What's wrong with education in the US? Why is it that American students do so poorly? I know that most teachers work hard to teach, but why do so few students have a desire to learn? Can anything be done about this, or will this continue to be the way it is until politics gets out of education and our culture changes?

Centralization of schools, dependence on others (especially parents)...There also seems to be a general laziness regarding school in general, maybe something taken from a lifestyle of a parent and extended towards schooling. There is no emphasis put on the education system, students don't feel like they are special. Maybe the wrongs things are being taught in our school system, without an emphasis on what really matters. Maybe students get too bored in school, and don't find anything interesting and too slow of a pace. Its easy for students to coast through high school and receive a different job.

I don't think any of these students are stupid, I just think they are ignorant with a refusal to learn. I primarily think we are leaving the right education in the wrong hands.

Everything they teach in public school is a lie. They want us to fail. The dumber the population , the easier they are to control. Why do you think teachers are paid so poorly? Because they themselves are not qualified to teach? My biggest problem in school was that I knew that there was nothing that they could ever teach me, and they hate that. My own principal told me in seventh grade that I scored higher on the Ottis Lennen test than any other student in the state. Teachers are also required to take this exam. I scored higher than any of my teachers as well. True story.


Nutzo

Reform the current state of affairs where the local Board of Education is under the direction of NON-educational professionals and is more, in so many ways a breading ground for aspiring politicians. Put Professional Educators in charge to make all educational decisions and reporting to a State agency whose make up is decided by and composed of the recognized leader in the field drawn from the state’s University system. Take politics out of the equation.

This system fails in providing for the needs of students for two major reasons:

1. It places in control those with no professional experience in education or learning theory;
2. It also indirectly encourages an environment where the education needs of students are secondary to those in decision making authority; and also subject to the political machinations of an electorate even less schooled in educational matters then those chosen to lead. And often characterized by “When I was in school….. (fill in some form of stupidity)…..!

So with the more, the less educated, maintain their need for control over the local schools the product one gets is reflective of those who are controlling the process.

Dumb in = Dumb out…

………………ANY QUESTIONS?


[edit on 6-6-2004 by gmcnulty]

Well I thought school was crap the only classes that I did enjoy was History/Economics/and Politics.... Why? Because thats real world stuff, something that affects our lives.. I was good at accounting too...Other than that I really had no desire to learn anything

Through most of High School I was a straight A student, but I really hated it....

Reform is one I can agree on.
Allow teachers to really teach, instead of just being 'preparers' of and for the SOL's. In other words, allow teachers to teach to the students verses teaching to the SOL's.



seekerof

Originally posted by Thatoneguy
Well I thought school was crap the only classes that I did enjoy was History/Economics/and Politics.... Why? Because thats real world stuff, something that affects our lives...

I loved those classes too! But you didn't like Science? Science effects our day-to-day lives just as much as politics and economics does.

Also, if the government wants us to fail and be dumb, why bother spending the money to have schools at all? Why not just drop the government education program and announce that everyone is on their own from now on?

SOL – Which one did you mean?
SOL stands for as far as I know:
• Office of the Solicitor (US Department of Labor)
• Sadly Outta Luck (polite form)
• Satellite Of Love
• Saudi On Line
• Scandinavia Online
• Scotland Online
• Seafarer's Open Learning System
• Second-Order Closed Loop
• Secretary of Labor
• Semantic Operating Language
• Sequence Order List
• Shadows of Luclin (Everquest expansion)
• Shazzam - Outta Luck (Gomer Pyle polite form)
• Shipowner's Liability
• Shoot-Out Loss
• Short On Landing
• Short on Luck
• Shout Out Loud (internet chat)
• Simply Out of Luck (polite form)
• Simulation Oriented Language
• Small Out-Line Integrated Circuit
• Smile Out Loud
• Sobbing Out Loud
• Society for Organizational Learning
• Solenoid
• Solicitation
• Solomon Airlines (ICAO code)
• Solution
• Sons of Liberty
• Sooner Or Later
• Sorta Outta Luck
• Soul of Lineage (game)
• Space-Occupying Lesion (medical)
• Speed of Light
• Standard of Living
• Standards Of Leadership
• Standards Of Learning
• Standards of Law
• Start of Life
• Static on Line
• Statute of Limitations
• Statute of Limitations (legal term)
• Stoppages of Off & Leave
• Stricken Off Leave (legal)
• Stuff Outta Luck (polite form)
• Subculture of Live (fan club for the band Live)
• SuperOnline (ISP)
• System Off Line

I figured that 'SOL' meant a standardized test of some kind. Every state in the U.S. has their own standardized test; the one in Texas, for example, is called the TAKS...

Some science did interest me yes... But not chemistry! That class sucked... Biology was sorta cool, Astronomy would have been KICK A## but we never studied that at all.... Not even in general science classes

The one class I did enjoy in high school was Astrophysics. I guess since this field is highly disputed, they were able to teach a lot of different theories about the nature of the universe. I think a lot of classes are similar in that perspective in that they are theory, but they really don't let on to that fact. A lot of classes just seem like they are trying to keep you in the box and leave many questions unanswered. By the way, I think the SOLs are either the Saudi Online or Scandinavia Online. THose guys are always tryin to mess up the US education system.

dang I remember the TAAS in texas..... After I graduated they changed it to TAKS.... Perhaps Standardized Testing proves nothing?

That seemed to be the goal of the school was to improve their scores on the TAAS test so that was stressed pretty hard.. i think it was a contest and thats all the schools want.. higer scores so they can get more money...

One of the mandates for control in the Prussian educational system was Grades K through 12. It keeps kids under one authority figure who exercises all influence over a certain age grouping.

In a one room schoolhouse, kids are not immediately alienated from one another by one year increments. An eight year old kid could help a 7 year old in studies and receive a refinement of his education from other older students.

One of the reasons for this deliberate alienation has to do with the process we may call "divide and conquer." The management of students, boxing of students into categories, and subjugation yields alienation and basic production of docile factory workers who will not get too deep into Nietze and Kant and produce labor unions, nor any philosophy.

College students cannot pass an eighth grade test of the early 20th century without some months of preparation.

Current extensions of this authoritarian educational system keep people bound to testing systems, giving the "right answers," under duress of funding. Just as "torture," gives the "right answers," but not the true answers, just the ones the authority figure wants to hear, there is an even greater dumbing down process happening.

So you want to know what is wrong with the educational system? It is trying too many experiments, with the assumption that older tried and true ways of learning are inferior, obsolete, and/or more cynically but possibly truthfully, actually too good for the "masses."

Sadly the industrialists, who fielded control over education to suit their vision of submission, have cheated generations of students with their automaton programming and Skinnerian projections.

The real problem is authoritarianism, and orders from the top, rather than community involvement and continuous self improvement which are highly likely to be closest to the goal of real education. Time after time centralized politicians placate people with visions of local control, only to betray them into submission to mindless authority.

The solution of course is the simplicity of mastering this dumbed down nonsense, by doing your homework twice even for a brief interval, then following your own dreams within your own personal library and journal.

[edit on 7-6-2004 by SkipShipman]

theres nothing wrong with education in the us the only thing thats wrong in the us is bad parents. bad parents make bad kids. nuff said.

This makes think of a trite quote by Hillary Clinton, "It takes a village to raise a child.."
Controlling minds, thoughts, actions, beliefs

I know a girl from Texas, sure likes to talk a lot, dont know about what else she gots going for her upstairs. Jessica Simpson is another fine example of mis-educated the kids cant get. We need more vocational schools and rehab schools so those who aren't with it can find a program they can thrive or at least survive with.

Standardized dont do anything in accessing work skills. The ones with high scores are skilled for scholarly stuff like research, and you cannot forget about the cheaters. Some will even have another take the test for them.

The breakdown of family values and the cultural barrier/language/drugs/whatever else that prevents teachers from reaching the students.

my .02

I agree completely with you on this Seekerof, go figure, they should revise the SOL.

Take my son for example he is 11yrs old and very bright, however, when he was 3 he could read, write, add, and subtract. When he was evaluated for preschool they said he should have been put in 2nd or 3rd grade yet couldn't because of his age. Today he is near the top of his class, doesn't strive to learn, have thought of taking him out to home school him or look toward another alternative.

What needs to be done is to structure the education and SOL's around the student. All that would have to be done is structuring the classrooms into subjects and give them say 1 to 1.5 hours each and just have classes with students at different levels regardless of age.

Structuring the SOL like that would allow the brighter and faster learning students to push on as hard and fast as possible and at the same time be able to provide the attention and mentoring of the other students addressing the problems.

The teachers are wrong. They just cant motivate kids to learn anymore. My least favorite subject is math. I have no desire to be in there.Yet I get strait A's all the time. Now French thats my favourite subject. Usually get B's but I want to do better because I dont want to dissapoint my teacher, unlike math.

Originally posted by Vegemite
The teachers are wrong.

Well, at least in my area, being a teacher is a pretty crappy job. The less desirable a position is, the lower quality of person you'll attract, because qualified people will get better jobs. In my state, the school districts that pay the teachers more have better overall academics, regardless of the economic area that attends the school.

Additionally a societal change needs to occur to improve our educational system. For the large part, intelligence is not valued by American popular culture, and until it is, education will take a back seat.