Unusual Apollo pics, video and transcripts, page 3
Pages: <<  1    2    3    4    5    6  >>
ATS Members have flagged this thread 8 times


reply posted on 12-5-2010 @ 12:42 PM by wmd_2008
reply to post by ppk55



So are the shadows the right way round on this picture ppk55 you really need to learn more about PHOTOGRAPHY AND EXPOSURE dont you


reply posted on 12-5-2010 @ 03:09 PM by Saint Exupery
Hi PPK,

Sorry I can't post often or at length - I've got a 2-year old who has earned the nickname "A-Bomb". He keeps me busy.

Re: Retouching, I'm sure you realize that virtually every photo you have ever seen in a magazine or newspaper or textbook has been altered somehow. Usually it has been cropped to center and/or isolate the desired subject of the image.

Among the Apollo pictures, the most famous is, of course, AS11-40-5903.
here it is on the Wikipedia page (and, in case you were wondering, I have seen identical version in official NASA publications and websites). When you compare it to a less-adjusted version, you can see why it needed work: the image is tilted and so badly framed that it cut-off the top of Aldrin's PLSS, including the antenna. We almost lost the top of the helmet, which would have ruined the shot, from a standpoint of aesthetic appeal. Notice that in addition to rotating the image and centering on Aldrin, the Wiki photo has also added black "sky" to the top of the image to aesthetically improve the centering, and also airbrushed-out the reseau crosshairs.

Does this mean that AS11-40-5903 is "fake"? Of course not. It is an authentic document of an historical event. It has simply been altered to remove distracting imperfections. Come to think of it, I'll bet this image has had less work done than your average Playboy centerfold.

Since you ask about the sky, it's pretty easy to see that a uniform black is going to show any and every bit of dust or lint on the scanner when converted to digital form. I have seen Apollo scans that do show specks, and I always find myself thinking, "Whoa, dirty scanner. Why didn't they get rid of that? Lazy archivist..."

I do know of one archive that has uncorrected scans. Because it hasn't had the contrast & color adjusted, they look kind of washed-out, and any scanning imperfections are still there. The good news is that you can request downloads of the highest-resolution scans available of NASA images.

Gotta chase A-Bomb. Later!



reply posted on 12-5-2010 @ 05:52 PM by ArMaP
Originally posted by ppk55
spaceflight.nasa.gov...
history.nasa.gov...

And yes, I checked the image on history.nasa.gov ..
and it appears the same.

They are not the same.

This is the photo from the Spaceflight site, resized to fit the thread.



This is the photo from the History site, resized to fit the thread.



And I don't see anything strange in the photo.

PS: I think that using the replace colour command gives a more precise way of adjusting the image.

PPS: and here is that Real Media video, converted to Flash video.

(click to open player in new window)


What you call the "siren" sounds like a problem with the transmission.


reply posted on 13-5-2010 @ 07:43 AM by ppk55
reply to post by ArMaP



You're right ArMaP, the 2nd image appears as you posted.
I must have selected the same file when importing into photoshop.
My mistake and apologies. The 1st photo has still be altered though and it's on a NASA site.

What worries me with all this is, if one image is questionable, then how do we know which is correct ?

My original post was about the flag in this image. To me the bottom of it looks photoshopped.



This is from a high res image at
eol.jsc.nasa.gov... (you can't directly download, you have to submit a request, then it gives you a link)

While I'm at it ... I've tried and tried to work this one out from Apollo 15. I must be missing something, but for the life of me, I can't work out how
there are no rover tracks between the wheels in this image.

Didn't the rover have to either drive forward, or in reverse to get there ?
Either way there'd have to be tracks.
This is prep for EVA2 so they must have parked it there after EVA1.



There's no wind to blow dust over the tracks ... so ?
edit: source history.nasa.gov...

Here it is with more contrast



[edit on 13-5-2010 by ppk55]


reply posted on 13-5-2010 @ 08:07 AM by Exuberant1
reply to post by ppk55



It looks like the tracks have been obscured by bootprints.

Sorry mate, but this is not a good example of the missing buggy tracks phenomena.


reply posted on 13-5-2010 @ 08:59 AM by -PLB-
reply to post by ppk55



Are you suggesting this must have been in a studio because in a studio vehicles don't leave tracks? About the Photoshopping, Photoshop or similar software didn't exist yet when the landings happened. So any image retouching must have happened recently. You just need to find a source from before the existence of photo editing software. Maybe in a library.


reply posted on 13-5-2010 @ 10:22 AM by DJW001
reply to post by ppk55



First of all, the picture has been cropped, as usual. I guess if NASA tweaks a photo it's a horrible crime, but if an "Apollo Debunker" alters a photo, it's okay. You'll notice that the sun is directly behind the photographer and the tracks are at a right angle... this means that the tracks are obscuring their own shadow. (In other words, the shadow of the track walls lie inside the track.) The ground is also a bit over-exposed and washed out.


reply posted on 13-5-2010 @ 10:29 AM by ppk55
Originally posted by -PLB-
reply to
post by ppk55

Are you suggesting this must have been in a studio because in a studio vehicles don't leave tracks?


I'm just saying, it's strange there's no trace of tracks between the wheels regardless of a few footprints. Try getting that result with your car on the sand.

One more Apollo 16 image which has bugged me for ages.

1. The wires look like they are anchored into the dirt
2. There's an object way down the back with no shadow
3. The big shadow in the foreground looks wrong for the object casting it.





There's a higher res version of the whole pic here which you really need to look at to see the details with the wires and the anchor points.

i1028.photobucket.com...

source: history.nasa.gov...


reply posted on 13-5-2010 @ 11:41 AM by -PLB-
reply to post by ppk55



So what are you trying to prove then? Those shadows would not be possible on the moon, but would be possible in a studio? About those wires, they just sank a bit in the loose soil.


reply posted on 16-5-2010 @ 11:00 PM by Saint Exupery
Originally posted by ppk55
What worries me with all this is, if one image is questionable, then how do we know which is correct ?


What do you mean by "questionable"? The whole point of my previous post was that just because a photo is altered, that doesn't make it "fake". Aesthetic corrections are very, very common.

Originally posted by ppk55
My original post was about the flag in this image. To me the bottom of it looks photoshopped.


I'm not sure I'm following you on this one. Is it because of the tool on the back of the rover that seems to be sticking-up in front of the flag? If you look at the previous photo (
AS17-134-20381), which was taken from a slightly different angle, you can see that the sunlight on the flag wrinkles is the same.



The illusion in 20382 is just a coincidence caused when the vertical elements lined-up.

Perhaps you are referring to the startling depth-of-field? This not only looks odd in 2-dimensional photos, it also threw-off the astronauts while they were there. In a nutshell, we tend to judge distances based on reference objects of an approximately known size (such as a house on a hillside). On the Moon, there are no such reference objects; a boulder 1-meter high at 100m looks like a 10-meter boulder at 1000m. Also, here on Earth the atmosphere subtly washes-out objects in direct proportion to its distance:



On the Moon, you don't get this effect, so like you see in AS17-134-2082 and others, each succeeding rise of the rolling terrain looks just as clear as all of the closer ones.

Here is my favorite illustration of the distance phenomenon. In this Apollo 16 clip, John Young & Charlie Duke are working in front of a large boulder. Guess how big the boulder is? At ~2:00, they start loping towards it:

Really crappy RealVideo link



[edit on 16-5-2010 by Saint Exupery]


reply posted on 17-5-2010 @ 03:23 AM by jra
reply to post by Saint Exupery



I can't view the realvideo link at the moment, but is it a video of "House rock"? If so, here's a youtube version.



It's a really neat clip though. I recall reading about many situations where the astronauts had a hard time judging the distance of various things.


reply posted on 17-5-2010 @ 05:30 AM by Saint Exupery
reply to post by jra



Yes, that's it - and your video is much clearer than mine, which is from ALSJ.
Pages: <<  1    2    3    4    5    6  >>    ^^TOP^^