Bin Laden

put a $25M bounty on his head
and some crazy mexican will
come thru ..... end of El Sapo



posted on May, 17 2010 @ 11:35 PM
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reply to post by jam321
 


There's a lot of reading/watching there jam321. Thanks for posting it. Without studying the whole pile, it's a little premature for me to comment on this...however a lack of knowledge has never stopped me before


After dealing, first hand with deep problems in a society (Iraq) I can tell you there is often a steep disconnect between what is observed and actioned upon in the filed and its interpretation in Washington. Some of this testimony sounds an awful lot like career-preserve-speak.

I am totally on board with the realization the drug war in Mexico is indeed a dire and imminent threat to our security. One would have to be blind or completely stupid to disregard it. Ergo, the lack of attention in the MSM.

Targeting these s***heads in Mexico is not exactly rocket science. However, gaining the political will to make it happen is often much more of a struggle then the trigger pulling itself. I for one believe a US military presence in Mexico is not a completely bad idea. Heck, the food is way better than Afghanistan.



posted on May, 17 2010 @ 11:43 PM
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Maybe someone can expand on this and explain it for me...

Mexico has a fairly large standing army...they are well armed and trained...with such large widespread issues with the cartels, and the lack of response, why the hell don't they use them!? Is the matter based on corruption?

The police don't seem to be making much headway into the issues, and with the cartels being so vast and wide in the country, conflicting with local law and corruption, if any, or lack of ability, it should be justifiable to use said military to attempt to root out and stop this trend.

Mexico doesn't seem to be helping itself out, instead, throwing up it's arms and proclaiming "We have a problem, and can't seem to fix it...oh well."



posted on May, 17 2010 @ 11:53 PM
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Originally posted by boondock-saint

Originally posted by manta78
Maybe he's heard about "El Chapo's reputation for dealing with
uncontrollable politicians and law enforcement which is for them to either accept "a bribe or a bullet".

well do what they did with Bin Laden

put a $25M bounty on his head
and some crazy mexican will
come thru ..... end of El Sapo


---------------------------

Well there is already a $5 million dollar bounty now for his capture as placed by the U S government. For someone who is a multi-billionaire, and extremely violent however, that seems kind of low to me


It would probably take at least that much to get anywhere near him, so that is not really providing any incentive for profit if someone was so inclined towards that goal.




[edit on 18-5-2010 by manta78]



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 12:01 AM
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reply to post by ABNARTY
 


I can tell you there is often a steep disconnect between what is observed and actioned upon in the filed and its interpretation in Washington. Some of this testimony sounds an awful lot like career-preserve-speak.


Some probably is. But the chief and the sheriff seem legit and they are down on the border. I agree with the sheriff about the Merida Initiative.

If you think about, Congress use to threaten withdrawing aid to Mexico if they didn't do something about the stuff coming into the US.

Suddenly, it became here's your money.


Heck, the food is way better than Afghanistan.



You know that Uncle Sam doesn't let the military do its job.



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 12:06 AM
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reply to post by FrostForests
 


Mexico has a fairly large standing army...they are well armed and trained...with such large widespread issues with the cartels, and the lack of response, why the hell don't they use them!? Is the matter based on corruption?


One of the gangs Los Zetas came from the military. As far as well trained, that is debatable.


THE US Defence Department has estimated Mexico's two most deadly drug cartels have a combined strength of more than 100,000 foot soldiers, an army that rivals Mexico's armed forces and threatens to turn the country into a narco-state.


www.theaustralian.com.au...

If they use too much force they get criticized by human rights.


The police don't seem to be making much headway into the issues, and with the cartels being so vast and wide in the country, conflicting with local law and corruption, if any, or lack of ability, it should be justifiable to use said military to attempt to root out and stop this trend.


Since 2006 they have extradited about 250 people to US. Some major bosses. Many other bosses killed. But there will always be someone there to fill the void.


Mexico doesn't seem to be helping itself out, instead, throwing up it's arms and proclaiming "We have a problem, and can't seem to fix it...oh well."


We can't blame it all Mexico. Our government is right there in it all.



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 12:11 AM
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Originally posted by jam321
If you think about, Congress use to threaten withdrawing aid to Mexico if they didn't do something about the stuff coming into the US.


That could be said about alot of serious issues, people and countries. It may take a while, sometimes less than you would expect, but absolutely stopping the gears of a machine, halting entire economies, after a while a people will solve the problem themselves for their and their people's livelihood.



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 12:17 AM
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We can't blame it all Mexico. Our government is right there in it all.


Of course, but my question is are there movements in Mexico to fight these factions within by the common people, or do they accept this as an inevitability in the sense that they can't or won't choose to do something about it?



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 05:16 AM
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Originally posted by FrostForests


We can't blame it all Mexico. Our government is right there in it all.


Of course, but my question is are there movements in Mexico to fight these factions within by the common people, or do they accept this as an inevitability in the sense that they can't or won't choose to do something about it?


I'm mexican 100% and let me tell you i visit about every 2 years and from what i have heard all the people know that it's all out of control and even if they want to do something it's too late now, having been there you can't imagine the power these guys have in there, driving new cars running red lights in front of the police, taking pictures at night clubs with their guns out and no one does anything, why? because they can't BUT most of them don't mess with you if you don't mess with them and of course there is the occasional guy that abuses his power, also from what i have heard all the mexican military "avoids" el Chapo's cartel or the Sinaloa cartel, they are all paid and given orders to attack the other cartels.



[edit on 5/18/2010 by Aztek87]



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 08:19 AM
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reply to post by FrostForests
 



Of course, but my question is are there movements in Mexico to fight these factions within by the common people, or do they accept this as an inevitability in the sense that they can't or won't choose to do something about it?


One group, La Familia claim to be religious and fighting other cartels. However, they are branded by the government as cartels.

Of course, they may have started as vigilantes but ultimately may have succumb to the greed of the money.

As far as the rest of the people, some cartels are intimidating them, while others see the cartels as Robin Hoods. Remember, most of Mexico's citizens are not allowed to have guns. They need special permits from the government in order to have arms.


"Our fight is with the federal police because they are attacking our families," the voice said calmly while Knapp stared worriedly at the camera. "If someone attacks my father, my mother or my brother, then they are going to hear from me ... If they only act against us, then we will respect them."

The chilling call appears to be the latest attempt to take the moral high ground by a quasi-religious drug cartel that has become one of the most dangerous threats to Mexican security forces


www.time.com...


One such group called the Popular Anti-Drugs Army materialized among farming towns in the southern state of Guerrero.

Displaying blankets with written messages on bridges and buildings, the group claimed to be made up of family men who had come together to force drug dealers off the street.

"We invite the people to join our struggle and defend our children who are the future of Mexico," it said on one of the blankets.

The group has been linked to several killings, including the decapitation of an alleged drug dealer in December.

Following stories of that slaying, readers hailed the efforts in some Mexican media outlets.

"My sincerest congratulations to these brave men with their courage and determination," wrote a reader of Mexican newspaper Milenio. "God help them with their noble cause."


www.huffingtonpost.com...



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 08:23 AM
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reply to post by Aztek87
 



having been there you can't imagine the power these guys have in there, driving new cars running red lights in front of the police, taking pictures at night clubs with their guns out and no one does anything, why? because they can't BUT most of them don't mess with you if you don't mess with them and of course there is the occasional guy that abuses his power, also from what i have heard all the mexican military "avoids" el Chapo's cartel or the Sinaloa cartel, they are all paid and given orders to attack the other cartels.


Fear is a powerful thing. I know many people here in the US say that they would do this or that if this was to ever happen in the US. But to be honest, I think most would be too scared to do anything.

Just look at some the US neighborhoods that have been taken over by gangs. Where are the vigilantes? A lot of people residing in those neighborhoods are afraid of the gangs and their retaliation.



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 09:25 AM
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OP - Great post! This is info everyone needs to be aware of. I love how the situation is constantly downplayed. I read a post somewhere, can't find it, about how US National parks are being overrun with hidden growing plots, and people are being threatened by armed men guarding them. But of course You've never heard about this is the msm.

Again, excellent post!



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 08:19 PM
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reply to post by Survivorman
 


Appreciate the comment.

I can't help but wonder what role the CIA iis playing in all of this. I know there was a thread covering this recently but I can't seem to locate it. Awhile back Napolitano had said we had troops in there, but Mexico denied this.



posted on May, 18 2010 @ 08:23 PM
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reply to post by Survivorman
 


------------------------------------------------------------

Well here's an article from the net on that problem:

"November 13, 2008
Mexican Gangsters Converting America's National Parks Into Gigantic Marijuana Patches"

www.vdare.com...



[edit on 18-5-2010 by manta78]



posted on May, 19 2010 @ 11:29 AM
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reply to post by manta78
 


Hey thanks for finding that! Yeah that's the problem I was talking about. Scary stuff and just goes to show it's already inside our borders.





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