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Church tax? Welfare?

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posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:13 PM
I got an idea. I'm a Christian so I will probably get some backlash from other Christians on this one. It's my personal belief that the Church should be taking care of the nations welfare not the gov.

What if:

We create a Church tax that would cover government ran agencies such as the welfare administration, Social security Administration and the Department of family and children services.

*Edit add: However this fund could not be tapped for any other reason.

This tax system would be spread evenly through every religion based in the U.S.

What do you think guys and gals.

[edit on 10-5-2010 by Loken68]

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:22 PM
reply to post by Loken68

Ummm, you are a Christian?

Explain to me than the discrepancy between forced charity and ACTUAL charity.

Socialism by taxation is socialism.

Charity by giving is charity.

As for the old lock box, what the hell. You are going to put the key in who's hand?

You need to think through what you just postulated. Take taxation from the government and then place it into the Church. Tell me, is this a sneaky trick to place the burden of the ire on the Church and remove it from the government?

Also, what RIGHT does any Church have to be part of government?

I just cannot understand your thought process on this.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:30 PM
reply to post by endisnighe

Whoa nellie, I'm not saying the Church belongs in the gov. or that gov belongs in the church. In the beginning of this nation the church handled the welfare of the citizens. Until the gov. usurped that authority to use it for control.

I'm not trying to start a debate here but it will probably go that way. I'm just saying the church should play a part in welfare.

When I say church I'm not just pointing out one religion, they would all have to play a part.

All I am trying here is to get some Ideas and thoughts.
And I don't have all the answers......thus the post.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:38 PM
reply to post by Loken68

Churches already play the part of helping the poor. Most churches have food pantries, donate clothing, money, education, etc for the poor.

Who are you going to tax? People who go to church or are you going to tax everyone and give it to the churches to help the poor.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:47 PM

Originally posted by CowPatty
reply to post by Loken68

Churches already play the part of helping the poor. Most churches have food pantries, donate clothing, money, education, etc for the poor.

Who are you going to tax? People who go to church or are you going to tax everyone and give it to the churches to help the poor.

I agree they are. And I understand some Churches do missionaries, have feed the starving programs all over the world. But Churches tend to be biased to who they help. Most of the time it's people who come seeking help or someone who knows someone who needs help.

Back in the day Ministers actually went out to everyone's home and checked on them. Not just to swell the number's but to "check" on them.

Again I am seeking answers not debate on this subject.

I sort of got the idea that im breaking the 11th commandment

"Thou shalt not tempt thy neighbor's pocket book into helping the poor"

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:48 PM
I feel i am already spending enough of my money on taxes for a bloated system that does not work. I don't need to spend more money on a "church tax", especially since the WHO is about to nail the entire world for taxes. when is enough enough?


[edit on 10-5-2010 by Druidae]

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:51 PM
I think it would be a bad idea to tax any church. When a person pays taxes, they are paying for the government but more importantly it also complete part of a social contract, and most people who pay taxes are entitled to be involved in the body politic, and thus if you started to have the government tax churches, even for the best of intentions, means that you would have to give some political authority and power to that church.
But there is one other small detail about such that has come out recently with all of the different issues that are showing up, is that most churches have strong political opinions, some good, some not so good, and they would demand the right and ability to determine who could and could not recieve aid from the taxes that they would be giving up.
I remember volunteering at a soup kitchen many years ago, ran by a church. I asked a question, as to if they were applying to get federal aid to assist in their endevore, and the response was no. Now I was confused, but the minister explained to me that the amount of red tape and rules that would be a nightmare. The other part is that how do you determine a churchs value or how much money to tax, with a mind to remain fair and equal to all involved? Some are independant and others are a large world spanning groups. Some take in a large amount of money and others take in very little just paying for the upkeep of the grounds.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:55 PM
"Obama Defends Push to Cut Tax Deductions for Charitable Gifts"

Thursday, March 26, 2009

President Obama defends his proposal to cut the tax deductions that wealthy Americans can claim for their charitable donations by arguing that the shift would not have an adverse effect on giving, but two independent analyses concluded that the proposal could result in a drop of as much as $3.87 billion for the already reeling nonprofit sector....

Too bad this administration wants to do things that limit efforts at charitable giving. They would rather have everyone dependent on the government.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:55 PM
reply to post by Loken68

LOL, well if you made a bunch of atheists pay taxes to the churches so that the churches could come to their house every day and "check" on them then you got my vote. That would be hilarious. I once voted for Bill Clinton just because I enjoyed the way he lied so well. I still crack up everytime the man does the fake choked up bit. That man brings me deep joy.

[edit on 10-5-2010 by CowPatty]

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:58 PM
reply to post by Loken68

Fair enough. The Church of many religions ask the parishioners for a specific percentage of their income. It is already done this way. The Churches turn around and use this as the funds for charity and other purposes.

The big word in that last part is ASK for donations.

That is the difference between taxation and charity. One is done at the end of the barrel of a gun and the other is not.

I see somewhat where you are coming from but still. Not seeing the point. The US government can takeaway tax exemption status from Churches if the Churches do not follow the intended purposes the government wants to be shown.

The government has become the evil tyrannical entity we have always been warned about.

Church or spirituality is IN the individual, not the collective. This is where I think all the problems are coming from. We are all part of him/her or whatever. Charity starts and ends with the individual. I cannot afford to provide funds but I provide my time and expertise in construction to help Churches and others by donating my time.

Doctors and others in the past have done the same thing. The whole problem with taxation for the purpose of redistribution has caused the whole inability of those that WANT to be charitable, not be able to.

The time it takes to feed one-selves needs and to supply the government with their slice of the pie has led us to where we are now.

“Render unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s, and unto God the things that are God’s”

Caesar has become a bellowing ass and it is time to stop Caesar.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 07:59 PM
reply to post by sdcigarpig

Thanks for the reply. That's what I was looking for.

I know some of the larger churches make campaign donation's. I'm really shocked that hasn't came under more fire than it has.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 08:06 PM
reply to post by endisnighe

Great post thanks. And I agree.

posted on May, 10 2010 @ 08:41 PM
Most churches don't become politically active for fear of losing tax exempt status... go ahead and tax churches. Then you've just opened the door to thousands of politically active local and national PACs... they got nuthin' to lose.

Just what ya' need, a national fundamentalist PAC that stretches from Cali to NC.. maybe merge the Methodists and the Baptists, throw in the Church of God.

Yup, go ahead and tax us.

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