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Tokyo Grows Wary Of China Military

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posted on May, 14 2010 @ 12:20 AM
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Tokyo Grows Wary Of China Military


[url=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703950804575242173915390024.html?mod=WSJ_World_LEFTSecondNews#articleTabs%3Darticle]online.wsj.com[ /url]

TOKYO—Japan's foreign minister expressed concern about China's growing military muscle—a development he said raised the urgency for Washington and Tokyo to resolve their standoff over where to station U.S. troops in Japan.

"I wouldn't use the word 'threat'—but we certainly will need to watch very carefully the nuclear arsenal and naval capabilities of China," Katsuya Okada said in an interview Thursday with The Wall Street Journal. "And it is because of this that, all the more, the Japan-U.S. alliance would be important."
(visit the link for the full news article)



[edit on 14/5/2010 by ironfalcon]




posted on May, 14 2010 @ 12:20 AM
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Certainly Japan has every right to be concerned about the Chinese PLA's military buildup, although Japan can only act in self-defense if attacked. It must avoid being the aggressor, to prevent a revival of its pre-WWII militarism.

It is the same globalist elite that has allowed China to build up its military to an extent that it would rival the United States for control of the Asia-Pacific region.



[url=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703950804575242173915390024.html?mod=WSJ_World_LEFTSecondNews#articleTabs%3Darticle]online.wsj.com[ /url]
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 01:21 AM
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So, just for the record...If anything were to happen between US and China...I'm thinking we might easily be taken down. Just a hunch, and I don't even know if China would attack us...but their country is huge, and their population is outstanding as well. It probably wouldn't bear great for us.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 02:27 AM
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reply to post by philosearcher
 


I agree, China is basically the strongest power on the earth now, america's days of supremacy are over, if china decides to finish you, i'd be buying a helicopter and flying to international waters.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 09:15 AM
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Originally posted by rajaten
reply to post by philosearcher
 


I agree, China is basically the strongest power on the earth now, america's days of supremacy are over, if china decides to finish you, i'd be buying a helicopter and flying to international waters.


How would China be able to finish them off exactly?

You think any nuclear capable country is going to willingly face annihilation & not decide to whip out the nukes & take the Chinese with them.

Exact same if it was the other way around, if the US were stomping all over the Chinese & they were about to be shamed, they would use nukes.

China might have more man-power & the economy to fight wars, but the US has decades of black projects up their sleeve & I'd be willing to bet they would be far, far, far superior to anything the Chinese have at their disposal.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 09:50 AM
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Originally posted by rajaten
reply to post by philosearcher
 


I agree, China is basically the strongest power on the earth now, america's days of supremacy are over, if china decides to finish you, i'd be buying a helicopter and flying to international waters.




The USA's navy is the size of the next 5 or 6 largest navys in the world and three of them are allies.

The USA plans to have a 20-1 advanced jet fighter ratio to the next largest airforce by 2020 and currently is still in the lead.

China has no way to move a million+ PLA over the pacific to the USAs shore making thier vast numbers useless.

The USA has the most combat experience and knowledge to draw on.

China is a paper tiger on offence and a juggernaught on defense.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 10:33 AM
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reply to post by philosearcher
 


Just because China has massive numbers does not make them superior. What good is their military if they can't project their force except locally? What good can they do if US carriers sit far enough that Chinese fighters can't get to but US carrier fighters can get to China?

Currently US has the advantage of having the superior technology and force projection. But that may soon be moot. China is quickly catching up. Their only Achilles heel is lack of carriers. For the past two decades, China has been desperately working on their own carrier and buying/developing weapons to counter US carriers.

Dangerous thing about China is they are patient and focus on long-term goals. Give them 5 to 10 years and they will rival US.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 10:45 AM
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In the 21st century no superpower can go to war with each other, both would end up a smoldering ruin at the end of the day. So debating who would win in regards to China,Japan USA, Russia etc etc is pointless. The wars being fought these days are much more subtle than a military conflict.

[edit on 14-5-2010 by Solomons]



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 10:48 AM
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Japan so needs to come up off of their Peace Constitution and get 200 or so nukes immediately.

It should be obvious to them that America is not run by adults, and that if they the Japanese wish to have their interests served they had better take care of themselves.

I don't understand why every Japanese media outlet isn't screaming WE NEED NUCLEAR WEAPONS all day every day, really I don't.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 10:54 AM
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I don't understand why every Japanese media outlet isn't screaming WE NEED NUCLEAR WEAPONS all day every day, really I don't.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uh. I think some reading of history might shed some light on that!
Speaking of history, if I were China, I wouldn't be to thrilled about a re arming of Japan considering their track record. Japan is still a nationalist culture with an air of superiority. I can't blame China for keeping on it's toes regarding Japan.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 10:54 AM
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I don't understand why every Japanese media outlet isn't screaming WE NEED NUCLEAR WEAPONS all day every day, really I don't.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uh. I think some reading of history might shed some light on that!
Speaking of history, if I were China, I wouldn't be to thrilled about a re arming of Japan considering their track record. Japan is still a nationalist culture with an air of superiority. I can't blame China for keeping on it's toes regarding Japan.



posted on May, 14 2010 @ 10:58 AM
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reply to post by OldDragger
 

Yes, boss, I do remember that part.


But, for example, the Holocaust doesn't stop the Israelis from mistreating the Palestinians...that is the more usual way to read "the lessons of history", to emulate the oppressor, don't you think?

[edit on 14-5-2010 by nine-eyed-eel]



posted on May, 15 2010 @ 12:59 AM
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I understand, and those are great points. My standpoint has changed, however it raises another small question. If China is so strong defensively and have incredible masses, and the U.S. has more military know-how and better offensive powers.....Wouldn't it be possible that if we attacked Chinese soil their mass numbers would wipe out our forces (with strong defensive skills as well) but we would do the same (if we have better overall military knowledge)?

I could just be not thinking of this strait but it just seems to create a giant stalemate. Unless the U.S. surgically takes out major targets in China with either precision missile placement or use of special forces.

edit to remove...

[edit on 5/15/2010 by philosearcher]



posted on May, 15 2010 @ 10:08 AM
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Originally posted by philosearcher
If China is so strong defensively and have incredible masses, and the U.S. has more military know-how and better offensive powers.....Wouldn't it be possible that if we attacked Chinese soil their mass numbers would wipe out our forces (with strong defensive skills as well) but we would do the same (if we have better overall military knowledge)?

I could just be not thinking of this strait but it just seems to create a giant stalemate. Unless the U.S. surgically takes out major targets in China with either precision missile placement or use of special forces.
[edit on 5/15/2010 by philosearcher]


The way war is fought right now, according to the rules of international law, even the US couldn't invade china so yes we have a stalemate. However, if China ever angered the american citizens enough to get them screaming at the government to unleash hell and damn the civilian casualties, the USA could literally bomb china's cities and infrastructure to dust with conventional bombs without a soldier ever setting foot on chinese soil.

I think if the USA ever suffered a domestic attack from a foreign country, like bombing of one or more of the USA's largest cities, the response would be terrifying. All international law would be thrown out the window and the USA would unleash its conventional arsenal without worrying about things like civilian casualties or collateral damage. So in the end it all depends on the ROE the USA sets for itself.



posted on May, 15 2010 @ 10:28 AM
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I think China would have a serious linguistic problem not to metion, food would become an issue real quick for them. The Chinese military helps to keep the rule of law, it is going to be hard for them to fight a war and deal with civil unrest at home. When the war machine starts depleting their depleted food supply...?

Japan and India are in far more imediate danger than the U.S. but, there might be little we could do to help Japan.

The real concern for the U.S. would be all of the Russian allies to the south of us. World War III would be one hell of a quagmire and I think China stands to lose the most - maybe that is enough to keep Japan safe, maybe not.



posted on May, 15 2010 @ 10:55 AM
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Originally posted by onthedownlow
The Chinese military helps to keep the rule of law, it is going to be hard for them to fight a war and deal with civil unrest at home. When the war machine starts depleting their depleted food supply...?


Good point. Most people don't understand how complicated military logistics are, infact they are the most important part of the battle. Food and gas would quickly become unavailable to civilians causing unrest that would really put the PLA to the test. I figure the PLA would abandon certain cities and focus on their more important logistic points and infrastructure leaving millions to fend for themselves. The chinese know how to "cut the fat" when they need to . Inhuman decisions or not they now how to survive and 2000 years of history proves that.


Originally posted by onthedownlow
Japan and India are in far more imediate danger than the U.S. but, there might be little we could do to help Japan.


I think Japans fear stems from the worry of being cut off from all allies. China could surround Japan effectivly stopping food and oil from reaching Japan which in a short period of time will result in the collapse of civil services and order in general. Just like surrounding a castle and starving them out. I don't think China would ever intend to invade Japan because just like WW2 the cost in lives would be staggering and thats why the US made the A bomb.



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 02:41 AM
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Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by philosearcher
If China is so strong defensively and have incredible masses, and the U.S. has more military know-how and better offensive powers.....Wouldn't it be possible that if we attacked Chinese soil their mass numbers would wipe out our forces (with strong defensive skills as well) but we would do the same (if we have better overall military knowledge)?

I could just be not thinking of this strait but it just seems to create a giant stalemate. Unless the U.S. surgically takes out major targets in China with either precision missile placement or use of special forces.
[edit on 5/15/2010 by philosearcher]


The way war is fought right now, according to the rules of international law, even the US couldn't invade china so yes we have a stalemate. However, if China ever angered the american citizens enough to get them screaming at the government to unleash hell and damn the civilian casualties, the USA could literally bomb china's cities and infrastructure to dust with conventional bombs without a soldier ever setting foot on chinese soil.

I think if the USA ever suffered a domestic attack from a foreign country, like bombing of one or more of the USA's largest cities, the response would be terrifying. All international law would be thrown out the window and the USA would unleash its conventional arsenal without worrying about things like civilian casualties or collateral damage. So in the end it all depends on the ROE the USA sets for itself.


So you raise an interesting flag here. You mentioned that all intl. law would be thrown out the window. This is true, and with this said I wonder what that 'breaking point' really is?



posted on May, 21 2010 @ 02:56 AM
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Originally posted by big_BHOY

Originally posted by rajaten
reply to post by philosearcher
 


China might have more man-power & the economy to fight wars, but the US has decades of black projects up their sleeve & I'd be willing to bet they would be far, far, far superior to anything the Chinese have at their disposal.


You're damn right



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