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Teacher Deems American Flag 'Offensive'

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posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:18 AM

Originally posted by darkbake

The separation of church and state is to preserve religion from governmental interference, NOT the other way around.

Read more:

I read that from someone who commented on the Fox news site, about time someone figured that out.

Both ways, actually. Separation of church and state is to preserve religion away from the hands of the government and at the same time protect government from the hands of religion. It's not a one way street.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The United States Supreme Court has clarified (and still upheld this interpretation) most recently as of 1994 in Board of Education of Kiryas Joel Village School District v. Grumet, 512 U.S. 687 where Justice Souter stated in the clarification: "government should not prefer one religion to another, or religion to irreligion."

So its a two way street, it wasn't just made to protect religious institutions, but also protect the institutionalization of religion in federal government.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:28 AM
reply to post by CowPatty

Ya there's something in the water down here in California. It tastes like someone plugged my plumbing up to the local high school swimming pool. So I bought something to test the water, sure enough everything was off the charts. Chlorine was extremely high. Decided to check and see if my city fluoridated the water ... sure did. The fluoridation is so high down here, that I'm getting dental fluorosis (tooth decay from fluoride). I don't even use fluoride toothpaste!

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:30 AM
I have heard about this and read the posted article several times.

Having tried, for most of my life, to live and act in a civilized manner I find it very very very hard to find any "civilized" words which will come close to express my true thoughts on this matter.

The best words I can use concern a deep measure of gratitude that I live about 3000 miles from this school and therefore have very very limitied access to this "teacher". I feel I am taking a good deal of liberties with the use of this term and do not believe this particular person should be thought of as worthy to be called such.

I would suppose the best way I could sum up my feelings in such a case is to repeat that old well worn phrase:


If you have trouble getting your little pea sized mind around this, let me say something which may help you better understand my feelings,


posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:36 AM
I bet $100 that this woman is both an Obama voter and a registered Democrat. Generally, everyone that hates this country is.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:53 AM
reply to post by njl51

I am not sure why any one would be offended by this. We are here for information. The guy,Francis Bellamy,who came up with this salute was a socialist and a nationalist.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:54 AM

Originally posted by Raist
Not that I want to "worship" the flag as some do I do respect the fact that it can be seen as a symbol of America (though a better symbol should be the Constitution). I am not sure how the teacher sees it as offensive unless of course there are many immigrants in the class. If that is the case they should get used to seeing the flag as they are living in the country.

As for the teacher I think maybe she should be deported to some place she finds less offensive.


[edit on 5/10/10 by Raist]

Although you are correct on the worship of the flag and that this country should ALWAYS be called AMERICA, which it IS and as it is NOT the U.S., your statement about the Constitution is wrong.

The Constitution is a CORPORATE DOCUMENT, you and I were NEVER a party to it. ALL laws made under that document APPLY ONLY to 14th Amendment "U.S. citizens", not you and me. WE are free men and need NO document to explain to us what our God given rights are. The Declaration of Independence APPLIES to "We the People". But not the Constitution, I wish you people would understand this.

THIS is why you can not argue the Consitution in ANY court, it does NOT apply to you and the judge knows it as do the lawyers.

The Bill of Rights is seperate and ONLY PROTECTS those rights you are born with in the first place.

As for the Flag, it matters not when it has a gold fringe, burn that one all day long. Without the fringeon it and on a flag pole WITHOUT an eagle or "ball" on top is correct. Do some research people and figure it out, many of us here are getting tired of explaining it.

The 50 states of the Union are known as AMERICA and NOT the U.S.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:58 AM
People have failed to realize that kids are using the flag to promote racism and anti-Latin American attitudes. Just watch the "Mexican knocks flag on ground" video. Those guys in the truck are waving flags and telling the Latino students to go back to Mexico.

It's being used in a hateful way, that's why schools are telling their kids to refrain from depicting it. It'd be like if I took the Confederate Battle Flag into Harlem. By itself, it's just a symbol of the South, but used in that context its a symbol of hatred and racism.

It's all about context.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:00 PM
Whats going on in America today? Our teachers for the most part are great people, but the storys coming out of CA are very disturbing. I am very sick of these type of actions. I do not understand why these actions are being tollerated? What happend to common sense.

Here is my take from hearing this kind of story.

Ok, this teacher reasons that the american flag is a risky subject to drawl. I now know this teacher has not the capacity to make rational choices and I no longer want this teacher teaching our American kids.

What happens when a person who is sick with a cold is in close contact with many people? They get some of those people they were in contact with sick. Now what happens when a teacher who is in very close contact with our children teaches these same sick views ?

Our children...... Some of them will gain these (sick) views.

Sorry fyi for my spelling, I am with out spell check and I am dyslexic so sometimes I get a little off on my spelling with out the checker. Thanks for your understanding.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:00 PM
reply to post by daddio

Deny ignorance much?

Our country is called The United States of America, US or USA for short. Just look at the military uniforms of the North during the Civil War, they all say "US" on them.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:01 PM
I must say I got the goosebumps (in a good way) when I saw that picture on the Fox News website. If it were my child or student, I'd give her a path on the head, not berate her. That was a really beautiful, and heart-warming picture.

As for the teacher, she should be made to apologize. Not only that, but she should be spanked for the "You shouldn't have involved your parents" part.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:07 PM
Its a flag, don't see how its offensive, we live in the us and people should respect the flag if they are going to live here. This teacher is way out of line. I am ashamed of these constant stories I hear coming out of my state of my CA recently.

[edit on 11-5-2010 by jeasahtheseer]

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:09 PM
reply to post by rnaa

What don't you understand about it wasn't the drawing of the American Flag that was the problem. It was the desecration of that flag by writing a motto on it.

Repeat: the student's mistake was to DESECRATE the flag.

The Teacher's mistake was to not make the objection clear to the student or the students parents.

How do you know this to be a fact ? Maybe she was offended by the flag itself. Maybe she was offended by what she deems desecration of the flag. Maybe she meant that the flag could be offensive to other students. Maybe she was offended by the word God.

You keep insisting that everyone else is wrong in their assumption of what exactly it was that this teacher found offensive, that you're assumption is the only correct one. The truth is that unless you are this teacher, or a close confidant you don't know what it was that she found offensive any more than the rest of us do.

This is what we have to go on that leads the greater majority of us to believe that she was offended by the flag itself.....

“She had drawn the flag and was sketching the letters, ‘God bless America,’ when the teacher confronted her,” Hathaway told FOX. “She said, ‘You can’t draw that – that’s offensive.’”

IMO if she had said you can't write that on the flag then I may agree with your opinion of what she found offensive. However she said you can't draw that, that's offensive and that leads me to believe that it was the drawing of the flag that she found offensive.

We are not having knee jerk reactions, we are forming opinions based on the information that we have available to us.

So it's ok for you to make assumptions on what she found offensive without knowing all of the facts, but not us ? Sounds like hypocricy to me.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:11 PM
reply to post by daddio

Please assist me in understanding your last sentance,

"The 50 states of the Union are known as AMERICA and NOT the U.S."

I am having a little trouble figuring out if you are referring to "North America", "Central America", or "South America".

I always thought the term America refered to the continant which was, either correctly or incorrectly, attributed to Christopher Columbus having discovered.

I also thought the title "United States of America" was the name used within the Constitution as the name of our country.

If you could be so kind as to enlighten me about the errors in this line of thinking, I will be eternally greatful. I am accustom to being wrong on many issues and am always pleased to learn the correct manner of things.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:14 PM
I think what irks me the most, if this story in fact wasn't embellished, is the fact that this teacher refused to state why she found the drawing offensive...

I should've prefaced that with the fact that I think she should at the very least be diciplined for this, but this is Kaleeforneeya so prolly not.

Her refusal to at least tell the child why she thought her drawing offensive makes the teacher look more emotionally immature than the students she's supposed to be teaching. That's perhaps the scariest aspect of this, beyond her obvious disdain for the symbol of the country she's teaching in.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:14 PM

Originally posted by niteboy82
Why on Earth are people so wrapped up in this flag? Patriotism? Better think again...

Who cares about the method of offense.. I'm offended as well. When's the last time you picked up a flag in the store and looked at the tag? "Made in China?"

No thanks, I don't need a bit of cloth made in a country completely handicapped in the realm of human dignity and rights to wave around and act like I care about my country that the same China seems hell-bent on buying up and destroying.

I don't know where you get your flags, but the flag that gets raised every morning in my front yard definitely says made in the U.S.A, I don't think I have ever seen an American Flag that says made in China, maybe one of those teacup flags that sits on someones desk. Don't go to Walmart looking for a flag and you won't find that tag.

Every country has a flag. A flag is a symbol of respect and pride, the flag shows people what we represent, it's a sign of our nation, China has nothing to do with it.

[edit on 11-5-2010 by milkmustache]

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:31 PM
reply to post by niteboy82

The flag being discussed here was MADE IN AMERICA. By an American girl in art class.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:36 PM
reply to post by Sparky63

She needs to lose her job because of the fact that she told a student that she shouldn't have gotten her parents involved in the matter.

When she did that she was attempting to undermine the family bonds and the rights of the parents to be aware of what happens to their child. Nobody should ever tell a child to keep something from their parents and that they were wrong to inform their parents of something, especially a teacher.

A teacher should be teaching the subjects in the school curriculum, not teaching children to hide things from their parents. Makes me wonder what else she's teaching her students and telling them to hide from their parents.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:39 PM
reply to post by chise61

"How do you know this to be a fact ?"

This is the right question to ask, imo. A child drawing a picture of the flag is not "desecrating" the flag, which is common knowledge & obvious over decades of flag renditions/ interpretations.
It does seem that "but it is desecrating the flag" is a talking point of some kind. Rather like "but car insurance is mandatory". These can be debunked till the cows come home, but it is programmed & will continue, regardless.
It is up to the people in California to get this teacher- & those like her (the one who sent the kids home because of their t shirts) out of the school system. It is unethical & improper for teachers to express & promote a political bias.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:42 PM
reply to post by chise61

In New Jersey there has been some divisive changes going on with Cris Christi and his attempt to cut back on spending, and it all centered in on a spending freeze for salary increases of teachers. Christi encouraged voters to vote down the budget for the school districts of those who didn't agree to the spend freeze.

The teachers on both sides (those that are for and against) have been using the students to petition the parents, telling them lies and wasting time in school to talk about it instead of actually teaching anything.

posted on May, 11 2010 @ 12:51 PM
O! say can you see by the dawn's early light,
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming,
Whose broad stripes and bright stars through the perilous fight,
O'er the ramparts we watched, were so gallantly streaming?
And the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there;
O! say does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

On the shore, dimly seen through the mists of the deep,
Where the foe's haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o'er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning's first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines in the stream:
'Tis the star-spangled banner, O! long may it wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion,
A home and a country should leave us no more!
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps' pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave:
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

O! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved home and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heav'n rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

(unofficial 5th stanza added by Oliver Wendell Holmes at start of Civil War)
When our land is illumined with liberty's smile,
If a foe from within strikes a blow at her glory,
Down, down with the traitor that tries to defile
The flag of the stars, and the page of her story!
By the millions unchained,
Who their birthright have gained
We will keep her bright blazon forever unstained;
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave,
While the land of the free is the home of the brave.

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