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Common Ground - Making a List of Shared Views

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posted on May, 10 2010 @ 02:24 PM
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It seems to be the "thing" on this board to come here to either pick a fight or participate in one, on a plethora of subjects that have polarizing positions. (Guilty as charged) From socialism vs capitalism, republican vs democrat, rich vs poor, most people here see things from opposite ends of the spectrum with little shared views. But I know shared views exist.

I am willing for the sake of sanity, humanity and without vanity, to admit I share common ground with some of my more extreme foes on this site, even though I've tried to hide it. Today I am coming clean and invite you to do the same. This thread is all about ways we see eye to eye. This might be the only one, so let's not muck this one up. If you are looking for confrontation, debate or disputes, please try the other six billion of those threads.

I encourage you to state your own common ground position without the use of such words as but, however, in spite of, even though, etc. Just the pure, unaltered, unbiased tiny islands of mutual views you occupy with people of opposite opinions.

I will start.....

I believe our government is too inflated with unnecessary programs that could be eliminated.

I don't like people that use and abuse social programs that hurts the ones that need them.

I do not like the thought of abortions.

I would like some intelligent people to find out the exact accounting practices of the Federal Reserve.

I love firearms.

Having everyone getting paid the same or having all their needs provided by a central government would stifle innovation in new technologies, discourage people from improvement and make life dull.

Obama has been a disappointment to me so far.


Whew! That wasn't so bad. In fact I feel a bit better. I could have named a lot more, but I wanted you to give it a go. Perhaps we will find that, though we come from different viewpoints, we are concerned with some of the same problems.

Maybe the solutions to some of theses problems could be solved by first arriving at the same starting point and working together from there.

I look forward to hearing your truthful, non partisan, sane admissions of same positions.




posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:07 PM
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reply to post by 12GaugePermissionSlip
 



I wonder how many people here are aware that ATS has joined the socialists/ communists' list of sociology labs. I would refer you to several works, OP. I hope others will have their own resources to add.
Maybe you will find what you are looking for in this reading list.

Leading Through Conflict: How Successful Leaders Transform Differences into Opportunities

A House Divided

Choice of Heroes

Leaders Beyond Borders How to Live- And Lead - In Times of Conflict

Leadership is Global : Co-Creating a More Humane and Sustainable World

LIDERAZGO ANTE LA ADVERSIDAD

Global Citizens

On Rumors: How Falsehoods Spread, Why We Believe Them, What Can Be Done

Laws of Fear: Beyond The Precautionary Principle

Animal Rights: current debates and new directions


And here are a couple of resources for my forummates.

stopsunstein.com (about mind control, manipulation & exploitation in the Obama administration)

humanewatch.org (the TRUTH about the Humane Society & PETA. or How people are killing the animals they think they are helping)



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:24 PM
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I'm not so sure I need to come clean as most people already know most of my positions.

Social

*Legalize prostitution, gambling, drugs, extra-marital sex, marijuana, and porn.

*Basically government should not be involved in social/moral issues. PERIOD!

Foreign policy

*End free trade, replace it with fair trade.
*Close all international military bases, and bring our troops home.
*Eliminate the military and replace it with a voluntary National Guard.
*Leave all international organizations except the UN and International Court.
*Force a change of the UN where we have 2 representatives for each country and make it democratic. If our country wants to pass any UN resolutions it should be put to a referendum.
*Create a Non-interventionist foreign policy.

Economics

*Stricter regulations on companies, banks and wall street(not small businesses).
*Nationalize essential things such as electricity, water, home heating oil, transportation, and health care.
*Break up big business and give strong incentives for small business.
*Expand the welfare state to include maternity leave, paternity leave, childcare, pre-k, college, social security, and housing assistance.
*Increase corporate tax to 50%, increase payroll tax to 35%, impliment a national VAT of 20%, and lower the income tax to 0 - 25%.

[edit on 5/10/10 by Misoir]

[edit on 5/10/10 by Misoir]



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:26 PM
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That is very informative Dogs. Do you have anything you would like to state? Like an opinion you share with someone of the opposite political spectrum?




Maybe you will find what you are looking for in this reading list.


What I am looking for is people on this site, this board, to realize, beyond all the bickering about right vs left, tax structures, and political ideologies, we CAN name things we agree on. So will anyone else have the courage to take off their party's hat, and name some?

[edit on 10-5-2010 by 12GaugePermissionSlip]



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:30 PM
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Originally posted by Misoir
I'm not so sure I need to come clean as most people already know most of my positions.

Social

*Legalize prostitution, gambling, drugs, extra-marital sex, marijuana, and porn.

*Basically government should not be involved in social/moral issues. PERIOD!

Foreign policy

*End free trade, replace it with fair trade.
*Close all international military bases, and bring our troops home.
*Eliminate the military and replace it with a voluntary National Guard.
*Leave all international organizations except the UN and International Court.
*Force a change of the UN where we have 2 representatives for each country and make it democratic. If our country wants to pass any UN resolutions it should be put to a referendum.
*Create a Non-interventionist foreign policy.
*End all immigration from non-western countries.

Economics

*Stricter regulations on companies, banks and wall street(not small businesses).
*Nationalize essential things such as electricity, water, home heating oil, transportation, and health care.
*Break up big business and give strong incentives for small business.
*Expand the welfare state to include maternity leave, paternity leave, childcare, pre-k, college, social security, and housing assistance.
*Increase corporate tax to 50%, increase payroll tax to 35%, impliment a national VAT of 20%, and lower the income tax to 0 - 25%.

[edit on 5/10/10 by Misoir]


Remove the banning of non-western immigrants and I'm pretty much for this.



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by Misoir
 


Two replies and neither have participated in the threads purpose. This is going pretty bad thus far. Misoir, your ideas are an invitation to debate. I would really like to see this thread take a different path.

Can either of you name a position you share with your political polar opposites?



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:33 PM
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Originally posted by 12GaugePermissionSlip
That is very informative Dogs. Do you have anything you would like to state? Like an opinion you share with someone of the opposite political spectrum?


The very nature of politics is not about synergy. It's about ego and ignorant "my team" thinking.

Thats what politics is these days.

It really is a fruitless dream to try and force someone to say "I can't stand your line of thinking but i agree with you here"

Thats why I choose not to label myself republican OR democrat OR Green, libertarian, etc etc etc

Because no matter how "independent" they all claim to be, they all still make claim to a "team" of people who are "More right" than everyone else.

But, to answer your question in the OP (i think)

I side with Republicans, for the most part (Except for AZ) where illegal immigration is concerned

I side with Democrats (for the most part) where Abortion is concerned.

I side with republicans, for the most part, for the right to own firearms

and I side with democrats, for the most part, where big business regulation comes into play.


See? Pretty boring stuff.

Thats why the knuckle draggers get TV shows to divide people into two groups.

You either believe EVERYTHING your group says and does, or you don't belong.

I say to hell with all of them. Do your own thing.



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:34 PM
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reply to post by SpectreDC
 


All done. That's an issue I don't care too much for or against.



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:42 PM
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global.
oil is everyones, not americas.
we shouldn't be in middle eastern countries.
eu is bad for the countries and it's people.
the UN should be more strick with its laws and sanctions so if you break the rules once your out on your own... no more illegal wars.
nuclear reduction should me mandatory not just something to prove your leading the way for the world.

economy.
no bailouts period!
horded wealth is useles, use it.

science.
spend more money and resources on science and development now before theres too little to spend.

education.
keep modern politics out of schools, keep the history.



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:43 PM
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reply to post by Snarf
 





I side with Republicans, for the most part (Except for AZ) where illegal immigration is concerned I side with Democrats (for the most part) where Abortion is concerned. I side with republicans, for the most part, for the right to own firearms and I side with democrats, for the most part, where big business regulation comes into play.


There now. Thank you for you honesty. Now you may go and fight with everyone on other threads from which you came.


Back to the slaughter!!!



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 03:53 PM
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Originally posted by 12GaugePermissionSlip
reply to post by Misoir
 


Two replies and neither have participated in the threads purpose. This is going pretty bad thus far. Misoir, your ideas are an invitation to debate. I would really like to see this thread take a different path.

Can either of you name a position you share with your political polar opposites?


I'll give it a try.


I support lowering income taxes.
I support capitalism.
I support a tough immigration policy and guards on our border.
I support entrenuership.
I support states' rights.
I support gun rights.

That's all I can think of. I hope that's what you wanted.



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 09:27 PM
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reply to post by 12GaugePermissionSlip
 


Preliminary disclaimer: I do not claim any political affiliation nor do I claim to believe political parties have any core values defining them. The Dems and Reps are just two companies in the same business of competing for the same dollars. They sell what legislation says and who it affects to the highest bidder. They are just private contractors in public office.

None the less, I will give it a try:

1. I believe a government of/by/for the people is a good thing. Hopefully we can get back to it one day.
2. I believe in the right to bear firearms. I believe in enforcement of our existing firearm laws to protect the public and gun owners.
3. I believe we should enforce our immigration laws. However, I do not support harassment/racism against any one bunch of people, citizens or not.
4. I believe Americans should have to pass a Civics Literacy/Current Events Exam before being allowed to vote.
5. I believe the Public School system needs to be overhauled. Currently it is under staffed and providing too weak a product.
6. I believe in mandatory public service for all Americans.
7. I think the idea of competition in business is sound. Conversely, I believe the pure object of competition is to win. In business this leads to reduction/elimination of competition. So it works great at the micro level, I am not sure once businesses become too large (e.g. Goldman Sachs, Wal Mart, etc).
8. I agree that the bailouts suck.
9. I think we need to get out of the cosigner for Israel business.

And finally I support eliminating the prison system. Instead we need to fence off giant portions of our wild lands where large, native and endangered predators can roam free. Then we take those who have committed heinous crimes....

...oh well, you get the idea.

How's that?


[edit on 10-5-2010 by ABNARTY]



posted on May, 10 2010 @ 11:39 PM
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I tend to look through the prism of the Constitution.

Socio/economic:

End prohibition, abolish DEA, abolish BATFE, abolish DHS, abolish IRS, abolish Federal Reserve, abolish FDA, FHA, HHS, Dept. Of Education, energy and 50% of the military foreign budget and all foreign "aid".

Use savings to do things that actually help people, like infrastructure, science and tech, defense.

Let the states deal with their own HCR initiatives.

Phase out social security and Medicare.

Regulate Wall St. By ACTUALLY enforcing fraud laws and truly enforcing legal contracts. This has yet to happen two #ing years into this mess. Glass-Steagall needs to come back. 14 pages and it did it's job for 70 Years. Trust me if the handcuffs come out Wall St. will shape up.

Leave welfare to the states. Leave most economic regulation to the states Except where interstate commerce is affected.

There's a whole lot more but I think you get my drift.



posted on May, 11 2010 @ 03:03 AM
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Originally posted by 12GaugePermissionSlip
I believe our government is too inflated with unnecessary programs that could be eliminated.


I believe in supporting smarter government, not smaller. I think some of the military spending is the only unnecessary programs we have in this country.


I don't like people that use and abuse social programs that hurts the ones that need them.


I share this view.


I do not like the thought of abortions.


In the real world you have to think about a lot of things. Even if they're icky or scary.


I would like some intelligent people to find out the exact accounting practices of the Federal Reserve.


I'm not keen on economics so I don't really have an opinion on the practices of the federal reserve.


I love firearms.


So...? I don't know anyone who wants to take your guns.


Having everyone getting paid the same or having all their needs provided by a central government would stifle innovation in new technologies, discourage people from improvement and make life dull.


Smarter government, not smaller.


Obama has been a disappointment to me so far.


I'm pretty sure I'm going to vote for him again. Off the top of my head I can't think of one decision I disagree with...maybe the announcement for more off-shore drilling just before the recent oil spill. Hopefully that's dead in the water. No pun intended.

I like to think I have a pretty good understanding of why some people think the way they do. I'm fortunate to not hear a lot of generalizing about my opinions though.



posted on May, 11 2010 @ 08:47 AM
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Originally posted by 12GaugePermissionSlip


There now. Thank you for you honesty. Now you may go and fight with everyone on other threads from which you came.


Back to the slaughter!!!


Now...how do you go from asking for common grounds and shared views, to being critical of someone when they answer your questions?

Just more proof of what i said, i suppose.



posted on May, 11 2010 @ 08:51 AM
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This experiment sucked. Thanks to the members that participated, the rest of yall suck. Don't write anything I disagree with, or you're getting slammed. No....screw you guys, I'm going home.

I wish there was a way to delete this stupid thread.



posted on May, 11 2010 @ 08:56 AM
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reply to post by 12GaugePermissionSlip
 


And there you have it. It only took one post for the labels and polarization to rear its ugly and obstructionist head. That is why there can be no 'common ground'. Why 'the People' have no chance whatsoever. And why TPTB have won withuot a fight. Because vast numbers of people would rather drink koolaide from a firehose and watch the whole thing go down the hole just as long as 'their side' wins.



posted on May, 11 2010 @ 08:57 AM
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Originally posted by 12GaugePermissionSlip
This experiment sucked. Thanks to the members that participated, the rest of yall suck. Don't write anything I disagree with, or you're getting slammed. No....screw you guys, I'm going home.

I wish there was a way to delete this stupid thread.


no dude.

This is one of the few genuine attempts to bring together the people of ats to see if we can hash something out.

Keep it going, the experiment is worth it.

[edit on 11-5-2010 by projectvxn]



posted on May, 11 2010 @ 11:02 AM
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reply to post by 12GaugePermissionSlip
 


you gave in and showed us your true colors too easily man.

Nobody here was even flaming you. They were just disagreeing with you, and you went off on a child like temper tantrum.

Outbursts like yours are one of many reasons people can't get along in politics.

You cry for "common ground" as long as it's common ground on YOUR terms.

Otherwise, it's just "Screw everyone, im outie"

You need much thicker skin.

[edit on 11-5-2010 by Snarf]



posted on May, 11 2010 @ 03:12 PM
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reply to post by Snarf
 





you gave in and showed us your true colors too easily man.


I agree. I am almost out of political patience. Who would have thought it would be me, the OP, caving in. Sad.




Nobody here was even flaming you. They were just disagreeing with you, and you went off on a child like temper tantrum.


You're right again. Where's my passie?




Outbursts like yours are one of many reasons people can't get along in politics.


And the fact that the divide has become soooooo wide these days. At one time Christian Fundamentalist had some liberal views. Now they are so die hard right it contradicts Jesus' teachings of love thy neighbor and stuff.




You cry for "common ground" as long as it's common ground on YOUR terms.


I was merely trying to set some boundaries to keep things on track. But, like a stinky fart, it went out the window.




Otherwise, it's just "Screw everyone, im outie"


I was half way kidding, you know?




You need much thicker skin.


I guess a did get a little disappointed that everybody and their brother didn't respond to this thread when we need this type of discourse around here so bad.

I do still wish I could delete this thread and let somebody else that is more intelligent start one like it. I really don't think I conveyed my idea good enough.



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