The Son Of God? He Says He Is.

I am always concerned by the ramblings of false prophets, gurus, teachers, shamans etc, ad infinitum. People make money (and more)from gullibility and playing on people's fears, it makes me sick.

a case in point:

Sergey Anatolyevitch Torop (Russian: Сергей Анатольевич Тороп), (born January 14, 1961) known by his followers as Vissarion (Виссарион), is a Russian mystic. He founded and heads a religious movement known as the Church of the Last Testament with its head church in the Siberian Taiga in the Minusinsk Depression east of Abakan, in the southern Siberia Kuraginsk district of Krasnoyarsk territory. He has around 4,000 followers (called Vissarionites) in around thirty villages in the immediate vicinity of his base at Sun City, while having approximately 10,000 followers around the world.

en.wikipedia.org...

This man was originally a member of the red army and then a policeman, yet he has 4000 followers who have followed him to the wilderness? This is testament to the power people can exert over one another.

I am not saying this is a bad thing, yet we tend to trust people who know 'more' than we do. Maybe this man is a reincarnation of Jesus and if so, shouldn't we all be moving there?

Vissarion
gpsinsights.files.wordpress.com...
Sun City
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[edit on 5-5-2010 by Cedik]

4000 followers...............Gosh he was not a liked man then the "Son of God"



A few villages believe - Do you believe cedik?

There are going to be so many messiah's creeping out of the joints BUT, only because we as a global nation are going through HARD TIMES.......people want to cling to something be it fairy tales

Oh and what do the cons do in vunerable times, take advantage of our hopes, beliefs and religion

Beware the CONMAN of FALSE MESSIAH






[edit on 5-5-2010 by vesta]

I really, really don't like torop. He has a very strange air about him that makes me extremely uneasy. He is a bad man, trust me.

According to Vissarion he is not God incarnate, he is the WORD of God. Somehow he still calls himself an incarnation of Jesus which would usually make him the son of God by most church standards. This man had a vision which I have no reason to disbelieve, people had visions thousands of years ago, why can't they have visions now?

Here's more on him from Wikipedia;

In 1991 he was "reborn" as Vissarion, the returned Jesus Christ. In his system this does not make him God, but instead the word of God. His religion combines elements of the Russian Orthodox Church with Buddhism, apocalypticism, collectivism, and ecological values. His followers observe strict regulations, are vegans,[1] and are allowed no vices such as smoking or drinking alcohol. Money is banned. The aim of the group is to unite all religions on Earth.

Tiberkul, the settlement in the Taiga, was established in 1994 on a territory of 2.5 square kilometres, and today counts some five thousand inhabitants, largely living autochthonous and on ecological principles.

I really like the MONEY IS BANNED part!
This could become another Jonestown or Waco but I doubt it. If the people are happy and not under external control then more power to them. This is very much like how the Quakers got started.

Star and Flag

[edit on 5-5-2010 by Asktheanimals]

So much then for the miracle of turning water into wine!

Originally posted by Cedik

This man was originally a member of the red army and then a policeman

Sounds alot like the resume of Saul of Tarsus... IMHO he has just as mech credibility as any other claimed "messiah" in history

jesus never claimed to be the son of god. it was when he died when the romans and elder jews decided to declare him the son/sun of god.

so they killed jesus and hijacked his religion to suit their own agendas that still play to this day.

the bible has been rewritten to suit the zionist state of israel.

so they claim jesus is a blue eyed white male, they have that picture stuck in peoples minds, how do we know thats not what the antichrist will look like?

if the devils exists then thats how his plan might look like.

Originally posted by RizeorDie
jesus never claimed to be the son of god.

He did on a number of occasions:

"The high priest said to him, "I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God."

"Yes, it is as you say," Jesus replied." - Matthew 26:63-64

"He trusts in God. Let God rescue him now if he wants him, for he said, 'I am the Son of God.' " - Matthew 27:43

"They all asked, "Are you then the Son of God?" He replied, "You are right in saying I am." - Luke 22:70

"what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?" - John 10:36

are a few examples.

Originally posted by RizeorDie
so they claim jesus is a blue eyed white male,

Show me a claim that says Jesus is a blue eyed white male.

[edit on 5-5-2010 by saint4God]

reply to post by Cedik


I would love to start a cult, in fact a while back I was working on my own religious text. Of course mine wouldn't be the drink the Kool Aid kind but the parody other religious silliness kind.

It amazes me how serious people take certain religious beliefs, I mean when viewed from within the religion it seems your very soul is at stake but once outside looking in all the beliefs look odd and some downright silly.

When I was a kid it seemed easy to believe the stories told in Sunday school but as I grew older I began to ask a lot of questions and the stories slowly but surely broke down. Now whenever I hear someone describe a Biblical story, or any myth from any faith, as absolute truth, I just shake my head and remember a time when I was just as misguided. Maybe these elaborate fictions really do our brains some good, what would we humans be without fantasy and epic myth? I suspect we'd be huddled in a corner afraid of all the world and miserable about our own mortality. For all the benefits of religion there are also pitfalls.

Oh wait, this thread is about some cult Messiah, boy did I go off on a tangent

Cult's can be dangerous but most are harmless. Some are just money making schemes others seem to be based on people's often bizarre spiritual epiphanies.

reply to post by vesta


Hello in sunny Torquay!
I live along the coast in Southampton.

From research, it appears that he had a tight knit group of followers who were with him at the 'meeting' which heralded his movement from man to messiah. Were these people his disciples? It is possible I suppose.

Do you believe cedik?

I think that I want to believe and I do agree with many of his posterings, yet it feels odd. Why would this man want to be the son of god in the way that jesus was and even wear similar clothes? Something doesnt add up

There are going to be so many messiah's creeping out of the joints BUT, only because we as a global nation are going through HARD TIMES.......people want to cling to something be it fairy tales

This is what gets me down the most. I bet you could fill page after page of names of 'messiahs'm each with their own ideas and truths. Who should we believe, or should we set up our own messiah business?

Originally posted by Cedik
Why would this man want to be the son of god in the way that jesus was and even wear similar clothes? Something doesnt add up

Two parts. One mental:

"Medtalk A personality flaw common among physicians, especially surgeons, who perceive themselves as omniscient–ie, God-like, thus treat others as mere mortals"

McGraw-Hill Concise Dictionary of Modern Medicine. © 2002 by The McGraw-Hill Companies, Inc. - medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com...

And the other physical:

Wearing Jesus' clothes "worked for him", so the imitation should work too, yes?

"Simulation, as it is developed in those discussions, is consistently characterized as having two aspects. (1) The instrumental aspect: the simulation is a model that we purposively use to understand something that we do not understand, namely, the other person's mind. And (2) the pretense aspect: the simulation involves off-line pretend states, and has the status of the subjunctive "as if." I pretend to believe or act "as if" I were you." - metapsychology.mentalhelp.net...

Originally posted by Cedik
This is what gets me down the most. I bet you could fill page after page of names of 'messiahs'm each with their own ideas and truths. Who should we believe, or should we set up our own messiah business?

But only one died and rose again (among other unique proofs).

Aren't we all children of God? We are creations of this reality and if this reality is God, then - by that logic - we are all it's children. Boys are "sons" and girls are "daughters".

Isn't that just too simple?

Besides, kindom is here, not just everyone is able to "see" it. And most are yet to be "born" again from above.

But that was all just religious bull****. If you can't see beyond the written word, you are dead as a rock.

-v

reply to post by Arkady

I really, really don't like torop. He has a very strange air about him that makes me extremely uneasy. He is a bad man, trust me.

I couldnt agree with you more. When I look at him, it makes me want to run away..... Should the messiah make you think that.. I dont think so.

reply to post by Asktheanimals


Looking at this in a less sceptical light, I suppose you are right. I would love to have a vision and they have been well documented throughout religious texts.

One question though. If money is banned, where does it all go? Surely these people have some money when they join him in the wilderness. What do they use to aquire things they have need for?

what makes me shudder is that people will give up their own lives to follow him and others like him. If this is a good idea, then I am all for it but what if its not? are these people not wasting their time on earth?

reply to post by saint4God


artist depiction always show him as blue eyed and white. even in cartoons now its stuck to peoples minds.

he never claim he was, people modified the bible to suit thier own agenda and link Christianity with sun worship.

Originally posted by RizeorDie
artist depiction always show him as blue eyed and white. even in cartoons now its stuck to peoples minds.

Why didin't you protest the Chinese Jesus?



Or the African Jesus?



Or are they okay for some reason?

Originally posted by RizeorDie
he never claim he was, people modified the bible to suit thier own agenda and link Christianity with sun worship.

I missed the link between Christianity and sun worship, care to establish?

[edit on 6-5-2010 by saint4God]

If anyone can be so ignorant to believe in the bible and the jesus character in the first place, than why not believe this as well as ANYTHING else that is told to you all? Its all fables, myths, and legends all of which is fiction anyways. Get a grip people.

reply to post by saint4God


saint4god, because when you think of jesus a chinses or african bearded males will not come to mind, its always a white man with long brown hair and blue eyes. he was a middle eastern arab and if one thing he will look middle eastern.

christianity and sun worship.

the romans were responsible for linking Christianity and pagan religions.

He's definatly not going to be the first, or the last person who claims he is Jesus....

Originally posted by RizeorDie
saint4god, because when you think of jesus a chinses or african bearded males will not come to mind,

I guess it depends on your hood. Mine had more pictures of African Jesus than blue eyes and blonde hair. The point being is depictions were usually made in a way people could relate to. I don't know whether that's a good thing or not, but I have no issue with Christ being a different nationality than my own because who he is is so much more than the color of his skin/hair/eyes to me.

Originally posted by RizeorDie
the romans were responsible for linking Christianity and pagan religions.

I'd like to hear the connections YOU believe are true and discuss that. Seen these poorly researched videos before, none carry any new claims that have been factually unrefuted (proof: www.abovetopsecret.com... ). I've been on entire threads talking about the topic, but here it may be off-topic.

[edit on 6-5-2010 by saint4God]