The Euro bombed to oblivion?, page 1

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Topic started on 14-5-2010 @ 01:59 PM by diakrite

The Euro collapse: A working form of warfare without bombs?

The Euro vanquished: ideas and musings

From Washington Post:

Sell-off continues on Wall Street, following Europe's lead
UPDATED at noon:
The big stock sell-off continues on Wall Street as trading hits mid-day. This is turning into an end-of-the-week rout, thanks to continued worries about European debt and stability of the euro.

link:voices.washingtonpost.com...

To be honest, I smell a rat here. The press is too "gloaty" describing the troubles with the Euro (of which the Northern Europeans. oddly enough, feel preciously little. They are not as dependent on exports to America, as America is dependent on export to Europe. Apparently Europe is fairly self-sufficient, if only for the fact that they are not as dependent on the outside world's resources as America seems to be)

Picture this scenario:

-Goldman&Sachs "help" Greece keep their dysmal economics under wraps for the Euro commission. The Euro does remarkably well. The Euro jumps from $0,89 in the infancy of the monetary union, to $1,50 at a certain point, basically because Europe still produces stuff inside their borders, and have the smooth infrastructure to get it around. With all this succes came the "dangerous" assertion that f.i. single-payer, public-option healthcare seemed to work and that these "commie" states in Northern Europe did pretty well. A meme that frightened a lot of TPTB to the bone.

-Greece joins the Euro-zone under false bookkeeping (again, aided by the sociopath brains at G&S).

Does not seem to be related....until, suddenly, Greece is "unmasked" and the Euro plummets.

What if..and just "what if" Greece was a satchel-charge, or "Debt-charge" (heh..), primed by invisible, but very powerful financial moguls, to blow the Euro out of the water, if push would come to shove? A well-crafted, carefully prepared form of "Economic terrorism" or, if you like, "blitzkrieg"

-The Euro was getting bloody expensive and too important world-wide.
Slowly, but surely, Arab oil-producers started eye-ing the Euro as a viable determinant of oil-prices, as did a large part of Africa (and do not forget diamonds and gold!!). This, naturally, enraged&panicked the "US$ to oil"-based corporations, that saw their US$ monopolies crumble, let alone the Wallstreet robber-barons that where all invested in Dollars "because the Euro could never get anywhere"

Buut TADAA! Goldman&Sachs to the rescue: They had the detonator in their hands, and pushed it.

Kablooi! Greece almost bankrupt, Euro gone...out of the water. Mega-profits in DOLLARS ensured. And that pesky, rather successful upstart, called "European-Union", eliminated.

Far fetched? I don't think so. Wars with guns and bombs are no longer fought between "civilized" states. Wars nowadays are fought in the shady world of gargantuan financial deals, by bits,bytes, cisco-routers & processor time. No explosions, no apparent deaths .

War&terrorism as "clean" as it gets, yet , still "war" with, as victims perpetually "the common man". A war fought by the elite, this time with computers&programmers as their soldiers, however with still the same purpose: "kill that which you do not like and stands in the way of amassing wealth, and get even richer in the process"

it's just a "what if" scenario. Not something The CIA, NSA, or any other special-intrest defending organisation could come up with. Isn't it?

It is basically the comment i already gave in the WaPo, but I would like to hear some of Your thinking, Your insights.

Am I paranoid? Right on track? Somewhere close? or completely off?

Go ahead. share.

Edited for muddled statements.

[edit on 5/14/2010 by diakrite]

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 02:10 PM by warpcrafter

You're right on track! Anybody who makes money off of money instead of actually producing goods or providing services should be crucified and left for the crows!

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 02:26 PM by buddha

I said same thing like this yesterday.
this is the new future wars.
and this is the first big one.
the euro is a very big threat to America.
but dont forget china!
they have been taping in to computers all over the world.
they could be the one who had a hand in this.
and make it look like some one else.
I still think its America.
china is just a could be.
the bad thing is the money will come out of owe’r pockets.

[edit on 14-5-2010 by buddha]

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 02:35 PM by Gutterpus

Here's a pretty interesting story of how it went down - at least from the standpoint of NPR.

The Greek story starts with a change, a big change, around 10 years ago. For Theopolis Papalostakis(ph), it happened in a meeting. Theopolis is a banker. And one day his manager asked everyone to stay late and announced the euro is coming and that changes everything.

Mr. THEOPOLIS PAPALOSTAKIS (Banker): And one of the things, he said that you should forget what you know. You should forget everything you know about banking. Everything's going to be all new. Soon it's going to be like a supermarket. People will come in and buy all kinds of different things.

www.npr.org...

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 02:36 PM by Maxmars

In order to gain control and maintain a hold on all global wealth and commerce, the people must ASK for it.

These tragic events are, some may say, just the problem for which that solution is wanting.

Those either distantly latched on to, or embedded in, the paradigm of "corporate dogma demands infinite devotion to profit" will defend the 'solution.' But then, that is how they are trained and indoctrinated.

The emergent supranational banking cartel is poised to 'gracefully' accept the 'responsibility.'

It will fall upon the old world to resist this demon... the banking cartel went to great lengths to marginalize the US (by subjugating her representatives)... probably because we would have interfered with their 'solution.'

Sadly, this seems to fall in the category of ambitions to empire... a failing to which a certain class of people seem especially prone.

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 02:38 PM by seamus

I'm wondering if this has anything to do with the fact that many of the US-origin gold bars that have been sold overseas are actually gold-plated Tungsten. China owns a lot of those.

This may have been a last-ditch effort to keep the economies of the world from going off the dollar and onto the Euro.

Al in the context of the "movie" version of reality, of course.

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 03:09 PM by Gutterpus

reply to post by diakrite

I did a little more digging in the NPR article and found that gold old boy from Pimco Scott Mather was at Goldman Sachs prior to joining Pimco. Figures. Those guys have their thumbs in every pocket.
So in late 2009, he sets back in his office while at the Newport Beach Pimco offices and decides (due to the regime change in Greece - cough cough), that we gotta get out of there - and fast. Bam! Shameless.

Mr. Mather is a managing director in the Newport Beach office and head of global portfolio management. Previously, he led portfolio management in Europe, managed euro and pan-European portfolios and worked closely with many Allianz-related companies. He also served as a managing director of Allianz Global Investors KAG. Prior to these roles, Mr. Mather co-headed PIMCO's mortgage and asset-backed securities team. Prior to joining PIMCO in 1998, he was a fixed-income trader specialising in mortgage-backed securities at Goldman Sachs in New York. He has 15 years of investment experience and holds a master's degree in engineering, as well as undergraduate degrees, from the University of Pennsylvania.

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 03:24 PM by Maxmars

reply to post by Gutterpus

Did you ever think that it is almost as if the Banking cartels have their own inbreeding program?

How is it that Goldman Sachs employees pop up in every situation like this? ... Well, maybe that's not fair... it does seem like there is a relatively small community that is embedded in every major aspect of trade and regulation, be it international or otherwise. Then they create these god-forsaken financial vehicles and proceed to exchange them among themselves while others bear the actual risk... funny that....

I used to scoff at the notion that the mega-clubs like the Bilderbergs, the Trilateral Commission, and the Council on Foreign Relations were somehow involved... now, I think that judgment may have been premature.

reply posted on 14-5-2010 @ 03:27 PM by diakrite

reply to post by Maxmars

Hmm..[pondering] Not too far off then?

I have always looked at Europe in wonderment. How could they keep a viable economy going, while doin all that "corporate America" fights with their last breath: Strict rules (compared to Wallstreet, that is). Strict tax enforcement, especially for corporations. "Socialized healthcare" Many forms of child-support, mainly forced through the fear of an aging population, me thinks. All sorts of entitlements like standard scholarships for everyone that wants an university education, unemployment benefit that doesn't stop after a couple of months, leveled incomes .A not too big difference between middle-class and the wealthy class. And to boot, in the northern Countries, hardly ANY poverty (that's the real stunner)

All of that makes the Milton Friedman Chicago school seem like ignoramus incorporated. Could "The Market" not be the panacee for all ailments?? Europe seems to prove that, and it scares the Chicago-School economists to no end, it seems. Plus, corporate America is, naturally, scared sh!tless of European-style control on their wheeling&dealing. The whupping Almighty Microsoft recieved from that Euro-lady (can't remember her name, a former Dutch politician I believe) over the "Browser-Choice" still makes them wake-up in cold sweat.

Isn't it amazing, that the only country in Europe that truly follows capitalism "less control, let the markets fix themselves", namely Great Britain went down the drain faster than anyone could have fathomed? The sterling went from €1,70 in 2004(!!) to less than €1,20 today, with an ultimate low of €1,11?

Having worked in Europe for quite some time, I am still baffled how relaxed Main land Europeans are about the crisis, while America and Great Britain rile in true panic.
I also got used to the European Philosophy of "frugalism" and saving. I no longer use a credit-card for anything else than Internet purchases. In real life I use a debit-card. i drive a 43mpg European car. I got a healthy savings account with a European bank that has branched out to America. Europe is fairly expensive tax-wise though(think $8.- gas with 60% of it taxes!!) So, all entitlements look as if they are paid for ,as far as I could see.
Northern Europeans mutter for a bit, but pay taxes regardless. It is a totally different mindset it seems. In general I found working Europeans to be utterly relaxed people ,compared to Americans, caught in the rat-race...

I am even more baffled at the amount of money itty, bitty, tiny countries like The Netherlands:317x80mls... (€ 5,000,000,000.-!!! wow..) and Belgium, are able to pump in Greece, to prop-up the Greek economy against the , let's just call it for what it is, "War on The Euro-Zone"

Do Wallstreet and TPTB think Northern Europe is too rich and independant for comfort? Seems like it.

Unnerving enough apparently to try and kill this whole "United Europe" off before it becomes too powerful.

[edited for utterly moronic typo's]

[edit on 5/14/2010 by diakrite]

[edit on 5/14/2010 by diakrite]

[edit on 5/14/2010 by diakrite]

reply posted on 16-5-2010 @ 07:59 PM by Truther45

That's why you should buy gold, so your currencies don't crash

reply posted on 18-5-2010 @ 04:09 AM by LieBuster

Trouble is that if the euro or the pound or the USD goes into meltdown, they all meltdown because these three are so interdependant on each other.

Here in the UK it looks like Labour has been cooking the books more than normal and the national debt is much higher then thought and yet the market carries on as nothing has happened because those in the casino don't know or care whats happening in the streets outside.

They bloody well will know when the lights go out, come back on and all the chips have been changed to amro's

You can no longer apply logic to the markets, too much beer been drunk.

reply posted on 28-11-2011 @ 10:22 AM by diakrite

Old thread, I know, but it seems I was right after all, given the " sudden" rise of rating agencies prophetizig doom&gloom towards Europe.
And, mind You, all that while we overhere are looking at a dysmally inneffectual government, marred in partizan bickering and only busy gathering funds for their re-election, unemployment figures that make Northern-europe look like they have none whatsoever -in comparison, that is.

Unrest in the shape of OCW, making the elite quite nervous, it seems.

Interesting times.

edit on 11/28/2011 by diakrite because: Typo

reply posted on 28-11-2011 @ 01:24 PM by Cassius666

Europe is very dependet on outside resources. The Germans dont dig up all those raw materials that go into an audi from their backyard.

reply posted on 28-11-2011 @ 09:09 PM by Cassius666

Also it does not matter what coin is used. It has been said in the OP, many countries are economically sound and still export stuff in great volumes. Money is just the tool for the underlying economy.

HOWEVER, what is going to happen with a single currency, is that strong countries will be dragged down by not so strong countries. Imagine America, each state with its own money and its own economy. You have economic powerhouses and states that barely export or produce anything, which are more or less on the level of the poorest European countries. That is what Europe was like before the Euro and I guess communism was to blame too.

Naturally the strongest countries will see the Euro as a detriment, such as Germany aand, well, Germany. They mingle their economy with countries who have a much weaker export.

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